Question for former 5A folks

[J12]

How are you feeling now that district and regionals are finished? 

Do you think the first two tournaments were worth the additional travel and games played?

Do you think your teams have benefited from the 4A postseason formats?

Overall thoughts? Please no comments about poor officiating, holding the ball, or me hating your team.

[JessieP]

How are you feeling now that district and regionals are finished? 

Do you think the first two tournaments were worth the additional travel and games played?

Do you think your teams have benefited from the 4A postseason formats?

Overall thoughts? Please no comments about poor officiating, holding the ball, or me hating your team.

The 4A post season format is ridiculous. It's a long drawn out maze that requires a program and notes to follow. The way it's set up there is no sense of urgency for the top ranked teams. There is almost no excitement. I follow and support Batesville, in the first 2 rounds they were in a situation where they only had to win 1 game to advance. They sleepwalked through one game and lost but no biggie, we were already guaranteed advancing. Where's the urgency? There are teams heading to state that have 3 loses since the regular season ended. This format takes away the excitement of having a Cinderella team. Our real March Madness is basically 3 day's spread over 2 weeks. From this point forward to be state champion you need to put together an impressive streak of 3 straight wins, Not exactly the Bataan death march.

Want to make it an actual event? Take 32 teams, make a bracket and spread it out at one location over 2 weekends. Have all day games Thursday, Friday and Saturday. Single elimination, take the NCAA format and you have yourself a mini March Madness. You have a full arena, filled up hotels, fans mingling in the park lot, restaurants and hotel lobbies. You would have the tv news vans parked outside the venue and excitement. It would be a sports mardi gras. And don't try a feed me that tripe about it being too hard to seed that many teams, bs. You put 20 people (Coaches, athletic directors and some media) in a room for 4 hours and boom, done! It's far less costly and much easier. Besides infusing some desperately needed excitement you take away some fans having to drive 4 hours round trip twice in three days to watch a team that can afford to "Only lose once". YAWN!     

On a personal note, you're a bit uptight about staying in the lane of these threads. I've noticed a few times you get bothered if the post wander off topic. On this one you ask a question then give very specific guidelines for answering. You are a bit regimented aren't you? Some may say anal retentive, were you potty trained at gunpoint?

[millsalum]

How are you feeling now that district and regionals are finished? 

Do you think the first two tournaments were worth the additional travel and games played?

Do you think your teams have benefited from the 4A postseason formats?

Overall thoughts? Please no comments about poor officiating, holding the ball, or me hating your team.

The 4A-5 didn't have a district tournament. They determined seeds via round robin.
As a Mills fan, I liked the 5A format better. It streamlined the postseason process. Schools like Mills and McClellan have never had to play in a regional tournament to get a bid at state. The current format isn't worth the travel and extra games. I find it crazy how Harrison (another former 5A school) won a conference title and didn't even make it to state.

[Gray lizard]

Well tell that to the 4-4A which advanced 4 teams to the State. Without a region you don't advance 4 teams from one conference.

[Gray lizard]

The 4A-5 didn't have a district tournament. They determined seeds via round robin.
As a Mills fan, I liked the 5A format better. It streamlined the postseason process. Schools like Mills and McClellan have never had to play in a regional tournament to get a bid at state. The current format isn't worth the travel and extra games. I find it crazy how Harrison (another former 5A school) won a conference title and didn't even make it to state.

Harrison did not make State due to loss to the 4th best team in the 4-4A and all othe 4-1A teams also lost and did not advance.

[J12]

The 4A post season format is ridiculous. It's a long drawn out maze that requires a program and notes to follow. The way it's set up there is no sense of urgency for the top ranked teams. There is almost no excitement. I follow and support Batesville, in the first 2 rounds they were in a situation where they only had to win 1 game to advance. They sleepwalked through one game and lost but no biggie, we were already guaranteed advancing. Where's the urgency? There are teams heading to state that have 3 loses since the regular season ended. This format takes away the excitement of having a Cinderella team. Our real March Madness is basically 3 day's spread over 2 weeks. From this point forward to be state champion you need to put together an impressive streak of 3 straight wins, Not exactly the Bataan death march.

Want to make it an actual event? Take 32 teams, make a bracket and spread it out at one location over 2 weekends. Have all day games Thursday, Friday and Saturday. Single elimination, take the NCAA format and you have yourself a mini March Madness. You have a full arena, filled up hotels, fans mingling in the park lot, restaurants and hotel lobbies. You would have the tv news vans parked outside the venue and excitement. It would be a sports mardi gras. And don't try a feed me that tripe about it being too hard to seed that many teams, bs. You put 20 people (Coaches, athletic directors and some media) in a room for 4 hours and boom, done! It's far less costly and much easier. Besides infusing some desperately needed excitement you take away some fans having to drive 4 hours round trip twice in three days to watch a team that can afford to "Only lose once". YAWN!     

On a personal note, you're a bit uptight about staying in the lane of these threads. I've noticed a few times you get bothered if the post wander off topic. On this one you ask a question then give very specific guidelines for answering. You are a bit regimented aren't you? Some may say anal retentive, were you potty trained at gunpoint?

All that was duly noted. Potty training was difficult for me, but I believe I have mastered the process.

[millsalum]

Harrison did not make State due to loss to the 4th best team in the 4-4A and all othe 4-1A teams also lost and did not advance.

Do you believe Harrison, a conference champion, should've even been in that position at regionals in the first place? Personally, I don't.

[Missco]

Blytheville did well and won the district tournament and finished 2nd in regionals. I know that they would ratherr not have a district tournament.

[J12]

I ask because I want feedback from a different perspective. This is the only way 4A folks have known.  Being in NEA, we have team here that go straight to state and it's always fun to discuss this topic with them as well.

IMO - District tournaments can be forgone. Regionals serve the purpose as being discussed about Harrison. If a 1 seed can't beat another districts 4 seed, then that 1 seed didn't deserve a chance to play for a state championship.

That might not sit well, but state tournaments are single elimination tournament as well.

[LRRandy]

Do you believe Harrison, a conference champion, should've even been in that position at regionals in the first place? Personally, I don't.

do you not feel that if they were good enough to be in the state tournament that they should have been able to beat a 4 seed team? It appears that their conference championship was a mirage built on weak teams since not one of the teams in their conference advanced.

[Gray lizard]

Do you believe Harrison, a conference champion, should've even been in that position at regionals in the first place? Personally, I don't.

Not sure I understand.  As conference champion all they had to do was beat the #4 team to advance to State.  Do we not want to advance the best teams.  I think the 4-4A proved they were better than the 4-1A when they swept the region.

[NEASportsFan1]

The 4A post season format is ridiculous. It's a long drawn out maze that requires a program and notes to follow. The way it's set up there is no sense of urgency for the top ranked teams. There is almost no excitement. I follow and support Batesville, in the first 2 rounds they were in a situation where they only had to win 1 game to advance. They sleepwalked through one game and lost but no biggie, we were already guaranteed advancing. Where's the urgency? There are teams heading to state that have 3 loses since the regular season ended. This format takes away the excitement of having a Cinderella team. Our real March Madness is basically 3 day's spread over 2 weeks. From this point forward to be state champion you need to put together an impressive streak of 3 straight wins, Not exactly the Bataan death march.

Want to make it an actual event? Take 32 teams, make a bracket and spread it out at one location over 2 weekends. Have all day games Thursday, Friday and Saturday. Single elimination, take the NCAA format and you have yourself a mini March Madness. You have a full arena, filled up hotels, fans mingling in the park lot, restaurants and hotel lobbies. You would have the tv news vans parked outside the venue and excitement. It would be a sports mardi gras. And don't try a feed me that tripe about it being too hard to seed that many teams, bs. You put 20 people (Coaches, athletic directors and some media) in a room for 4 hours and boom, done! It's far less costly and much easier. Besides infusing some desperately needed excitement you take away some fans having to drive 4 hours round trip twice in three days to watch a team that can afford to "Only lose once". YAWN!     

On a personal note, you're a bit uptight about staying in the lane of these threads. I've noticed a few times you get bothered if the post wander off topic. On this one you ask a question then give very specific guidelines for answering. You are a bit regimented aren't you? Some may say anal retentive, were you potty trained at gunpoint?

I can somewhat agree with your proposal with the large amount of teams making it in, and yes seedings shouldn't be a problem considering they should be ranked by their conference already. All it would take would to randomize the bracket to spread the conferences out evenly across the board. Now the urgency point I have this to say, I understand what you mean by saying the top 2 seeds in the district tournament have nothing to play for. But they are playing for an "easier" game in regionals, along with a district title. Now, regionals provides huge urgency for the first game, which I somewhat not agree with. If you win your district tournament, you shouldn't be thrown back into the lions den and be in a do-or-die situation just to make it to state. You are in the same boat as the teams who didn't win district and that's not right in my book. All systems have flaws, I guess we just have to tolerate it lol

[JessieP]

I can somewhat agree with your proposal with the large amount of teams making it in, and yes seedings shouldn't be a problem considering they should be ranked by their conference already. All it would take would to randomize the bracket to spread the conferences out evenly across the board. Now the urgency point I have this to say, I understand what you mean by saying the top 2 seeds in the district tournament have nothing to play for. But they are playing for an "easier" game in regionals, along with a district title. Now, regionals provides huge urgency for the first game, which I somewhat not agree with. If you win your district tournament, you shouldn't be thrown back into the lions den and be in a do-or-die situation just to make it to state. You are in the same boat as the teams who didn't win district and that's not right in my book. All systems have flaws, I guess we just have to tolerate it lol

I agree with that but my point is the currant process is very forgiving and fosters some, not a lot but some, "going through the motions". If it's win or go home no way Batesville loses a game in district. I do not mean that as a knock or smack talk but rather statement of fact. The time to work out the bugs or have an off night is why we play a regular season. The post season is supposed to take it out for a spin. Right now it's winning time, it's time to get serious. The previous 2 weeks served as little more then a state tournament warm up. IMO it's a waste of time, energy, gas and money. The last 2 weeks felt like the 2 week gap before the Super Bowl, sure it applied to the big event but it tends to drag on.

[Bulldog92]

I ask because I want feedback from a different perspective. This is the only way 4A folks have known.  Being in NEA, we have team here that go straight to state and it's always fun to discuss this topic with them as well.

IMO - District tournaments can be forgone. Regionals serve the purpose as being discussed about Harrison. If a 1 seed can't beat another districts 4 seed, then that 1 seed didn't deserve a chance to play for a state championship.

That might not sit well, but state tournaments are single elimination tournament as well.

Forgive me for posting on a 5A only thread but the 8-4A hasn't had a District Tournamnet except when the AAA split us up with the 3A schools and we had to determine our seating for the regional. We normally, like this year, play each conference opponent twice and how you fall in conference determines wether you make it to regionals and your seating. Most schools that host District Tournaments will probably tell you it is non profitable!!!  District tournaments usually on benefit teams that sit in the 5-6 hole and hurt the 3-4 seeds. Just my two cents and as you can tell I am not for District Tournamnets.

[JessieP]

All that was duly noted. Potty training was difficult for me, but I believe I have mastered the process.

Ok, now you're back in form. Baiting, discussing games, debating teams and general hoops knowledge is your strong point. Hall monitor, not so much, lol.

[J12]

Ok, now you're back in form. Baiting, discussing games, debating teams and general hoops knowledge is your strong point. Hall monitor, not so much, lol.

You're right. I overstepped a bit. Still a work in progress.

[millsalum]

I can somewhat agree with your proposal with the large amount of teams making it in, and yes seedings shouldn't be a problem considering they should be ranked by their conference already. All it would take would to randomize the bracket to spread the conferences out evenly across the board. Now the urgency point I have this to say, I understand what you mean by saying the top 2 seeds in the district tournament have nothing to play for. But they are playing for an "easier" game in regionals, along with a district title. Now, regionals provides huge urgency for the first game, which I somewhat not agree with. If you win your district tournament, you shouldn't be thrown back into the lions den and be in a do-or-die situation just to make it to state. You are in the same boat as the teams who didn't win district and that's not right in my book. All systems have flaws, I guess we just have to tolerate it lol

This is the point I'm trying to make about conference champions, specifically Harrison. I don't think that's fair to them. But what IS fair nowadays 
It didn't make any difference to the team I follow though; they won their region.

I'd like to point this out: There are 48 teams in 4A, and 6 conferences. Perfect math to split the teams up, right?
But there aren't an even number of teams in each conference. 4A-5 has a 9 team conference, and the 4A-1 does too.
Wouldn't it be easier to have four 12 team conferences, cut the non conference schedule by a few games, and have them go round robin and take the best 4 from each conference to a 16 team state? Just a thought.

[J12]

This is the point I'm trying to make about conference champions, specifically Harrison. I don't think that's fair to them. But what IS fair nowadays 
It didn't make any difference to the team I follow though; they won their region.

I'd like to point this out: There are 48 teams in 4A, and 6 conferences. Perfect math to split the teams up, right?
But there aren't an even number of teams in each conference. 4A-5 has a 9 team conference, and the 4A-1 does too.
Wouldn't it be easier to have four 12 team conferences, cut the non conference schedule by a few games, and have them go round robin and take the best 4 from each conference to a 16 team state? Just a thought.

Something like that. But you have to realize, we're one year removed from having a blended conference. In all their infinite wisdom, teams played all regular season, then at the end went on their separate ways.  You could have legit had 2 teams from one "conference" win a state championship in different classifications.

We played teams in district that we didn't plays ONCE all year. Must win game at that. Ask Stuttgart and Waldron how that worked. So this format s much better than last year.

[millsalum]

Something like that. But you have to realize, we're one year removed from having a blended conference. In all their infinite wisdom, teams played all regular season, then at the end went on their separate ways.  You could have legit had 2 teams from one "conference" win a state championship in different classifications.

We played teams in district that we didn't plays ONCE all year. Must win game at that. Ask Stuttgart and Waldron how that worked. So this format s much better than last year.

I remember the blended conferences. Mills was in a blended conference last year, with former 6A schools like Pine Bluff and Sheridan. What was the purpose of that in the first place?

[Former, Coach Jacobs]

The 4A-5 has it right on this one.

District tournaments aren't necessary IMO. It makes the regular season, round robin conference play, pretty meaningless.

Take the top 4 seeds from the regular season conference play to regionals.

If there is a tie between 4 and 5, then on the Saturday night before regionals, have a play in game, at the regular season conference champions gym, or have it on rotation.

If there is a tie between 4, 5, and 6, then go by tie-breaker points, and then play the above game between 4 and 5.

No one week should outweigh the importance of 8 weeks of play.

[J12]

I remember the blended conferences. Mills was in a blended conference last year, with former 6A schools like Pine Bluff and Sheridan. What was the purpose of that in the first place?

Less travel.

[Gray lizard]

I have to agree this year was much better than the blended 4A/3A of last season.
This is basketball.  Why the heck would you want less games?  I like district, regional, and state.  I get to see a lot of games and schools I might not get to see otherwise.
The district makes sure the best 4 teams at the end of the season are moving on. A team could get a injured player back that missed the early season. A team could also lose a dominate player to injury late season.  In high school ball one player can be a factor.

[sevenof400]

All that was duly noted. Potty training was difficult for me, but I believe I have mastered the process.

Please, NO photos.

[NEA Razorback olfan]

Having a District, Regional, then State  makes more money for the AAA

[Missco]

The AAA makes zero from the District Tournament's.

[Gray lizard]

The AAA makes zero from the District Tournament's.

The AAA makes up for district by splitting regional and state Saturday games into two sessions.

[Bulldog92]

No one makes money off of District Tournaments but the Refs!!!!

[NEA Razorback olfan]

No one makes money off of District Tournaments but the Refs!!!!

True

[JessieP]

The AAA makes up for district by splitting regional and state Saturday games into two sessions.

Now on this point, and this point only, I will stand up for the AAA. It's a common whine that the AAA does things for money. Trust me or better yet do a little digging. High school sports is a money maker for NO ONE. The $5 admission charge at games simply offsets the losses. I once foolishly confronted our past Superintendent about that, he laughed at the accusation. I was given a quick lesson in high school economics. Let's take a quick look at the East Regional at Highland. A nice newer gym like Highland's uses a lot of electricity, a lot. A very conservative estimation, helped by a friend for works for Entergy, would shock you. He estimates that it would cost about $700 a day for a gym that size. It uses a lot of lights and heating/air. That's just the power. Let's say there were 500 people there for the Championship, there weren't but let's say 500. Knowing a lot of people don't pay to get in let's stay with 500 that's $2,500. 25% just to turn on the lights? How about water? A lot of sinks and toilets, Insurance, security, food and about 20 other various cost and you can see how the admission gate makes nothing. Every single high school sport in every city in every state loses money. The AAA makes zero profit, the measly price they charge for tickets serves only to slow the bleeding. To say the AAA does things for money is ludicrous, it's laughable.

[cannon]

I liked it.  It didn't necessarily matter for my home team, but it was a nice opportunity to catch some extra games at a venue I was willing to drive to.  I love watching good games, and I really don't care if it's boys or girls, or for that matter who's boys or girls, although I do occasionally have to show up for work.  For those who are from either of the north corners of the state that have not had the PRIVILEGE of visiting Magnolia, AR, it's a bit remote, and if you drive down there for a game, you'll not be reporting for duty the next morning.  I would have driven to Highland to watch games I didn't have a team playing in.  I would NOT drive to Magnolia for that, so I think it was a plus for fans who got to see some teams play that they otherwise probably wouldn't get to watch. 

My impression has been that it was much easier to make it farther at the 5A level, because a single win at the district level guaranteed a birth at the state tournament, which meant that you were competing against teams you were familiar with and had a 50/50 chance of making it, all other things being equal.  With the addition of the regional, a 5 cede team had to win at least 3 games to advance, which is exponentially more difficult. 

The only complaint I have about the whole process (which is way off topic) is that I believe that a 4A classification should have seating capacity requirements for district tournaments, as well as regionals (read:  thank you Westside, Brookland, and Batesville for completely blowing out gyms seating less than 1,500).  I like a packed house, but I'm pretty sure that any fire marshal worth his salt would've shut Pokey down by what he could see from the parking lot.  The Highland venue was good for the crowd size in attendance, but Pocahontas (while a very nice community with great fans), just doesn't have enough seats for the number of butts trying to get in the door.  IMHO, the random rotation should be limited to gyms with a seating capacity close or equal to those required for regionals. 

[J12]

If it makes you feel better, we had district at Harrisburg last year.  For the championship game, we had to arrive an hour before the girls game to get a seat at that Cracker Jack thing.  And it was raining, guess who had a leaky roof?

Agreed on district venues, but we have to be fair, right? 

[JessieP]

I liked it.  It didn't necessarily matter for my home team, but it was a nice opportunity to catch some extra games at a venue I was willing to drive to.  I love watching good games, and I really don't care if it's boys or girls, or for that matter who's boys or girls, although I do occasionally have to show up for work.  For those who are from either of the north corners of the state that have not had the PRIVILEGE of visiting Magnolia, AR, it's a bit remote, and if you drive down there for a game, you'll not be reporting for duty the next morning.  I would have driven to Highland to watch games I didn't have a team playing in.  I would NOT drive to Magnolia for that, so I think it was a plus for fans who got to see some teams play that they otherwise probably wouldn't get to watch. 

My impression has been that it was much easier to make it farther at the 5A level, because a single win at the district level guaranteed a birth at the state tournament, which meant that you were competing against teams you were familiar with and had a 50/50 chance of making it, all other things being equal.  With the addition of the regional, a 5 cede team had to win at least 3 games to advance, which is exponentially more difficult. 

The only complaint I have about the whole process (which is way off topic) is that I believe that a 4A classification should have seating capacity requirements for district tournaments, as well as regionals (read:  thank you Westside, Brookland, and Batesville for completely blowing out gyms seating less than 1,500).  I like a packed house, but I'm pretty sure that any fire marshal worth his salt would've shut Pokey down by what he could see from the parking lot.  The Highland venue was good for the crowd size in attendance, but Pocahontas (while a very nice community with great fans), just doesn't have enough seats for the number of butts trying to get in the door.  IMHO, the random rotation should be limited to gyms with a seating capacity close or equal to those required for regionals.

Batesville does have a rabid fan base. Coming home from Highland we were in a caravan of about 20 cars and that was a small minority of those who attended. Pioneer Nation travels well. There were many football games where we had more fans than the home team. Having said that, have you seen our gym? They wanted to film Hoosiers there but decided it was too old and creaky. We spend $500,000 every few years on new turf for the football field but our gym is bad. I have heard people say it looks like an outdated 1A gym. There is a millage bill to get a new one and it should pass but our gym couldn't host 5th grade tournament. 

[sevenof400]

Now on this point, and this point only, I will stand up for the AAA. It's a common whine that the AAA does things for money. Trust me or better yet do a little digging. High school sports is a money maker for NO ONE. The $5 admission charge at games simply offsets the losses. I once foolishly confronted our past Superintendent about that, he laughed at the accusation. I was given a quick lesson in high school economics. Let's take a quick look at the East Regional at Highland. A nice newer gym like Highland's uses a lot of electricity, a lot. A very conservative estimation, helped by a friend for works for Entergy, would shock you. He estimates that it would cost about $700 a day for a gym that size. It uses a lot of lights and heating/air. That's just the power. Let's say there were 500 people there for the Championship, there weren't but let's say 500. Knowing a lot of people don't pay to get in let's stay with 500 that's $2,500. 25% just to turn on the lights? How about water? A lot of sinks and toilets, Insurance, security, food and about 20 other various cost and you can see how the admission gate makes nothing. Every single high school sport in every city in every state loses money. The AAA makes zero profit, the measly price they charge for tickets serves only to slow the bleeding. To say the AAA does things for money is ludicrous, it's laughable.

Let's run with this for a bit.  Since my primary school affiliation is 5A, we don't have the experience with District, then Regionals so I cannot speak from experience on that point.  But I can tell you that AAA does make lots of money on the state tournament.  Why?  In order to secure the bid, most schools have to agree to hand over the entire gate to AAA.  From that haul, AAA pays for the referees and awards.  The rest remains with AAA. 

Jessie, I think your point above is spot on - from the point of view of the host school. 

AAA makes money on the various state tournaments because the bid process is slanted toward AAA in just about every possible way. 

[sevenof400]

....  The Highland venue was good for the crowd size in attendance, but Pocahontas (while a very nice community with great fans), just doesn't have enough seats for the number of butts trying to get in the door.  IMHO, the random rotation should be limited to gyms with a seating capacity close or equal to those required for regionals.

FWIW: AAA has stated minimums in their bid criteria BUT when no one else bids, AAA has (and will) overlook the stated minimums. 
It's all about the money with AAA.

[JessieP]

Let's run with this for a bit.  Since my primary school affiliation is 5A, we don't have the experience with District, then Regionals so I cannot speak from experience on that point.  But I can tell you that AAA does make lots of money on the state tournament.  Why?  In order to secure the bid, most schools have to agree to hand over the entire gate to AAA.  From that haul, AAA pays for the referees and awards.  The rest remains with AAA. 

Jessie, I think your point above is spot on - from the point of view of the host school. 

AAA makes money on the various state tournaments because the bid process is slanted toward AAA in just about every possible way.

I guess we have differing opinions on lots of money. A couple years ago someone posted the financials after filing a FOI suit, it was a far cry from "Lot's of money". They actually had fairly reasonable administrative cost, just a handful of salaries (most in line with what teachers make), office supplies, travel expenses for paid employees (approximately 6 people), trophy's, officials and insurance. That's the killer, they carry a general liability umbrella policy (whenever people gather you need insurance) that was quite high and if I remember correctly the killer was the WMS rental for football championships. That is a five figure hit per day. I stand my my initial post that the AAA is a big money making enterprise.

Mind you this is coming from a person who thinks the AAA is a joke. A group of people who's sole mission is making rules they have no intention of enforcing for the private schools. The AAA is a joke (Insert the video of Jim Mora saying "Playoffs" but insert "Boundaries" instead of playoffs). I don't know if anyone remembers this but the day after 9/11 the Taliban condemned the attacks and said if they knew where Bin Laden was they would turn him over. Bin Laden was the Taliban, it was the joke of the decade. I had more faith in that happening then I do the AAA ever disciplining a high profile private school. On this one, agree to disagree.

Besides, they need money to retrofit every school with a shot clock very soon. (Only Seven and I will get that joke) 

[MikeDiesel™]

I have to agree this year was much better than the blended 4A/3A of last season.
This is basketball.  Why the heck would you want less games?  I like district, regional, and state.  I get to see a lot of games and schools I might not get to see otherwise.
The district makes sure the best 4 teams at the end of the season are moving on. A team could get a injured player back that missed the early season. A team could also lose a dominate player to injury late season.  In high school ball one player can be a factor.

The extreme of this can be when 9th graders are very good and join the sr high team for the postseason.  I watched EPC have the worst team in conference one year, but brought up Monk, Lacy, and Boo for the postseason and won the district tournament and made it to state.

[J12]

The extreme of this can be when 9th graders are very good and join the sr high team for the postseason.  I watched EPC have the worst team in conference one year, but brought up Monk, Lacy, and Boo for the postseason and won the district tournament and made it to state.

I remember this! Everyone talked about it too.

I remember when they fire marshalled Valley View's gym for the district tournament when they played Gosnell in the finals.

[JessieP]

I'm sorry J12, I never answered your question directly. 4A playoff system? Baad Baad, not gonna support it, wouldn't be prudent at this junction. 1,000 points of light not flickering. Line 'em up and thin the herd by half after each round. Pyramid from 32 to 1, last man standing is fair, clean and American. Who came up with the currant format, FIFA?

[J12]

Ha! I'm picking up what you're laying down.

I wanted all feedback.  It's a very odd system to explain to people from out of state especially. Not sure if surrounding states do it like this or not, but the reactions I get are funny.

[JessieP]

Ha! I'm picking up what you're laying down.

I wanted all feedback.  It's a very odd system to explain to people from out of state especially. Not sure if surrounding states do it like this or not, but the reactions I get are funny.

Spot on. I was explaining (trying to) it to a friend in Chicago and his reaction was "why, what is the reasoning behind that"? I told him I've had it explained to me how it works but never why. I get the nuts and bolts of it but what is the benefit of it? I would but the money excuse if they were getting 3,000 people a game @$25.00 a pop but 500-1,000 at $5 no one is buying a Gulfstream with those dollars.

[boss85]

Something like that. But you have to realize, we're one year removed from having a blended conference. In all their infinite wisdom, teams played all regular season, then at the end went on their separate ways.  You could have legit had 2 teams from one "conference" win a state championship in different classifications.

We played teams in district that we didn't plays ONCE all year. Must win game at that. Ask Stuttgart and Waldron how that worked. So this format s much better than last year.

Two teams from the same conference did win state tournaments two years ago. Pocahontas and Hoxie girls both won state championships out of the same blended conference.

[Ponca]

Harrison did not make State due to loss to the 4th best team in the 4-4A and all othe 4-1A teams also lost and did not advance.

This was the worst Harrison boys team in 25 years. The fact that they won district should get Coach Stahler coach of the year.

[sevenof400]

As a bit of an aside (or two), I wish Arkansas would adapt Indiana's old model of state playoffs - all schools in one playoff bracket.  That was a magical format and one of the more enduring symbols from the one class state tournament was a board that had a map of Indiana with a light bulb at the approximate location of each school in the state.  As a school was eliminated, their light would be turned off. 

This format would have so many advantages in Arkansas as it would allow more games to be attended in person (larger gates) and when the smaller school beat the larger school those teams would be remembered for years. 

And on a note to Jessie - I did catch that!  Well played! 

[JessieP]

As a bit of an aside (or two), I wish Arkansas would adapt Indiana's old model of state playoffs - all schools in one playoff bracket.  That was a magical format and one of the more enduring symbols from the one class state tournament was a board that had a map of Indiana with a light bulb at the approximate location of each school in the state.  As a school was eliminated, their light would be turned off. 

This format would have so many advantages in Arkansas as it would allow more games to be attended in person (larger gates) and when the smaller school beat the larger school those teams would be remembered for years. 

And on a note to Jessie - I did catch that!  Well played!

I would embrace that. Like my idea it would create some much needed excitement. With the rabid sports fans we have here in Arkansas you have all the ingredients to create a carnival like experience. Can you imagine a 2 weekend March Madness type event? You would see fans, colors, bands and student sections from all across the state converging in one area. Imagine the excitement at Hot Springs if every team met there for wall to wall games over 3 weekends (6 day's)?

[wait4it]

Conference play for seeding.  Everyone goes to "postsesason" tournament (48 teams).  3 sites for a two week tournament.  1st and 2nd site serve as "regional".  3rd site can serve as "state".  Allows for the 1-seed and 2-seed in each conference to have chance to make "state" tournament.  Will eliminate weaker teams and more closely follows an NCAA format (to a point). 

[yesteryearman]

I would embrace that. Like my idea it would create some much needed excitement. With the rabid sports fans we have here in Arkansas you have all the ingredients to create a carnival like experience. Can you imagine a 2 weekend March Madness type event? You would see fans, colors, bands and student sections from all across the state converging in one area. Imagine the excitement at Hot Springs if every team met there for wall to wall games over 3 weekends (6 day's)?

Do 4A schools really want to include a 1A ICC and see them beat everyone except possibly 6A/7A......?  I don't think so........sure it would only happen every once in awhile,  but truthfully, more often than people would think.    One on hand it could make for tournament with some excitement, on other hand would be embarrassing for 2A, 3A, 4A, 5A.........

[Missco]

Basketball is a different animal. School size doesnt matter as much. 6 classes is way too many. Arkansas needs 4.

[JessieP]

Do 4A schools really want to include a 1A ICC and see them beat everyone except possibly 6A/7A......?  I don't think so........sure it would only happen every once in awhile,  but truthfully, more often than people would think.    One on hand it could make for tournament with some excitement, on other hand would be embarrassing for 2A, 3A, 4A, 5A.........

ICC would beat 2A, 3A and some 4A teams. They wouldn't make the final 4 of 5A. The 6A? they wouldn't qualify for post season. Every 5 or 10 years they may win it all but that would be a major major shocker. A Hollywood movie, lead story on ESPN type shocker it would dwarf the Autistic kid who made 10 3's story. Put it this way, Max Preps has them as the 22nd ranked team in the state and the general feeling is that that's a very generous inflated number.

[J12]

ICC would beat 2A, 3A and some 4A teams. They wouldn't make the final 4 of 5A. The 6A? they wouldn't qualify for post season. Every 5 or 10 years they may win it all but that would be a major major shocker. A Hollywood movie, lead story on ESPN type shocker it would dwarf the Autistic kid who made 10 3's story. Put it this way, Max Preps has them as the 22nd ranked team in the state and the general feeling is that that's a very generous inflated number.

About 15 years ago, someone at Jonesboro HS agreed to play a school called Weiner, 1A school (since then they have closed and consolidated) at Weiner.

Weiner might have gone on to win the state championship that year & JHS had an average team. JHS lost to that Weiner team and it was HUGE news. Really ruined any chances of Jonesboro HS scheduling other teams around here, especially at an opposing gymnasium.

An overall state tournament would be good for each classification winners to play and crown and "overall". But yes, every 20 years or so you might have a 1A/2A team beat a 5A/6A average team. Let alone another state champion of a classification.

[boss85]

One of ICC losses this year was to Westside which is the 4th seed from their region. Theoretically ICC might not make the state tournament at all playing against the likes of Mills, Blytheville and McClellan int the region. Plus they got beat back to back days against Conway and Marion, good 6a and 5a schools. ICC will win the title in 1a, but probably nothing above 2a this year at least.