Logic in classifictions?

[Sweet]

Anyone know the logic used for deciding that if a school plays football then it must play all sports at least at the 2A level?

This same logic isn't applied to other sports. If a 1A school plays tennis it is at the 2A level but the other sports are not brought up.

This rule affects 25 schools if you look at from the stand point of 2A and above (16, 16, 32, 48, 48, 48 = 208) and move the 4 smaller private schools to 2A.

205 143.00 JUNCTION CITY HIGH SCHOOL 2A
206 142.00 HECTOR HIGH SCHOOL 2A
207 141.67 POYEN HIGH SCHOOL 2A
208 139.33 J.D. LEFTWICH HIGH SCHOOL 2A
209 139.00 FOREMAN HIGH SCHOOL 2A
210 138.67 SPRING HILL HIGH SCHOOL 2A
216 138.00 WOODLAWN HIGH SCHOOL 2A
217 137.67 MOUNTAIN PINE HIGH SCHOOL 2A
218 136.00 WESTSIDE - JOHNSON COUNTY HI 2A
219 134.33 MARKED TREE HIGH SCHOOL 2A
220 133.00 RECTOR HIGH SCHOOL 2A
221 128.67 CLARENDON HIGH SCHOOL 2A
222 127.67 MOUNT IDA HIGH SCHOOL 2A
223 125.33 HAMPTON HIGH SCHOOL 2A
224 124.33 DIERKS HIGH SCHOOL 2A
225 118.33 MIDLAND HIGH SCHOOL 2A
226 118.00 AUGUSTA HIGH SCHOOL 2A
227 114.33 STRONG HIGH SCHOOL 2A
228 111.33 WESTERN YELL CO HIGH SCHOOL 2A
229 109.33 HERMITAGE HIGH SCHOOL 2A
230 108.33 MINERAL SPRINGS HIGH SCHOOL 2A
231 100.33 NORPHLET HIGH SCHOOL 2A
232 100.00 MARVELL HIGH SCHOOL 2A
233 98.33 DECATUR HIGH SCHOOL 2A
234 90.00 HARTFORD HIGH SCHOOL 2A

[HorseFeathers]

junction city is not that small in reality. . .that aaa doesn't publish their enrollment with the louisiana kids for some reason. They are in the top third of 2a enrollment wise.

[ricepig]

Usually there aren't enough participating schools in some sports. I think bowling and swimming only have two classifications.

[Sweet]

junction city is not that small in reality. . .that aaa doesn't publish their enrollment with the louisiana kids for some reason. They are in the top third of 2a enrollment wise.

OK Strike JC there's still 24 schools affected by this.

Usually there aren't enough participating schools in some sports. I think bowling and swimming only have two classifications.

OK That's why tennis bowling and swimming can move up. The schools have elected to play that sport and to do so they play at a higher classification. The rest of their sports are not moved up accordingly. If the elected sport is football ALL sports are brought up.

[SouthpawSensation]

Actually, the football playing schools are the ones that set the classification guidelines based on their attendance.
Any non-football schools are placed in the classification they would be if they had football. It leads to more Class 3A and 2A schools, but that's the reason there is one set conferences in those classes for football, then another set of conferences for the other sports.
Any lower than the lowest football-playing school, in this case Hartford, are automatically placed in 1A.

[HorseFeathers]

The last part isn't true. . . . There are schools larger than the smallest football school in 1a

[Sweet]

Actually, the football playing schools are the ones that set the classification guidelines based on their attendance.
Any non-football schools are placed in the classification they would be if they had football. It leads to more Class 3A and 2A schools, but that's the reason there is one set conferences in those classes for football, then another set of conferences for the other sports.
Any lower than the lowest football-playing school, in this case Hartford, are automatically placed in 1A.

But those schools I listed would be 1A if not for football.

Bergman high school is the largest public high school not playing football. Their number fit with 3A schools.

124 254.00 PERRYVILLE HIGH SCHOOL 3A
125 253.67 BERGMAN HIGH SCHOOL 3A
126 253.67 HARMONY GROVE HS - BENTON 3A

[Sweet]

The last part isn't true. . . . There are schools larger than the smallest football school in 1a

That's exactly what I am saying.

[Sweet]

Hartford plays football thus they are 2A in every sport.

If Caddo Hills wants a tennis team they simply play that sport in 2A. Why is this only applied to football?


234 90.00 HARTFORD HIGH SCHOOL 2A
235 134.33 CADDO HILLS HIGH SCHOOL 1A
236 130.00 BAY HIGH SCHOOL 1A
237 125.00 IZARD CO. CONSOLIDATED HIGH S 1A
238 121.67 COUNTY LINE HIGH SCHOOL 1A
239 118.33 BRADFORD HIGH SCHOOL 1A
240 116.67 NEMO VISTA HIGH SCHOOL 1A
241 116.00 JASPER HIGH SCHOOL 1A
242 112.67 MAYNARD HIGH SCHOOL 1A
243 112.33 ACORN HIGH SCHOOL 1A
244 111.67 WEST SIDE HIGH SCHOOL 1A
245 111.00 ALPENA HIGH SCHOOL 1A
246 110.33 ARMOREL HIGH SCHOOL 1A
247 110.00 MAMMOTH SPRING HIGH SCHOOL 1A
248 106.33 NORFORK HIGH SCHOOL 1A
249 103.33 MOUNT VERNON-ENOLA HIGH SC 1A
250 102.67 OUACHITA HIGH SCHOOL 1A
251 102.33 SOUTH SIDE BEE BRANCH HIGH SC 1A
252 102.00 CONCORD HIGH SCHOOL 1A
253 101.67 VIOLA HIGH SCHOOL 1A
254 101.00 HUGHES HIGH SCHOOL 1A
255 100.67 KIRBY HIGH SCHOOL 1A
256 99.00 MULBERRY HIGH SCHOOL 1A
257 96.33 SHIRLEY HIGH SCHOOL 1A
258 96.00 BRADLEY HIGH SCHOOL 1A
259 95.33 OMAHA HIGH SCHOOL 1A
260 95.00 HILLCREST HIGH SCHOOL 1A
261 92.33 SCRANTON HIGH SCHOOL 1A
262 92.33 WONDERVIEW HIGH SCHOOL 1A
263 91.33 LEAD HILL HIGH SCHOOL 1A
264 91.00 DERMOTT HIGH SCHOOL 1A

[HorseFeathers]

My bad southpaw guess i misunderstood what you wrote.

[SouthpawSensation]

I think I may have figured it out. I warn you that it might not be the AAA's reasoning, so bear with me.
There are only five non-football schools in Class 5A. That's not enough to do much, so they just take those schools and separate them into eight smaller conferences for other sports than football (although the new 3A-1 East will have nine schools).
But I think they are trying to keep the number of schools in 2A and 1A as balanced as possible. With the addition of 16 non-football schools, it gives 2A a total of 67 schools, while there are 66 schools listed as 1A.

[Sweet]

Didnt mean to do that.

[True Fan]

My theory, it's a carryover from the old days when you had 1A through 5A. If you didn't play football, you were a B school. You didn't have tennis and golf back then. If you wanted to man up and play football, you moved up to the A's. Since you were in the same conference pretty much in every sport, it would have made no sense to try to keep it down in other sports.

[HorseFeathers]

Hasn't always been that way though. I can remember ola playing football in our 2a conference but being 1a in everything else.

[Sweet]

I'll be honest about where this thought originated. Put Spring Hill softball in 1A last year. They beat the eventual champions Taylor twice. By something like 7 @ SH and by 4 @ Taylor. Put SH basketball in 1A for the last 4 - 5 years. Last years 1A champion Nevada County got out of the Saratoga Tournament (SW AR Invitational?) when SH entered. They knew they didn't want any of that. Foreman could have had much different results last year in softball also. I'm sure this applies to several of the teams that are 1A because of football in various sports.

[HorseFeathers]

216 138.00 WOODLAWN HIGH SCHOOL 2A
217 137.67 MOUNTAIN PINE HIGH SCHOOL 2A
218 136.00 WESTSIDE - JOHNSON COUNTY HI 2A
219 134.33 MARKED TREE HIGH SCHOOL 2A
220 133.00 RECTOR HIGH SCHOOL 2A
221 128.67 CLARENDON HIGH SCHOOL 2A
222 127.67 MOUNT IDA HIGH SCHOOL 2A
223 125.33 HAMPTON HIGH SCHOOL 2A
224 124.33 DIERKS HIGH SCHOOL 2A
225 118.33 MIDLAND HIGH SCHOOL 2A
226 118.00 AUGUSTA HIGH SCHOOL 2A
227 114.33 STRONG HIGH SCHOOL 2A
228 111.33 WESTERN YELL CO HIGH SCHOOL 2A
229 109.33 HERMITAGE HIGH SCHOOL 2A
230 108.33 MINERAL SPRINGS HIGH SCHOOL 2A
231 100.33 NORPHLET HIGH SCHOOL 2A
232 100.00 MARVELL HIGH SCHOOL 2A
233 98.33 DECATUR HIGH SCHOOL 2A
234 90.00 HARTFORD HIGH SCHOOL 2A

by the current rules these schools are technically 1A sized schools that are forced to play up a class due to playing football....

Now just looking back 15 years ago...to 2000

Football schools that were 2A for football and 1A(Or pre-1998 Class B if you wish) for everything else
Sparkman
Magazine
Decatur
Ola

It's only 4 schools back then...but I understand the argument...as far as the "man" up and play football...some schools don't have the money, nor school population to make it feasible to play football.

This discussion ultimately comes back to...Why Does Football continue to be the end all decision maker for every sport?

[Sweet]

The magic number is 208 (16, 16, 32, 48, 48, 48 = 208) That's the number of schools from top of 7A to bottom of 2A. Currently that ends with Magazine. Under the rule that private schools move up one classification.
212 96.00 CONWAY CHRISTIAN HIGH SCHOO 2A
213 75.00 UNION CHRISTIAN ACADEMY 2A
Would move up to slots 207 and 208 bringing
207 141.67 POYEN HIGH SCHOOL 2A
208 139.33 J.D. LEFTWICH HIGH SCHOOL 2A
down to 1A

I originally said 4 private schools but looking back it's only 2.

[True Fan]

All Spring Hill, or any of the other affected schools, have to do is submit a proposal to the AAA to change the rule. The board would make a recommendation and the schools could vote on it.



Of course, no school would want to be the one to propose it. Otherwise, they would already have.
The other 1A schools would vote against it to keep the more athletically funded schools out of their class.
The 2A schools would vote against it with grumbling about "can't have their cake and eat it too".
The 3A and up schools would not care and would follow the board recommend Do Not Pass because they don't like change.

You've dug deep into this, Sweet. But, I don't think that you will ever see anything out of it.

[HorseFeathers]

All Spring Hill, or any of the other affected schools, have to do is submit a proposal to the AAA to change the rule. The board would make a recommendation and the schools could vote on it.



Of course, no school would want to be the one to propose it. Otherwise, they would already have.
The other 1A schools would vote against it to keep the more athletically funded schools out of their class.
The 2A schools would vote against it with grumbling about "can't have their cake and eat it too".
The 3A and up schools would not care and would follow the board recommend Do Not Pass because they don't like change.

You've dug deep into this, Sweet. But, I don't think that you will ever see anything out of it.

Why would the 3A and above get to vote? Don't the 6A and 7A schools get to be the only ones to vote on combining or splitting their class?? I think your right though that it will never pass...or even be proposed for that matter....It might if 1A eventually loses enough school that 1A and 2A aren't evenly split anymore...

[Uncle Ivan]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

[Sweet]

I was just sitting around the shack with nothing to do and wondering if there was actually any method to the madness.

[AirWarren]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

Yup. Hermitage needs to go on and consolidate with Warren and be done with it. No sense in having a two school county with a county the size of Bradley.

[tmycjy]

My think is that it should be 32 32 32 64 40 that what I think should happen with the number only school that has the short end of the stick is tne lower end of 6-A football school

[Hoghead]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

I AGREE !!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Lions84]

Just say no to 4 hours a day on a bus to save Money.

[Big Fan]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

Yup. Hermitage needs to go on and consolidate with Warren and be done with it. No sense in having a two school county with a county the size of Bradley.

Gonna be quite a haul from places like Ingals, Marsden, Jersey, Moro, etc. 

[HorseFeathers]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

Yup. Hermitage needs to go on and consolidate with Warren and be done with it. No sense in having a two school county with a county the size of Bradley.

Gonna be quite a haul from places like Ingals, Marsden, Jersey, Moro, etc. 

If that consolidation happened, I'd be willing to bet that it wouldn't be a clean cut everybody goes to Warren..as the southern half of the Hermitage district is closer to Strong and Crossett than to Warren...

[Big Fan]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

Yup. Hermitage needs to go on and consolidate with Warren and be done with it. No sense in having a two school county with a county the size of Bradley.

Gonna be quite a haul from places like Ingals, Marsden, Jersey, Moro, etc. 

If that consolidation happened, I'd be willing to bet that it wouldn't be a clean cut everybody goes to Warren..as the southern half of the Hermitage district is closer to Strong and Crossett than to Warren...

True, but it will NEVER happen until the state demands it happen. 

[Jack1990]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

Yup. Hermitage needs to go on and consolidate with Warren and be done with it. No sense in having a two school county with a county the size of Bradley.

Gonna be quite a haul from places like Ingals, Marsden, Jersey, Moro, etc. 

If that consolidation happened, I'd be willing to bet that it wouldn't be a clean cut everybody goes to Warren..as the southern half of the Hermitage district is closer to Strong and Crossett than to Warren...

Don't automatically assume that just because schools consolidate, that bussing would occur.  When I worked in the White Hall Schol District, we had two campuses in Redfield (Hardin Elementary and Redfield Jr. High) both of which were part of the White Hall School District.

[AirWarren]

Much like East End. Who has their own elementary schools etc then when they enter high school they attend Sheridan High School.

I still think it needs to happen. A one county school. Change the Hermitage campus into a elementary and JR high and when they are in high school send them to Warren. I mean, kids are bussed over in the mornings some days out of the week to have classes at South ARK such as agri, small engines, business/admin classes, pre nursing, welding, etc as electives.

Ingalls to Warren- 28 minutes
Moro Bay to Warren-40 minutes
Vick to Warren- 34 minutes
Jersey to Warren- 32 minutes
Banks(whom already attend Warren or Hermitage) to Warren- 19 minutes (also is 18 minutes from Hampton School District)
Marsden to Warren- 45 minutes
Tinsmen to Warren- 29 minutes (Either Hampton or Warren)
New Edinburg(who already attend Warren) to Warren- 22 minutes
Rye( either attend Warren or Woodlawn) to Warren- 17 minutes
Wilmar(either DC, Monticello, or Warren) to Warren-12 minutes
Hermitage to Warren- 21 minutes
Longview to Warren- 40 minutes

We are talking about a district with 507 students k-12 that would be impacted. It isn't like it's a district that has 1300+.
High School: 208
Elementary: 299

[AirWarren]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

Yup. Hermitage needs to go on and consolidate with Warren and be done with it. No sense in having a two school county with a county the size of Bradley.

Gonna be quite a haul from places like Ingals, Marsden, Jersey, Moro, etc. 

If that consolidation happened, I'd be willing to bet that it wouldn't be a clean cut everybody goes to Warren..as the southern half of the Hermitage district is closer to Strong and Crossett than to Warren...

Other alternatives to Hermitage consolidation


Jersey to:
Crossett 1 hour 8 minutes
Strong 43 minutes
Hamburg 1 hour

Ingalls to:
Crossett 50 minutes
Strong 46 minutes
Hamburg 43 minutes

Hermitage to:
Crossett 57 min
Strong 39 min
Hamburg 50 min

Moro Bay to:
Crossett 56 min
Strong 27 minutes
Hamburg 1 hour 11 minutes
Eldorado 32 minutes

Vick to:
Crossett 42 min
Strong 53 min
Hamburg 35 min

Marsden to:
Crossett 1 hour 10 min
Strong 50 min
Hamburg 1 hour and 3 minutes

Longview to:
Crossett 27 min
Strong 48 min
Hamburg 20 min

[OldMule]

I wish they would re-think the whole thing along the lines of 1)Conferences being natural, close rivals of 7-10 schools, a, determined locally and 2) Districts, and Regions being determined by the AAA, in groups of 8/12/16, or whatever, based on school size. 

There also only needs to be 4 divisions:  A, really small schools, B. mid size schools, C. large schools, D. really big schools. 

Under that scenario, winning the conference title is probably very different than winning a district title.  It also keeps kids close to home, gets them home early the majority of the time, keeps fan attendance at games high (and the $ that comes with that attendance), plays games against teams you want to play, makes it much easier on kids who have to take a test in the morning, saves travel expenses for school districts, AND MAKES SENSE!

Who cares if there are 8 in a bracket?  And what is the matter with Byes or Play-in games if there are not 8 in a bracket?  This business of lining schools up by enrollment, then marking off groups by 8, and calling that a division, then creating a conference where there are very long distances involved is a really bad system. 

[HorseFeathers]

I wish they would re-think the whole thing along the lines of 1)Conferences being natural, close rivals of 7-10 schools, a, determined locally and 2) Districts, and Regions being determined by the AAA, in groups of 8/12/16, or whatever, based on school size. 

There also only needs to be 4 divisions:  A, really small schools, B. mid size schools, C. large schools, D. really big schools. 

Under that scenario, winning the conference title is probably very different than winning a district title.  It also keeps kids close to home, gets them home early the majority of the time, keeps fan attendance at games high (and the $ that comes with that attendance), plays games against teams you want to play, makes it much easier on kids who have to take a test in the morning, saves travel expenses for school districts, AND MAKES SENSE!

Who cares if there are 8 in a bracket?  And what is the matter with Byes or Play-in games if there are not 8 in a bracket?  This business of lining schools up by enrollment, then marking off groups by 8, and calling that a division, then creating a conference where there are very long distances involved is a really bad system. 

Could go for that....for football combine, 2A an 3A, 4A an 5A..and 6A/7A. For Basketball add 1A to the smallest class. Wouldn't be for a school Hector's size competing with say...Russellville. Just wouldn't be right no matter how you tried to spin it.

[Hoghead]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

Yup. Hermitage needs to go on and consolidate with Warren and be done with it. No sense in having a two school county with a county the size of Bradley.

Due to the size of Bradley County and density this would be best. Theres almost as many people in Hope as there is in all of Bradley County.

[HorseFeathers]

Every school listed on this thread needs to be consolidated.

Yup. Hermitage needs to go on and consolidate with Warren and be done with it. No sense in having a two school county with a county the size of Bradley.

Due to the size of Bradley County and density this would be best. Theres almost as many people in Hope as there is in all of Bradley County.

Little Over 11k if the numbers on Google are right...Still think kids would get screwed in the southern part of the county with the bus rides. You can say well it's only 30 minutes from point A to point B...but what about the side roads on the bus route, and the stops? Could turn a 20 minute trip on paper into an hour plus....

[Lions84]

That been my issue in this discussion Bus's are always stopping starting going down this side road etc.   Here in our District down here in Texas we have 20 minute routes in town up to and hour and a half for the longest one.  And our District is only 123.23 square miles in area and we have all paved county roads.