56 - 8 - 0 - 92 - 0, hut! (urp) (2011 version)

[OPoraquê]

56.  (Calpreps)

8.  (Massey/USA Today Super 25)

0. (Maxpreps/Freeman)

92.  (Rivals 2011)

0. (ESPN Fab 50)

(Cumulative average for Bennie is 15 and change.)

[Baitshop]

I thought that the Shiloh Poll Watchers Club met on the 4A board..??..??

[Billyo62]

I thought that the Shiloh Poll Watchers Club met on the 4A board..??..??

Who's Shiloh?

[Baitshop]

Exactly....

[Billyo62]

 

[7AFBFAN]

14-2-16-21 will soon be NR-NR-NR-NR

[Billyo62]

14-2-16-21 will soon be NR-NR-NR-NR

You mean Like Southside 

[Earl is my Hero!!]

I thought that the Shiloh Poll Watchers Club met on the 4A board..??..??

No, they meet in the Ft. Smith pressbox during Jr High games...

[OPoraquê]

* bump *  (Ratings have been updated). SS looks unstoppable on offense...we'll see if the rankings can hold by Friday evening.

(BTW, honestly, I still think last year's Bennie team had the incredible accomplishments:

- Undefeated in a district with at least six qbs who'd averaged passing for nearly 7,000 career yards apiece.  At least 5 of those are or will be playing in college, with the one who called it quits having 6,000 + yards and a state championship ring.
- Undefeated in a district with a several DI recruits including 5 Arkansas signees, including one who became the first true freshman o-line starter ever for that school.  (Funny that the USA Today OPOY was from NWA but wasn't in the district.  Oh, what might have been had SCHS and some 7A West schools gotten to play - maybe Bennie WOULDN'T have been 13-0.) Two Parade all-Americans came from NWA out of this football season.
- Among those recruits, beat twice the #1 (career passing yardage and other stats) big-school QB in Arkansas history.
- Finished as the #3 (big-school) scoring team (in a season) in history, beating twice the #4 and #5  highest all-time scoring big-school Arkansas teams.
- One of two handfuls of undefeated big-school teams since the early 80s.

- Beat twice a H-B team that beat the 3-time Oklahoma big-school champion (in preseason scrimmage), which beat a two-time Louisiana champion, etc.  In pre-district beat NLR, Fort Zumwalt West and TX TX teams which together produced several DI signees.

I don't want to minimize what's happening this season, but last season was something special.

[Baitshop]

* bump *  (Ratings have been updated). SS looks unstoppable on offense...we'll see if the rankings can hold by Friday evening.

IF we catch the football....we have a chance to be pretty good....

Two keys for Southside....

1.) Cannot be one dimensional against Bentonville and win...

2.) Must be in Hardison's face from multiple directions all night....

[businesstron]

Wow Rivals has them at 11?  Theres no way bentonville is better then Trinity or Katy.  If bentonville gies underrated they'll get the Springdale treatment.

[2bhsboys]

Wow Rivals has them at 11?  Theres no way bentonville is better then Trinity or Katy.  If bentonville gies underrated they'll get the Springdale treatment.

17-0 has a funny way of doing that

[7AFBFAN]

Let me guess, because they are not from Texas. Go play your tired song somewhere else.

[DerekOxford]

I talked to my sports editor today about the Bentonville/Texas High game and he said that Texas High, who he said normally has a pretty good pass rush, could simply not get to Hardison. He had all night to throw.

When you give a guy with the kind of accuracy and consistency that Hardison has that kind of time, he's going to pick you apart.

I'm afraid there isn't any team in the conference or at state that will be able to get enough pressure on Hardison. But maybe Southside will. Should be a good game regardless.

[OPoraquê]

I talked to my sports editor today about the Bentonville/Texas High game and he said that Texas High, who he said normally has a pretty good pass rush, could simply not get to Hardison. He had all night to throw.

When you give a guy with the kind of accuracy and consistency that Hardison has that kind of time, he's going to pick you apart.

I'm afraid there isn't any team in the conference or at state that will be able to get enough pressure on Hardison. But maybe Southside will. Should be a good game regardless.

I'm not going to challenge my online acquaintance Businesstron, and though TX TX has some nice tradition Euless Trinity, Katy, Allen or Southlake Carroll they ain't at this point in time.

That being said:

- Right now TX TX has the nation's #2 o-lineman plus another DI recruit or two (I know businesstron, see: Little Rock, North), and;
- Over the past seven seasons prior to this one they've averaged 8 wins, 3 losses, and during that time plus this season;
- Their previous worst loss was by 34 points - until Bennie came to Grim Stadium two Fridays ago.
- Also, that game was the first one in 7 seasons and 5 games that TX TX had been skunked.
- Take away the Bennie game and against their other 4 opponents (with a 3-1 record) they're winning their games by an average of 31-10 this 2011 season.

World beaters?  Not this year.  But Bennie did some things that Arkansas teams just wouldn't have done over a two-year span to a decent-or-better east Texas 4A team with nearly 2,000 kids back in the day (say, 7 years ago).  (It WOULD be cool to see a matchup with a school like SLC or Allen.  Those most resemble BHS from what I can gather.)

[businesstron]

Let me guess, because they are not from Texas. Go play your tired song somewhere else.

How about this... Does Daphne, Camden County, Miramar, Buford, or Servite being better then Bentonville make you any happier because they are not from Texas?

Here's the main reason I think these teams (and the Texas teams) are better.  If Bentonville can't run against the likes of Texas High or Fort Zumwalt West.  They aren't gonna do it against any of these teams.  So that would make them one dimensional and all of these teams will take advantage of that more or less.  These teams have lines that will get after you.

Daphne is the defending....undefeated 6a state champ from Bama....from probably the most talented region in Bama (Mobile).  So speed size all over the field...y'll saw what bama did to the hogs this last weekend it'd be the same story here. 

Buford and Camden County (think West Memphis on Steroids) are well coached and have run based offenses and shut down defenses....SEC country.

Miramar....think Northside but faster WRs (over all) not as high tempo and with a probably one of the best secondaries in the nation.  A South Florida school so talent all over the place...probably not the most diciplined bunch though..

Servite -- The top ranked Team in Cali and in the Pac 5....one of the most competitive leagues in the USA. 

[businesstron]

I talked to my sports editor today about the Bentonville/Texas High game and he said that Texas High, who he said normally has a pretty good pass rush, could simply not get to Hardison. He had all night to throw.

When you give a guy with the kind of accuracy and consistency that Hardison has that kind of time, he's going to pick you apart.

I'm afraid there isn't any team in the conference or at state that will be able to get enough pressure on Hardison. But maybe Southside will. Should be a good game regardless.

I'm not going to challenge my online acquaintance Businesstron, and though TX TX has some nice tradition Euless Trinity, Katy, Allen or Southlake Carroll they ain't at this point in time.

That being said:

- Right now TX TX has the nation's #2 o-lineman plus another DI recruit or two (I know businesstron, see: Little Rock, North), and;
- Over the past seven seasons prior to this one they've averaged 8 wins, 3 losses, and during that time plus this season;
- Their previous worst loss was by 34 points - until Bennie came to Grim Stadium two Fridays ago.
- Also, that game was the first one in 7 seasons and 5 games that TX TX had been skunked.
- Take away the Bennie game and against their other 4 opponents (with a 3-1 record) they're winning their games by an average of 31-10 this 2011 season.

World beaters?  Not this year.  But Bennie did some things that Arkansas teams just wouldn't have done over a two-year span to a decent-or-better east Texas 4A team with nearly 2,000 kids back in the day (say, 7 years ago).  (It WOULD be cool to see a matchup with a school like SLC or Allen.  Those most resemble BHS from what I can gather.)

The last two years for Texas high have easily been the worst in the last seven.  That 34 pt loss came to Longview probably 3 or 4 years ago...  Even with that lost Texas high had decent talent all over field and a balanced offense.   

These last two years they have had no Qb (they went from having D1 talent like Mallet and Sorenson, both 3 year starters to have dudes that can barely throw the ball).  They aren't the type of team that is going to excel being one dimensional against a good team.   They are what they are a mediocre east Texas team in what is a down year for east texas football (only Longview and Lufkin are really good)

I can't see the similarities Bentonville and teams like SLC or Allen.  Money wise both communities are well off.  Football wise though both SLC and Allen have a buttload of D1 talent while Bentonville really doesn't have that. 

They all have great coaching though.

I'd be interested in Bentonville playing a team that contrast their style like Desoto, Duncanville or an Arlington Bowie.   Even Neville, South Panola or Ouachita Parish would be interesting.  Most of those schools are within a 5 or 6 drive so those type of matchups would atleast be realistic. 

[OPoraquê]

Businesstron,

Right now according to Rivals you're right - Allen has 7 seniors listed; Carroll 4.  Bentonville may have 2, although if they stay healthy they'll have at least 5 guys that will play somewhere on Saturdays after sending 3 to the DI ranks last year plus a few more elsewhere.  As you said, Bentonville (and Allen/SLC) have players who can be coached...looks like the latter two have a few more athletes but clearly BHS is getting some and if (big "if") it hits the 4,000 - 5,000* (*like Allen) mark it will have more.

I'll say this - it's fascinating to me that we can even have this discussion now.  Texas High and North Little Rock high clearly have some serious athletes even if not at the QB positoin, and again, 10 years ago they might have been wiping the field with Bennie no matter how easily the latter was coached.  We'll see where this goes in the future.  (BTW, looks like TX TX's district is WAY down this year - should be interesting to see who finishes where.)

BTW, what's happened to Odessa "the original friday night lights" Permian?  They got pummeled something like 61-21 by future Bennie opponent Broken Arrow, OK a few weeks ago.

(BTW, in Massey now they rank Bennie #2, with the #21 schedule, #3 offense, #2 defense and #1 "power" ranking.)

[Scorp]

looks like the latter two have a few more athletes but clearly BHS is getting some and if (big "if") it hits the 4,000 - 5,000* (*like Allen) mark it will have more.

Couple of things to consider.....  Texas enrollment figures 'include' the ninth grade class, so the enrollment disparity isn't that large between the two.

And.... even with WM money, B'ville isn't playing in a $60 million dollar stadium!  (man they take HS football seriously down in Texas!)

[OPoraquê]

You got THAT right, sir!

[Scorp]

What makes Allen's new "palace" even more unique is that unlike other mega-stadiums in Texas which were funded and built to be shared by several high schools in the community.... this one was built for Allen only!

[Billyo62]

That is just Sick...But I like it!

[businesstron]

Businesstron,

Right now according to Rivals you're right - Allen has 7 seniors listed; Carroll 4.  Bentonville may have 2, although if they stay healthy they'll have at least 5 guys that will play somewhere on Saturdays after sending 3 to the DI ranks last year plus a few more elsewhere.  As you said, Bentonville (and Allen/SLC) have players who can be coached...looks like the latter two have a few more athletes but clearly BHS is getting some and if (big "if") it hits the 4,000 - 5,000* (*like Allen) mark it will have more.

I'll say this - it's fascinating to me that we can even have this discussion now.  Texas High and North Little Rock high clearly have some serious athletes even if not at the QB positoin, and again, 10 years ago they might have been wiping the field with Bennie no matter how easily the latter was coached.  We'll see where this goes in the future.  (BTW, looks like TX TX's district is WAY down this year - should be interesting to see who finishes where.)

BTW, what's happened to Odessa "the original friday night lights" Permian?  They got pummeled something like 61-21 by future Bennie opponent Broken Arrow, OK a few weeks ago.

(BTW, in Massey now they rank Bennie #2, with the #21 schedule, #3 offense, #2 defense and #1 "power" ranking.)

There were some athletes at Texas High.  NLR has some athletes but they never amount to much at the next level, name me some impact players from NLR from the last 10 years.  A 15 d1 athletes is easy to beat if they have no coaching.   

As far as Texas high goes.... this year they have the OL that's going to Oklahoma and they may have a LB that goes to school somewhere.  Next year they may have a good DT but that's it.   Last year they had the RB and a Defensive end.  Before that they would get 3 good athletes a year with 4 to 5 coming on a good year. 

Now compare that to the Lake Travis, Aledo, Denton Ryan and  Brenhnam. Lake Travis has 4 D1 commits but that'll be more by the end of the year.   Aledo has 7 (include the #1 rb in the nation).  Brenham has 6 and Denton Ryan has  13 D1 athletes and that including the 5 commits they have on defense.  In those 5 is the #1 defensive end and LBs ranked #17 and 27th in the country. 

Those are some of the top teams in 4a and those are some programs that have serious athletes. 

In 5a Desoto has 9, Coppell has 5, Skyline has 8, Trinity has 7 (in an off year).  Those are serious athletes.   There are teams that are very sucessfull like Katy that don't put out as many athletes but even they have athletes (of the last 3 starting QBs for Katy, One is starting for the Bengals, the other just lead FCS Eastern Washington to a champion ship and the current one this year is going to UL).  Those are some nice QBs but katy is a 70/30 running team.  They also have exposure to playing the bigger faster talented teams in Houston and beating them.   


Bentonville doesn't have that track record.  So I can't really see them being the 11th best team in the country (I only care about the Rivals poll the other 3 a computer based).  Dominating Fayetteville, NLR, FZW, and Texas just isn't enough for that.   

They have made big improvement from where they were.  When I saw them play Rogers in 04...or 05 they looked like a peewee team and I almost left the game in the 1st half because that was some of the worst football I had seen in like 10 years.   Since Lunney got there they have gotten bigger a little faster and stronger.

I don't think Bentonville will be comparable to Allen as far talent goes even if they approach 5000 someday.  Alot of the schools I mentioned have up to 1500 students less then Bentonville.   There are two school (Plano and Plano East ) bigger then Allen in their own district and they don't put out as much talent.

As far as permian goes...they just suck this year.  They can't keep a good coach for anything and the FNL coach coming back didn't help them.  They lost to a 4 a team this year as well and they really haven't been relevant in Texas HS football since the early 90s (though a couple of West Texas teams have won state championships since).  They have had a couple of good year though. 

As far as Bentonville goes they are only as good as their oppenents will be.  So unless their opponents get better (aka the central )  They have a high ranking now but don't be surprised if they go the other way as the season goes on.  FZW will probably hold for a while Texas High and NLR won't.   Fayetteville may....I don't think their state championship material this year.

Sorry for the long winded response.....

[Valleysports]

Arkansas Football will NEVER be Texas Football AND it's OK!

[7AFBFAN]

Nor will any other state for that matter. Some of us live in Arkansas and are just fine with what the state has to offer. Those great Texas schools have 5000 students so let's even the field and put Harber and Bentonville together each year to form a team. Heck they are pretty close in proximity. I am sure you guys would still say they can't compete but I think you would be wrong. Last year's combination of Bentonville and Harber would have wiped the floor with just about every Texas team.

[Scorp]

Last year's combination of Bentonville and Harber would have wiped the floor with just about every Texas team.

I disagree.  For this reason.... The DFW metroplex (alone) has a population more than twice the entire population of Arkansas.  I don't know how liberal their transfer policies are, or how closely they examine proof of residency... but some of the "power" teams in DFW have a lot more talent they could gather than B'ville and Harber would.

But like Valley said in another post.... that's okay.  I like Arkansas high school football.

[OPoraquê]

Gang,

I have to agree with you.  Arkansas football will NEVER be Texas football, and I don't think that's what anyone here's tried to argue.

What we have noticed is that due to all those factors which make Northwest Arkansas the major-metropolitan-area-which-is-finally-figuring-out-it-is-indeed-a-major-metropolitan-area have had a by-product of creating one of the very most competitive areas for prep sports in Middle America and probably in "flyover country" (that chunk of states in the continental U.S. between the east and west coast).  This area includes Texas, which is in a class of its own.  Is this area as good as Texas football?  We'll say "no", but its competitive enough to field teams that can beat Texas teams that no NWA area school would have bested a decade or more ago, while being able to beat and frequently CREAM teams from anywhere else in middle America.

(I never said anything on this earlier, but I was amazed with Gravette, AR beat Poteau, OK something like 31-16 earlier this season.  Gravette shares Bella Vista with Bennie with Camden Rd. being the rough boundary between west BV (Gravette school district) and east (Bennie).


Gravette's population: two thousand something.  Poteau's: eight thousand something.  That's another win that would NEVER have happened 10 or 20 years ago.)

It ain't Texas football but NWA football (and the effect it has) has been a fascinating ride of late, and judging on predicted population growth may continue to be so...

[businesstron]

It not really an question of which state is better it's more of a question of is Bentonville really even close to the 11th best team in the nation.   

Arkansas HS football is enjoyable.... More often then not I'll be at someone's game every friday night in the fall but I'm glad there are stations like Fox Sports Southwest, ESPNU and even the Cox sports out there to show HS football games from other states. 

Really my only problem with Arkansas HS football is the water downed conferences.... There's basically no reason to really pay attention after the 2nd week of november.  Because it's basically the same 4 7a west teams playing again.....  They may not be the best teams in the state but the 5a and 3a playoffs end up being more interesting.   

[Valleysports]

Bentonville is a Tyler Lee or Longview!

[OPoraquê]

(Just a non-football aside.

Ohio State University's women's basketball team made the NCAA Sweet Sixteen this past spring after winning the Big 10 basketball tournament for the third year in a row.  They'd been conference champs for six years as well prior to the 10-11 season.  They just had a graduate make Big 10 player of the year for four straight seasons, a first in that conference.  In other words, there's some very serious basketball played in that school in what used to be "the" best college basketball conference.

Ohio is, as of the most recent census, America's 7th most populous state.  On the tOSU women's bball team there are 14 players, 8 from the buckeye state.  Guess what state, no, what city, currently sends the most players to that team after Ohio?

You guessed it: Siloam Springs, Arkansas.

Right now there are Siloam Springs freshmen and sophomores not just in Columbus, but also at James Madison.  And at Arizona.  And at TEXAS.

SILOAM SPRINGS.  Not even in the NWA so-called "Big Six".

The changes that have been taking place here aren't limited just to Bennie football.

Good grief.)

[SouthpawSensation]

For anybody interested, Bentonville is now No. 12 in CalPreps following the win over FS Southside.

[Baitshop]

Bentonville, with a skin of their teeth win against the pinnacle of Arkansas high school football (Southside...duh)....should move to the #1 position on all polls.....

Shoot, if you can beat the Southside Rebels, you probably should be ranked ahead of the Ole Miss Rebels....

[Billyo62]

Bentonville, with a skin of their teeth win against the pinnacle of Arkansas high school football (Southside...duh)....should move to the #1 position on all polls.....

Shoot, if you can beat the Southside Rebels, you probably should be ranked ahead of the Ole Miss Rebels....

I'm surprised they didn't drop,beating a team ranked #700 by a score of only 38-0 doesn't do you good in these polls.

[OPoraquê]

Bentonville's Big Push
Folks around the country probably only know Bentonville, Ark., for one thing: Being the home to Wal-Mart.

But outsiders are slowly noticing something locals have been aware of for some time: The local high school can play some football.

This week, the defending Class 7A champions, earned a spot in the RivalsHigh Top Ten for the first time in school history, jumping up from No. 11 to No. 8 after improving to 5-0 after a 38-0 victory at Fort Smith (Ark.) Southside.

Bentonville, going for its third state title in four years, has now outscored its opponents, 206-32, on the season.

The Tigers rise was the most noticeable in a rankings where the top seven teams stayed the same and only four teams managed to fight their way in.


http://highschool.rivals.com/viewrankhs.asp?ra_key=819

#12 in Maxpreps now as well...

[redwolf143]

Bentonville, with a skin of their teeth win against the pinnacle of Arkansas high school football (Southside...duh)....should move to the #1 position on all polls.....

Shoot, if you can beat the Southside Rebels, you probably should be ranked ahead of the Ole Miss Rebels....

So West Memphis should be #2 than?  Or maybe there should be a tie for first.

[OPoraquê]

FWIW, USA Today/Massey's updated their rankings - Bennie (overall #2) is #14 in schedule, #5 in offense, #1 in defense, #1 in "power".

[Billyo62]

FWIW, USA Today/Massey's updated their rankings - Bennie (overall #2) is #14 in schedule, #5 in offense, #1 in defense, #1 in "power".

[OPoraquê]

BillyOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!! (Thanks, I saw the secondary ranking changes yesterday but the main one hadn't yet changed.)

[Earl is my Hero!!]

Wow! They think we're better than SHILOH??

[Baitshop]

Wow! They think we're better than SHILOH??

USA Today may think that you are....but, I assure you that the folks at Shiloh won't agree.....

[Billyo62]

Wow! They think we're better than SHILOH??

USA Today may think that you are....but, I assure you that the folks at Shiloh won't agree.....

What's a Shiloh?

[Earl is my Hero!!]

http://www.fearlessfriday.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=100372.msg2469834#new

[OPoraquê]

Bennie slid back ever-so-slightly this week - last week's and this week's games won't help in rankings (but, BOY, would they hurt if the tigers lost) but they're finally getting votes in ESPN.  Not ranked...just getting votes amounting to "top 55" status.  (Billyo showed us they cracked the top 50 at season's end last year).

Shiloh and Har-Ber were on the USA Today Super 25 at the beginning of the season last year, I believe.  So far, the USAT writers haven't gone near Bennie this season...maybe they felt like they were burned in '10.  If BHS is able to (still a serious "if") run the table it will be interesting if they ever make that list, if some other current occupants fall.

[Billyo62]

We will drop again this week without a doubt no matter what happens.

[OPoraquê]

Heh - Bennie actually went back up to the two places it was "12" two weeks ago and has cracked the ESPN top 50 (#47)...Massey/USA Today will update later on.  Still #11 in Rivals.

[Billyo62]

Heh - Bennie actually went back up to the two places it was "12" two weeks ago and has cracked the ESPN top 50 (#47)...Massey/USA Today will update later on.  Still #11 in Rivals.

I saw that, the final of 61-6 helped that happen, if it would have been 45-6 I'm not so sure, I think that's a sad reality of some of these polls and Ranking systems.

[Jesusfreak]

Heh - Bennie actually went back up to the two places it was "12" two weeks ago and has cracked the ESPN top 50 (#47)...Massey/USA Today will update later on.  Still #11 in Rivals.

I saw that, the final of 61-6 helped that happen, if it would have been 45-6 I'm not so sure, I think that's a sad reality of some of these polls and Ranking systems.

I agree, a lot of the final scores, while lopsided, are still not indicative of their dominance. Lunney could probably hung 100 points on more than one team, but completely humiliating an opponent for credibility in polls that are inexact and subjective is not good for the kids or sports in general. I think that a team from Arkansas  being recognized nationally  is good enough, a few spots in the poll is just hairsplitting.

[Billyo62]

Heh - Bennie actually went back up to the two places it was "12" two weeks ago and has cracked the ESPN top 50 (#47)...Massey/USA Today will update later on.  Still #11 in Rivals.

I saw that, the final of 61-6 helped that happen, if it would have been 45-6 I'm not so sure, I think that's a sad reality of some of these polls and Ranking systems.

I agree, a lot of the final scores, while lopsided, are still not indicative of their dominance. Lunney could probably hung 100 points on more than one team, but completely humiliating an opponent for credibility in polls that are inexact and subjective is not good for the kids or sports in general. I think that a team from Arkansas  being recognized nationally  is good enough, a few spots in the poll is just hairsplitting.

I agree 100%

+1

[OPoraquê]

Heh - Bennie actually went back up to the two places it was "12" two weeks ago and has cracked the ESPN top 50 (#47)...Massey/USA Today will update later on.  Still #11 in Rivals.

I saw that, the final of 61-6 helped that happen, if it would have been 45-6 I'm not so sure, I think that's a sad reality of some of these polls and Ranking systems.

I agree, a lot of the final scores, while lopsided, are still not indicative of their dominance. Lunney could probably hung 100 points on more than one team, but completely humiliating an opponent for credibility in polls that are inexact and subjective is not good for the kids or sports in general. I think that a team from Arkansas  being recognized nationally  is good enough, a few spots in the poll is just hairsplitting.

I agree 100%

+1

With what you've both said (well, I might add), here are quotes from the Rivals update from today on the current #4 team:

Armwood's defense put up its fourth straight shutout - against its fourth straight inferior opponent. The 80-points were impressive but tempered with its opponents struggles.

Ouch.

[SouthpawSensation]

USA Today's computer rankings have Bentonville at No. 2 for second straight week.