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Author Topic: Shot Clock Gaining Steam  (Read 4493 times)

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Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #50 on: July 09, 2018, 10:03:08 pm »
No team can just stand there and "hold the ball" unless the defense lets it happen. It takes two to NOT tango.
How bout the shot clock whiners suck it up and play defenseĖinstead of crying for a rule change to force the other team to do what you want.

Why would a team just decide to not play defense? Who would do that whether there is or isn't a shot clock? I don't even know what you are trying to say.....

Offline Moonshiner

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #51 on: July 09, 2018, 11:17:23 pm »
A shot clock is not near as radical as what you just stated above.... Don't be so dramatic and exaggerate that impact about the change to a shot clock.

There was a lot of sarcasm there sonny.  But...think about it just a bit.  Shot clocks affect coaching strategy a lot more than the impulsive fan thinks about.  Don't take away the coaches right to make that lazy team play defense. 

Offline Moonshiner

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #52 on: July 10, 2018, 11:07:10 am »
Why would a team just decide to not play defense? Who would do that whether there is or isn't a shot clock? I don't even know what you are trying to say.....

He's trying to say that if you wan them to not play keep away, then go get the ball.  They can't stall if they don't have the basketball. 

Offline HorseFeathers

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #53 on: July 10, 2018, 11:20:56 am »
Why would a team just decide to not play defense? Who would do that whether there is or isn't a shot clock? I don't even know what you are trying to say.....

Didn't see it at the senior high level this year....But seen a JR High Girls team hold the ball at half court this year for about 5 minutes of a quarter(think they were in foul trouble or the other team was on a comeback run) and the defense never stepped out past the 3 point line...before you call either coach bad or lazy, it broke one teams momentum...and the team who didn't play defense, well their coach has 2 state title rings, a few runner ups and hasn't missed the semi finals in like 10 years(some of y'all will know who I'm talking about).

If you aren't going to guard me, and I have the lead....why should there be a rule to force me to potentially give the ball back on a bad shot selection?

Offline Oxford Cat

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #54 on: July 11, 2018, 07:46:27 am »
How many of you have heard of the Elam ending to finish games. At the four minute mark of a game the winning team would have to score 7 more points to win the game. The losing team would have to score 7 points plus the number of points they were behind eliminating the need for a clock at that point.  Probably never going to happen but would stop teams from stalling to let the clock run out when they are ahead and also stop the losing team from fouling to stop the clock in order to catch up. Seems like a wild idea but has been used experimentally in college and the NBA is studying it.

Offline Almatrackster

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #55 on: July 11, 2018, 10:29:30 am »
I donít think people realize how long 35 seconds is. It will affect very few possessions during the game. The only way it will come in to play ďusuallyĒ is at the end of the game. Teams wont be be able to hold it for the last 2 minutes up 4 and make it a foul shooting contest. Teams will actually have to play out possessions. Thatís an improvement for the game!

This should be the crutch of the pro-shot clock argument. This is about the end game mostly.


Also, this is partially about the fans. It is very noble to think high school sports should always be about the students and it is the main focus, but think about the most popular sports in Arkansas. Why are they? # of spectators.

Offline Moonshiner

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #56 on: July 11, 2018, 01:43:53 pm »
This should be the crutch of the pro-shot clock argument. This is about the end game mostly.


Also, this is partially about the fans. It is very noble to think high school sports should always be about the students and it is the main focus, but think about the most popular sports in Arkansas. Why are they? # of spectators.

Amateur athletics should be about the kids.  In my opinion.

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #57 on: July 11, 2018, 04:50:06 pm »
Amateur athletics should be about the kids.  In my opinion.

How harsh it is to make those poor, innocent kids play with a shot clock  ::) Ö. How will they survive with such a tough obstacle in their way to overcome?

Offline B.G.

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #58 on: July 11, 2018, 06:15:47 pm »
I think you would find kids would rather have a shot clock.

Offline OB11

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #59 on: July 12, 2018, 08:38:01 am »
I think you would find kids would rather have a shot clock.

Look at professional sports...pace of play is everything for all the major sports. More movement, more offense, uptempo. It will trickle down to youth sports eventually. I think the majority of players in high school would be fine with it. What's the drawback for the players? How many players do you think are fired up about stalling for minutes at a time?

Offline nuttinbuthogs

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #60 on: July 12, 2018, 12:14:47 pm »
The entire issue comes down to a coaches decision of how his tea should play. A surgeon performs surgery in a manner that he believes is best for a patients future, thus a coach makes decisions for what he believes is best for both the short term and long term success of his team.  Leave it to the coach of each team as to how they should play.

Offline SackAttack

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #61 on: July 12, 2018, 12:34:37 pm »
The entire issue comes down to a coaches decision of how his tea should play. A surgeon performs surgery in a manner that he believes is best for a patients future, thus a coach makes decisions for what he believes is best for both the short term and long term success of his team.  Leave it to the coach of each team as to how they should play.
Finally somebody that gets it! Sir we are the minority on here it seems!!

Offline gameoflife

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #62 on: July 12, 2018, 02:48:25 pm »
Rules changes should enhance the game, without taking away strategic options from a coach.

Offline Almatrackster

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #63 on: July 12, 2018, 05:19:13 pm »
Almost any rule change is going to change the strategic options for a coach. Navigating rules are part of the fundamental of strategy.

Is this about the coaches or the players?

Offline B.G.

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #64 on: July 12, 2018, 06:17:57 pm »
Shot clock just changes the strategy, focus and goals. 

It'll just be different.  I'm convinced it's going to happen within a few years in AR.

Offline gameoflife

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #65 on: July 13, 2018, 10:56:14 am »
Almost any rule change is going to change the strategic options for a coach. Navigating rules are part of the fundamental of strategy.

Is this about the coaches or the players?

Who runs the team?  The players or the coach?  It's a coaches decision!  All those strategic options are there now, you don't have to have a rule to force one of them on a coach or on a team.  Let them play their way.  And to your point, its about the kids and the coaches.  As for the kids, let them play according to how the coach determines is best for them.

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #66 on: July 13, 2018, 01:10:11 pm »
Who runs the team?  The players or the coach?  It's a coaches decision!  All those strategic options are there now, you don't have to have a rule to force one of them on a coach or on a team.  Let them play their way.  And to your point, its about the kids and the coaches.  As for the kids, let them play according to how the coach determines is best for them.

High school athletics is about the kids, period. There are too many coaches in this profession who put their egos above the kids.

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #67 on: July 13, 2018, 01:13:57 pm »
Kids read right through coaches who only view them as an object in their way to getting their career goals they want and not as genuine, human beings.... We have a couple at my old school district who think a little too highly of themselves and the funny part is neither are winning a lick currently even playing smaller schools in a blended league with their "me, me, me" coaching attitude. I don't care at all about coaches feelings when decisions are made about rules or changing the game. It's about the kids, period. I know a lot of people on this board have family members or friends in the profession of coaching and take things a little too personal and think its about the coaches! Sorry, its not. Hurting a section of coaches feelings shouldn't matter when making changes.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2018, 01:24:52 pm by beach bum »

Offline gameoflife

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #68 on: July 13, 2018, 03:14:10 pm »
High school athletics is about the kids, period. There are too many coaches in this profession who put their egos above the kids.


You are entitled to your opinion but to deny that the coaches are a factor and that coaching should be considered is not looking deeply into what is happening.  Coaches are tasked with running their programs and doing what is best for the kids and the program.  Their job is in part to produce wins and since they are judged by wins and losses it would be wrong to deny them as many options as possible.  As long as these options do not cause harm.  There is no evidence, only opinion that suggest harm to the players for executing a stall game.  Even more, the option to stall the ball in a situation where the game is in control but perhaps the team is working against foul problems is deliberately taking control of the game out of the hands of a coach and his kids.

Offline Almatrackster

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #69 on: July 13, 2018, 05:19:18 pm »
There is no evidence against shot clock ruining the game. Actually, considering the amount of leagues at all levels around the country who have a shot clock and have never got rid of it, you could argue there is quite a bit of evidence for a shot clock.

And putting a shot clock into the game puts control INTO the coaches' and kids' hands to mount a 5 point comeback with 2 minutes left without resorting to a foul fest.

Offline footballfan-tastic

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #70 on: July 14, 2018, 09:52:20 am »
There is no evidence against shot clock ruining the game. Actually, considering the amount of leagues at all levels around the country who have a shot clock and have never got rid of it, you could argue there is quite a bit of evidence for a shot clock.

And putting a shot clock into the game puts control INTO the coaches' and kids' hands to mount a 5 point comeback with 2 minutes left without resorting to a foul fest.

Don't need evidence that it will ruin the game.  The game is fine as it is, coaches coaching and players playing.  Your analysis of putting the game into their control is your opinion. They already have full control of the game and forcing a shot clock on teams that do not choose to play that style is not necessary.  I have seen numerous posts on here about playing tough defense and forcing the tempo if you have the ability to do so.  A team that has won the advantage should have the option to play slow down if they like in order to protect it.  As for others adding a shot clock, are you referring to a few high schools, I believe it is 8 total at this time, that use a 30-35 second clock.  The national federation does not allow it but individual states cannot be stopped from implementation if they so choose.  The catch is that if they do use the shot clock the state uses their seat on the NFHS basketball rules committee.   I would say as long as the National Federation is opposed it should be left as is.

Offline Almatrackster

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #71 on: July 14, 2018, 10:49:16 am »
Don't need evidence that it will ruin the game.  The game is fine as it is, coaches coaching and players playing.  Your analysis of putting the game into their control is your opinion. They already have full control of the game and forcing a shot clock on teams that do not choose to play that style is not necessary.  I have seen numerous posts on here about playing tough defense and forcing the tempo if you have the ability to do so.  A team that has won the advantage should have the option to play slow down if they like in order to protect it.  As for others adding a shot clock, are you referring to a few high schools, I believe it is 8 total at this time, that use a 30-35 second clock.  The national federation does not allow it but individual states cannot be stopped from implementation if they so choose.  The catch is that if they do use the shot clock the state uses their seat on the NFHS basketball rules committee.   I would say as long as the National Federation is opposed it should be left as is.

And yet, the game being as fine as it is, has this rule being seriously considered across the state. Many would disagree. Iíve heard wanting a shot clock in high school fo as long as I remember.

8 states currently use it with Wisconsin joining and others looking to join. No state has removed the shot clock so it seems that it was a good enough rule to implement and not remove.

We keep talking about how progressing these athletes in basketball is the most important thing, but if any student wants to play basketball at any level after high school, a shot clock will be used.

High school athletes are developmentally able to play within the rules of a shot clock, there's very little reason to not implement a reasonable shot clock, and it seems the main one is so that coaches can channel their inner Dean Smith.
« Last Edit: July 14, 2018, 10:59:03 am by Almatrackster »

Offline footballfan-tastic

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #72 on: July 14, 2018, 11:11:12 am »
And yet, the game being as fine as it is, has this rule being seriously considered across the state. Many would disagree. Iíve heard wanting a shot clock in high school fo as long as I remember.

8 states currently use it with Wisconsin joining and others looking to join. No state has removed the shot clock so it seems that it was a good enough rule to implement and not remove.

We keep talking about how progressing these athletes in basketball is the most important thing, but if any student wants to play basketball at any level after high school, a shot clock will be used.

High school athletes are developmentally able to play within the rules of a shot clock, there's very little reason to not implement a reasonable shot clock, and it seems the main one is so that coaches can channel their inner Dean Smith.

It just comes down to letting coaches, coach.  I hope they don't tell my doctor to amputate one of my limbs in case of an accident before he makes sure it is necessary.  Amputating the stall from high school basketball is not necessary because there are plenty of ways to control game tempo without a rule.  Colleges and the "next Level" have a shot clock for $$$$$.  They want to appease the fans and sell tickets.  It is not about the game for better or worse, it is about fans and $$$.   

Offline Almatrackster

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #73 on: July 14, 2018, 11:33:17 am »
Fans make football and basketball the most popular sports in Arkansas. To ignore them and the money they bring would be silly.

And yes, high school basketball has a seen a decline in attendance.

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #74 on: July 14, 2018, 04:18:55 pm »
It just comes down to letting coaches, coach.  I hope they don't tell my doctor to amputate one of my limbs in case of an accident before he makes sure it is necessary.  Amputating the stall from high school basketball is not necessary because there are plenty of ways to control game tempo without a rule.  Colleges and the "next Level" have a shot clock for $$$$$.  They want to appease the fans and sell tickets.  It is not about the game for better or worse, it is about fans and $$$.

Why do all the anti shot clock people keep using dramatic and extreme examples to compare to getting a shot clock?? Sports are not the medical field......

Offline footballfan-tastic

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #75 on: July 14, 2018, 09:33:04 pm »
Why do all the anti shot clock people keep using dramatic and extreme examples to compare to getting a shot clock?? Sports are not the medical field......

LOL!!  So true.  Here's another analogy to help you.  Some years back Coca Cola Co. which was the most popular soda manufacturer by far got the bright idea to change the famous formula.  For the better of course and to even increase its share of what was a slowly declining leadership of the market.  It was all the rage with pre release taste test of the new product creating stock price increases and promise of sales increase and taste test reviews by the  fans fueling the move.   Then the release and the next few months was a disaster, with sales taking a beating.  Oh they kept new Coke as Coke II for a while and had Coke classic in return, campaign programs for both spent millions and the result.  Coke II is no longer available in the US.  They didn't realize what they had until it was gone. So you see leave well enough alone.  Don't need a change to fix something that isn't broken.  High school basketball is high school basketball, not college, not pro. One of these days it may change but a few states at this time and the NFHS being opposed at this time leads me to think this isn't the time.

Offline Almatrackster

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #76 on: July 14, 2018, 11:08:53 pm »
Trying a bit too hard with the analogies IMO.

Shot clock is what all of these kids have watched their whole lives and it isnít a gimmick or just a rule for ruleís sake. Itís a tried and true part of the game
now. Hopefully Arkansas keeps trending towards using it. Itíd be nice to be towards the lead on this.

Offline gameoflife

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #77 on: July 15, 2018, 10:50:17 am »
Trying a bit too hard with the analogies IMO.

Shot clock is what all of these kids have watched their whole lives and it isnít a gimmick or just a rule for ruleís sake. Itís a tried and true part of the game
now. Hopefully Arkansas keeps trending towards using it. Itíd be nice to be towards the lead on this.

I think what the folks who don't want it like the purity of the game as it is.  Why add a rule to force a type of play when that option is already available to any team or coach who wants to play that way.  I think I saw a post that compared this change to saying football offenses must run the hurry up no huddle.  Everyone has an opinion but nationally this is not the trend and I would defer to the NFHS who is against it at this time.   I'm sure they have studied the matter extensively.

Offline WarriorFan

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #78 on: July 15, 2018, 06:57:47 pm »
I think High school basketball should be (2) 18 mins halves, and 35 sec shot clock.

Offline B.G.

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #79 on: July 15, 2018, 07:20:50 pm »
If we're on the dream list of rule changes, I wish AAA would allow 7 min or 8 min qtrs for 9th grade basketball.  Right now it's supposed to be 6 min.

It's a development stage and the games are just to short but they still have to follow AAA rules.

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #80 on: July 15, 2018, 08:50:32 pm »
I agree with the two immediate posts above mine. Warrior fan put it has two separate 18 minute halves. I have always thought the high school game should be a total of 36 minutes whether that is four quarters at 9 minutes or two halves at 18 a piece. And I agree with BG that 7 would be a strange number for JH quarters for a total of a 28 minute game....but I believe they should be at that too for junior high. 24 minute games for JH is quite short if you really think about it and maybe they should be lengthened 4 minutes in total. And I think 32 is quite short too for high school. It would make depth or conditioning come into play more by slightly lengthening the games. Kids would have to learn how to play defense without fouling more efficiently as well.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2018, 08:54:20 pm by beach bum »

Offline footballfan-tastic

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #81 on: July 16, 2018, 12:22:56 pm »
All the suggested rule changes are open for the consideration of the AAA.  I'm sure they will think long and hard prior to making a change that all schools must follow.  Some questions still are unanswered.  At which level would the shot clock be implemented?  7th grade, 9th grade?  Sr High?  As for extending the length of the game, that I could support although I think the quarter format is ok.  It gives the athletes a mandatory rest and while you make like the idea of it making conditioning a bigger part of the game, it also is a health/safety  rule.  Sort of like footballs mandatory time outs during the hottest part of the early season.  When the majority of AAA officials and advisory board deem it beneficial and the NFHS allow it without penalty I reckon it will happen.

Offline WarriorFan

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #82 on: July 17, 2018, 01:23:58 pm »
As for the conditioning part, if the the quarters were extended or two halves. I would think it would allow coaches to develop more players. They wouldn't have to play all the allotted time. More substitutions maybe?

Offline motivate

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #83 on: July 17, 2018, 08:59:34 pm »
This rule change would be about as good as the combined conferences from the past two year. A major mistake, no more working the ball side to side for a good shot, taking away the slower teams ability to stay in the game by forcing them to play faster, and really would affect the end of games when your up 6 with 2 minutes left by not forcing the other team to come out and play defense.
If you add a shot clock then take away the 10 second back court call too.
I really feel it would be bad for basketball, I'm sure all the big school are wanting it.

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #84 on: July 17, 2018, 09:06:17 pm »
This rule change would be about as good as the combined conferences from the past two year. A major mistake, no more working the ball side to side for a good shot, taking away the slower teams ability to stay in the game by forcing them to play faster, and really would affect the end of games when your up 6 with 2 minutes left by not forcing the other team to come out and play defense.
If you add a shot clock then take away the 10 second back court call too.
I really feel it would be bad for basketball, I'm sure all the big school are wanting it.


Then why have other levels of basketball used it for 3 decades now? If it was so bad would they not have gone back to no shot clock? Let's just go back to no three pointer's then either right?

Offline HorseFeathers

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #85 on: July 17, 2018, 10:05:36 pm »

Then why have other levels of basketball used it for 3 decades now? If it was so bad would they not have gone back to no shot clock? Let's just go back to no three pointer's then either right?

Just do away with the 3, Pisol Pete didn't need it to set a scoring record 😉

Offline B.G.

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #86 on: July 17, 2018, 10:08:43 pm »
Lots of doomsday opinions here.

Offline bluegrassboy75

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #87 on: July 18, 2018, 11:02:07 am »
When the majority of AAA officials and advisory board deem it beneficial and the NFHS allow it without penalty I reckon it will happen.

Bingo on the last part of you post!!  The AAA will not approve it for regular season as long as the NFHS doesn't recognize it or says that a state can specifically adopt it without penalty (examples are the new coaches box and the mercy rule).  If they did, they would lose all voting rights for any other rules. 

Offline Moonshiner

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #88 on: July 18, 2018, 05:47:50 pm »

Then why have other levels of basketball used it for 3 decades now? If it was so bad would they not have gone back to no shot clock? Let's just go back to no three pointer's then either right?

Are you saying that basketball has gotten better in the last 3 decades?

Offline gameoflife

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #89 on: July 18, 2018, 07:31:57 pm »
Are you saying that basketball has gotten better in the last 3 decades?

Hmmmm!  Looks like someone has a different opinion.

Offline Rayburn

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #90 on: July 19, 2018, 12:24:17 pm »
I think you would find kids would rather have a shot clock.
Kids would rather do a lot of things adults don't let them, because we know better what's good for them. A shot clock at this level would lower the skill level and work ethic of the players, and thus the quality of the game at every level.

Offline Rayburn

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #91 on: July 19, 2018, 12:25:49 pm »
High school athletics is about the kids, period. There are too many coaches in this profession who put their egos above the kids.
Yet you're arguing for a rule change based on what's good for the fans.

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #92 on: July 19, 2018, 12:29:33 pm »
Hmmmm!  Looks like someone has a different opinion.


What opinion is there to it? We literally have 7 feet tall people who can shoot three's and handle the ball comfortably. We have 6'6" to 6'10" guys in the NBA who can guard multiple positions switching on screens. I seriously hope you are not one of those people who thinks teams from the 70's and 80's could beat teams today? Even Steve Kerr who played in a different era and now coaches in one in today's world has admitted the game is far superior now by the fact that the caliber of athlete we have to play them game. People can stretch the floor more than ever before with range that is insane sometimes. College is probably not better because the one and done's with the best talent leaving in one year, maybe two at the most. If they stayed in college it would be far superior too. I am glad they leave too though. Why play a game for free when you can be paid instead.....Good for them. leaving.

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #93 on: July 19, 2018, 12:31:13 pm »
Yet you're arguing for a rule change based on what's good for the fans.


I don't think I have ever once mentioned the fans....

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #94 on: July 19, 2018, 12:31:57 pm »
Kids would rather do a lot of things adults don't let them, because we know better what's good for them. A shot clock at this level would lower the skill level and work ethic of the players, and thus the quality of the game at every level.

Huh? Lol... Ok how then?

Offline B.G.

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #95 on: July 19, 2018, 04:50:56 pm »
Kids would rather do a lot of things adults don't let them, because we know better what's good for them. A shot clock at this level would lower the skill level and work ethic of the players, and thus the quality of the game at every level.
That's an opinion.  I respect that.

But it's not an absolute or a fact.

Offline Moonshiner

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #96 on: July 19, 2018, 06:43:08 pm »

What opinion is there to it? We literally have 7 feet tall people who can shoot three's and handle the ball comfortably. We have 6'6" to 6'10" guys in the NBA who can guard multiple positions switching on screens. I seriously hope you are not one of those people who thinks teams from the 70's and 80's could beat teams today? Even Steve Kerr who played in a different era and now coaches in one in today's world has admitted the game is far superior now by the fact that the caliber of athlete we have to play them game. People can stretch the floor more than ever before with range that is insane sometimes. College is probably not better because the one and done's with the best talent leaving in one year, maybe two at the most. If they stayed in college it would be far superior too. I am glad they leave too though. Why play a game for free when you can be paid instead.....Good for them. leaving.

Yo do realize that Lebron and KD aren't the first tall players to stretch the floor?
Larry Bird and Magic Johnson were both 6'9".  Scottie Pippin was 6'8".
Athletically speaking, today's players are far more athletic.  But in regard to skill, toughness, and understanding the game?  Shooting percentages, as a whole, have dropped off greatly.  So, in the opinion of many, the game has not gotten better.
More athletic, but not in other areas.

Offline beach bum

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #97 on: July 19, 2018, 09:00:28 pm »
Yo do realize that Lebron and KD aren't the first tall players to stretch the floor?
Larry Bird and Magic Johnson were both 6'9".  Scottie Pippin was 6'8".
Athletically speaking, today's players are far more athletic.  But in regard to skill, toughness, and understanding the game?  Shooting percentages, as a whole, have dropped off greatly.  So, in the opinion of many, the game has not gotten better.
More athletic, but not in other areas.


You're leaving out the part where that is because there are way more three pointers taken in today's game than before in the NBA so of course the shooting percentage has gone down, but you're forgetting that shooting 34% from the three point line will get you 102 points while you have to shoot 51% from two's to get that same 102 point total so the efficiency of the game has gone up. So shooting 34% from three's is even more efficient than 50% from two's technically. Analytics have proven how efficient the current Warriors are because of the three pointers and that is what the Rockets figured out too and they may have won had Chris Paul not went out in the series. And you are throwing out a few examples of rangy, athletic guys from 6'8" to 6'10"..... Now the league is just littered with them. You know that there is way more of those guys or you are kidding yourself if you don't think that.
« Last Edit: July 19, 2018, 09:02:40 pm by beach bum »

Offline Moonshiner

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #98 on: July 19, 2018, 10:00:43 pm »

You're leaving out the part where that is because there are way more three pointers taken in today's game than before in the NBA so of course the shooting percentage has gone down, but you're forgetting that shooting 34% from the three point line will get you 102 points while you have to shoot 51% from two's to get that same 102 point total so the efficiency of the game has gone up. So shooting 34% from three's is even more efficient than 50% from two's technically. Analytics have proven how efficient the current Warriors are because of the three pointers and that is what the Rockets figured out too and they may have won had Chris Paul not went out in the series. And you are throwing out a few examples of rangy, athletic guys from 6'8" to 6'10"..... Now the league is just littered with them. You know that there is way more of those guys or you are kidding yourself if you don't think that.

You're a "Money Ball" guy aren't you?
I could've listed several more rangey guys.  Brad Sellers, Bernard King etc...
Our entire civilization is taller than we were back then. 
The reason there are more threes taken has a lot to do with the disappearance of the post game.  There are no dominant centers anymore.
That still isn't proof that the game has improved in the last 30 years.
Have you even been alive that long?

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Re: Shot Clock Gaining Steam
« Reply #99 on: July 21, 2018, 02:12:58 pm »
How many high school teams shoot 34% from 3? I watch A LOT of small school ball....the drop off of the # of good teams seems to correlate with the number of coaches(and fans) that want those fancy Golden State Run and Gun offense implemented...and that's just from the last 10 years.

Shooting 34% from 3 might be more efficient...but if you don't have the shooters, or your shooters go ice cold from 3...you're done..

But this has literally nothing to do with a shot clock lol

 

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