Are there any other Astros fans on here?
My Cowboys, Lakers, Razorbacks, etc have been quite successful. But my Astros............
I started following them in the early 70s. Dierker, Cedeno, Watson, Wilson, etc.
I got to watch many games in the dome. Got to see Nolan Ryan and J.R. Richard pitch along with Niekro, Bannister, Forsch, Lemongello for the home team. Seaver, Carlton, Perry, Niekro, Sutton (for both) among others pitch against.
Bench, Stargell, Morgan, Concepcion, Schmidt, Rose, Brock, Murphy, Winfield, Dawson among others bat in the dome. Saw many including Gene Tenace trying to hit the roof during BP. I thought it was so cool.
Got to see the Ryan-Scott Astros then the Biggio-Bagwell killer Bs. Finally, Clemens and Johnson led teams.
Enough reminiscing about those days when the Astros were occasionally good. They are absolutely on fire now and I am getting to enjoy being a fan of the oftentimes doormat of the league. love Altuve, Correa, Springer, Keuchal, and the rest.
So, again, any Astros fans on this board?
Cubs fan... We stink again haha. I like the thread though! Who else do people call their team though? I miss the Astros in the NL Central sometime. I think they fit now in that AL West just fine now though. The Texas rivalry all the time now with the Rangers.
Maybe. But you got the title last year!
I hated the idea of going to the AL originally. I guess winning solved it for me. And I do enjoy the rivalry with the Rangers.
Mostly Cardinals fans in here. Just checking for fans of Astros or others.
I hated the Astros!! ;D
Big Red Machine here. I grew up 50 miles from Riverfront stadium so I went to many games. Rose, Bench, Morgan, Perez, Foster, Griffey , Concepcion were who I cut my teeth on as a child. The Astros always played the Reds hard. Cruz, Bergman, Ashby, Cedeno, Andujar, Richard, Scott, Ryan had some great teams.
I moved to Arkansas in '88. Married my Razorback bride in '92. We went to Houston for a long weekend in '94 to watch the Reds v Astros. As we walked in the dome the guy taking tickets said to my wife " he looks like a kid in a candy store". I was so excited to be seeing my beloved Reds and especially in the dome that I had always seen on TV and wanted to visit. The city of Houston was electric because the Rockets had just won the NBA championship. We had a blast.
Quote from: LRRandy on July 15, 2017, 04:51:19 pm
I hated the Astros!! ;D
Big Red Machine here. I grew up 50 miles from Riverfront stadium so I went to many games. Rose, Bench, Morgan, Perez, Foster, Griffey , Concepcion were who I cut my teeth on as a child. The Astros always played the Reds hard. Cruz, Bergman, Ashby, Cedeno, Andujar, Richard, Scott, Ryan had some great teams.
I moved to Arkansas in '88. Married my Razorback bride in '92. We went to Houston for a long weekend in '94 to watch the Reds v Astros. As we walked in the dome the guy taking tickets said to my wife " he looks like a kid in a candy store". I was so excited to be seeing my beloved Reds and especially in the dome that I had always seen on TV and wanted to visit. The city of Houston was electric because the Rockets had just won the NBA championship. We had a blast.
Cincy is quietly a GREAT sports town. They love their Reds and even when the Bengals stink they show up. Also, most don't but I follow soccer and their team Cincinnati FC is not even an MLS team but their following is so good they will probably become MLS soon. One of their games at Nippert was on ESPN a month ago and sold out. I hope they become MLS soon with a following like that in Cincy.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on July 15, 2017, 03:46:42 pm
Maybe. But you got the title last year!
I hated the idea of going to the AL originally. I guess winning solved it for me. And I do enjoy the rivalry with the Rangers.
Mostly Cardinals fans in here. Just checking for fans of Astros or others.
Oh yes Arkansas is Cards country. I am up in NWA and you are starting to see more and more Royals fans pop up especially with the AA Naturals in Springdale. But still the Cards rule. I notice even Cards fans outnumber Rangers fans even in southern Arkansas. Braves fans seem to be another popular one when they used to play them on TBS in this area in the 90's when they were rolling. The Braves have been so bad lately though.
Quote from: LRRandy on July 15, 2017, 04:51:19 pm
I hated the Astros!! ;D
Big Red Machine here. I grew up 50 miles from Riverfront stadium so I went to many games. Rose, Bench, Morgan, Perez, Foster, Griffey , Concepcion were who I cut my teeth on as a child. The Astros always played the Reds hard. Cruz, Bergman, Ashby, Cedeno, Andujar, Richard, Scott, Ryan had some great teams.
I moved to Arkansas in '88. Married my Razorback bride in '92. We went to Houston for a long weekend in '94 to watch the Reds v Astros. As we walked in the dome the guy taking tickets said to my wife " he looks like a kid in a candy store". I was so excited to be seeing my beloved Reds and especially in the dome that I had always seen on TV and wanted to visit. The city of Houston was electric because the Rockets had just won the NBA championship. We had a blast.
I went to some Reds games during the late 70s, early 80s, but especially the strike season. Dome was packed. And as you said, it was electric. I got a number of autographs but was more excited about Andujar's than any.
I hated the Reds but still believe that that lineup was the best ever. Rose, Morgan, Griffey, Bench, Foster, Perez, Concepcion, Geronimo was so tough. With more pitching they could have been the greatest team ever. Hated yet respected their greatness.
I've also attended a Mets game in mid 70s when Astros were absolutely terrible. About 3000 fans as announced attendance. By the 16th inning we could only count about 20 of us in the dome. But it was still a blast.
The Killer B's....
Came close twice......but no cigar. White Sox in series and even RJ couldn't pitch us past the Padres.
Geaux 'Streauxs!
Went to the Dome in '69. Took my son back in '99 when he was about the same age I was then.
These went the wrong way, but were classics:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_National_League_Championship_Series
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_National_League_Championship_Series
I remember watching one of Ryan's no hitters on the Saturday Game of the Week. Terry Puhl made a great catch in right field to save a hit. https://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/HOU/HOU198109260.shtml
Yes! I always thought those NL championship series vs. Mets and Phillies are still the best I've seen.
Puhl was a fine player.
Who started on the mound in that 69 game?
The Cardinals are my #1 sports team. I love them even more than I love the Razorbacks. That said, I think the Astros win the World Series this year.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on July 15, 2017, 08:22:01 pm
Yes! I always thought those NL championship series vs. Mets and Phillies are still the best I've seen.
Puhl was a fine player.
Who started on the mound in that 69 game?
I'm afraid I don't remember a lot of details of that Astrodome trip since I was less than 10 years old. I do remember it was against the Dodgers and one never forgets coming out of one of those grandstand tunnels and seeing a major league field for the first time.
Agreed. Was awesome for sure for me as well.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/HOU/1969-roster.shtml
I was a Joe Morgan fan because of the elbow flap. Got to see the Toy Cannon.
Quote from: bleudog on July 15, 2017, 09:20:06 pm
I'm afraid I don't remember a lot of details of that Astrodome trip since I was less than 10 years old. I do remember it was against the Dodgers and one never forgets coming out of of those grandstand tunnels and seeing a major league field for the first time.
that is exactly right. I can still remember that second grade field trip in 1973. Day game against the SF Giants at Riverfront stadium. Seeing all those colors of the different levels of seats, the scoreboard and how big it was compared to my small child self. I don't remember much from 1973. But I remember those sights from that day.
Loved Joe Morgan as a player! Got to see him play for Cinci, Houston the second time, and for Philadelphia. But weirdly enough, my earliest memories of the dome were with Elvis Presley and Disney on Parade. Astros came shortly thereafter for me.
Here is a youtube vid. It is not mine but I must have been seated within 100 feet of these folks.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rMn_gDb6cg
Quote from: beach bum on July 15, 2017, 05:29:46 pm
Braves fans seem to be another popular one when they used to play them on TBS
Every day. I grew up a Braves fan because of this, even though they were terrible through most of the 80's. Dale Murphy is my favorite player of all time.
I'm also a Red Sox fan by proxy. My son's favorite player is Dustin Pedroia, so as he became interested in the Sox I started watching more and more of their games.
Mariners fan here, so not so high on the Astros haha! But they are a machine.
Started with Griffey and then Ichiro was my second favorite player.
Loved Dale Murphy.
My oldest brother took me to a Red Sox vs Royals game. Got to watch Yaz, Brett, Rice, Boggs, Evans play. Yaz knocked in the winning run. KC fans cheered like crazy. Yaz' final series of career in KC.
Randy Johnson, Junior, A-Rod, Ichiro......lots of greats.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on July 17, 2017, 04:43:58 pm
Loved Dale Murphy.
My oldest brother took me to a Red Sox vs Royals game. Got to watch Yaz, Brett, Rice, Boggs, Evans play. Yaz knocked in the winning run. KC fans cheered like crazy. Yaz' final series of career in KC.
Went to a couple of Oakland vs KC games in 1972 as a pre-teen. Ended up staying in the same hotel as the A's and was in autograph Heaven.
Catfish Hunter
Reggie Jackson
Vida Blue (my Dad took me back for the second game to see Blue pitch)
Rollie Fingers
Sal Bando
Bert Campaneris
Dave Duncan
Joe Rudi
Blue Moon Odom
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_Oakland_Athletics_season
That was the first of the three-peat.
About the only Royal I can remember was Lou Piniella. The games were played in the downtown stadium. They moved to Kauffman Stadium the next year.
Great thread. By the names of players I'm seeing you guys post we seem to be about the same age (52) for sure the same era. Time demands and distance from Cincy has caused my familiarity with the team and thus my level of fandome to wain. I loved following the Red's growing up but even as the Red's were winning the '90 World Series I was preoccupied with a beautiful blonde Arkansan that I was dating ( celebrate 26 years tomorrow) and didn't watch every inning of that World Series like I should have.
Random memory.
During batting practice we would sneak down to the edge of the third base dugout to try and get autographs from the opposing team. The Padres were in town and I got Oscar Gamble to sign. I remember their young shortstop has his first name on the back of his jersey instead of his last name. Ozzie.
Thanks for the posts. It's been fun walking down memory lane to a great part of my youth.
Yes, that Oakland team was incredible. Great memories indeed.
Yep. I'm 52 as well. Loving the discussion myself.
Quote from: bleudog on July 17, 2017, 05:30:17 pm
Went to a couple of Oakland vs KC games in 1972 as a pre-teen. Ended up staying in the same hotel as the A's and was in autograph Heaven.
Catfish Hunter
Reggie Jackson
Vida Blue (my Dad took me back for the second game to see Blue pitch)
Rollie Fingers
Sal Bando
Bert Campaneris
Dave Duncan
Joe Rudi
Blue Moon Odom
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_Oakland_Athletics_season
That was the first of the three-peat.
About the only Royal I can remember was Lou Piniella. The games were played in the downtown stadium. They moved to Kauffman Stadium the next year.
Speaking of autographs, I've got some nice ones but remember being excited to get Stretch Suba's and Mike Fischlin's. Bullpen catcher and short term utility infielder. Can't replace childhood excitement.
Ozzie Smith! Truly great autograph if you were able to get it.
Quote from: dc24 on July 17, 2017, 04:40:37 pm
Mariners fan here, so not so high on the Astros haha! But they are a machine.
Started with Griffey and then Ichiro was my second favorite player.
My machine ran into a buzz saw last night. Great game.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on July 18, 2017, 09:19:45 am
My machine ran into a buzz saw last night. Great game.
Yeah, that was a great game, I'm happy with one win, I'd be ecstatic with a win in one of the next two for the series.
I am more concerned with mounting injuries. Correa hurting again along with all the pitchers. I really think it is the biggest obstacle that faces this group this season.
http://m.astros.mlb.com/news/article/242714922/dallas-keuchel-is-ready-to-return-after-rehab/
Hoping he remains healthy the rest of the way.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on July 18, 2017, 12:23:23 pm
I am more concerned with mounting injuries. Correa hurting again along with all the pitchers. I really think it is the biggest obstacle that faces this group this season.
Big blow with losing Correa, but if there's a team that can overcome it, it would be Houston. I think Keuchel is key to them because he's their "ace" and it seems like to go through the playoffs you need at least one shutdown guy along with a strong bullpen. Houston's other starters are good, but McCullars is the closest thing to an ace and I don't think he's quite there yet.
All that said though, you're really grasping for straws trying to find a real "weakness." If they aren't fully healthy though, that can definitely change things.
https://twitter.com/astros/status/887497117014667264
Big weekend for longtime Astros fans. Bagwell joins Biggio in HOF.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on July 30, 2017, 11:30:46 am
Big weekend for longtime Astros fans. Bagwell joins Biggio in HOF.
Love what they did in front of the stadium. There are statues of both. They are 90 feet apart.
Last day of my vacation in Houston and we're going to the Rays/Astros game tonight. First ever big league ball game
Quote from: Longfellow on August 01, 2017, 09:44:49 am
Last day of my vacation in Houston and we're going to the Rays/Astros game tonight. First ever big league ball game
Have a big time. (That is if you'll accept well wishes from a Dragon fan)
Astros will get beat in the post-seasons. Yankees will win the world series this year against the LA Dodgers in game 7.
Quote from: Longfellow on August 01, 2017, 09:44:49 am
Last day of my vacation in Houston and we're going to the Rays/Astros game tonight. First ever big league ball game
Hope you had a blast!
Been so busy with work that I haven't been on here in a few days. The game was great!! The Astros lost, but I saw Evan Longoria hit for the cycle, and there were 4 or 5 highlight reel catches. We took the stadium tour and watched BP as well. Overall great experience at my first pro baseball game
That's awesome! So glad you got to do it and hope it is the first of many.
Your post made me remember my first MLB game. Was in the Astrodome. Just wow. Great memories.
Looks their pitching just got a lot better they aquired Justin Verlander from the Tigers
I'm glad they took a chance. Now to get Correa and McCullers back.....
Quote from: BigLion10 on September 01, 2017, 07:42:29 am
Looks their pitching just got a lot better they aquired Justin Verlander from the Tigers
Heard that this morning. Do you know it this is a rent-a-few-months deal or something that might last awhile?
ALTUVE with three home runs thru seven in the first game with the Bo Sox.
'stros up 8-2 after seven.
Boston 2
Houston 8
Final
HOUSTON leads series 1-0
Loving it!
8-1 'stros at the seventh inning stretch of game 2 vs Boston.
Boston 2
Houston 8
Final
HOUSTON leads series 2-0
Loving it but taking it one game at a time.
'Stros just need to win the next one 8-2 too.
Fine by me!
'Stros are a fun team to watch. I'm a Cubs fan so I obviously enjoy watching Chicago first and foremost; but I am also one of those guys that can watch any baseball game that is on. From the American League, the Astros have been one of my favorite teams to watch in the recent years. Their young core are very exciting and solid. With the addition of Verlander it has helped them out tremendously. Good luck to them the rest of the way (except if they match up with the Cubs by some chance in the World Series of course!).
Three down; eight to go.
Yankees 1
'stos 2
Houston up in the series 1-0
Q: Which two pitchers did Dallas Keuchel join as the only Astros to strike out 10 or more in a postseason game?
A: Mike Scott (14 K's in Game 1 of the 1986 NLCS) and Nolan Ryan (12 K's in Game 5 of the '86 NLCS)
Keuchal pitched well. Altuve hit well. Correa and Yuli were clutch. Gonzalez had the big play. Loved it. Great game 1 as Yankee pitching was really good.
Reddick!!
...and Verlander, Altuve, and Correa!!!! Two great games so far.
Not looking good for the Astros in game 5
Yankee pitching has handcuffed Astros. I'm truly surprised.
I was hoping if they couldn't get two in NY they could at least get one.
But it ain't over til it's over.
Morton and McCullers! Wow.
And game two goes to the 'stros 7-6 in 11.
Going to Houston with a chance for the good guys to end it without having to go back to La La Land.
They'll have to beat Kershaw again to clinch in Houston, if that's the way the series goes.
Now it's best of five and the 'stros have home field.
'stros take game three 5-3.
Game 5: https://www.thescore.com/mlb/events/62113/box_score
'stros win game five in extra innings. Take a 3-2 lead to L. A.
... in thrilling fashion!
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 30, 2017, 07:44:43 am
... in thrilling fashion!
Thrilling is an understatement.
I just hope they've got enough in the tank and finish this thing up on Halloween.
Sucks they start the games so late. I never make it to all the exciting stuff.
Game 6 was incredible.
Both Verlander & Hill were dealing. The Dodgers just managed to put together 3 quality at-bats in the 6th. Hopefully Game 7 is just as good.
Also, Bregman is a dude.
Quote from: Chief_Osceola™ on November 01, 2017, 04:29:35 pm
Game 6 was incredible.
Both Verlander & Hill were dealing. The Dodgers just managed to put together 3 quality at-bats in the 6th. Hopefully Game 7 is just as good.
Also, Bregman is a dude.
If 'stros pull it out, I'd give Bregman the Series MVP.
Nothing better than a Game 7. Gonna set my alarm for midnight so I can watch last couple innings.
Well that was a quick hook for Darvish.
Nastynice if you get up at midnight it may only be in the 6th inning if the Astros keep raking like they have in the first 2 innings.
Quote from: Chief_Osceola™ on November 01, 2017, 08:14:14 pm
Well that was a quick hook for Darvish.
Nastynice if you get up at midnight it may only be in the 6th inning if the Astros keep raking like they have in the first 2 innings.
That's no joke! MVP will go to Springer if Stros win. He's a nightmare in that lead off spot. Let's Go Stros
I never understood the Dodgers wanting Darvish. They could have gotten to the WS without him. But he played in the same division as one of your most likely WS opponents. Darvish wasn't showing the 'stros anything they hadn't already seen.
Come on Astros
(https://cbshartford.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/si-cover-george-springer-4-x-3.png?w=577)
'STROS WIN!
'STROS WIN!
'STROS WIN!
HISTORY EARNED!
Stros Win!!! What a Series
What a series, indeed! Classic. I have been a fan since watching Larry Dierker and Cesar Cedeno. Then Jose Cruz. Was there in the strike season. Was there for J.R. Richard, Nolan Ryan, and the Phillies NLCS (also classic); for Mike Scott and the boys in the Mets NLCS (also classic); for the Killer Bs playoffs, for the Biggio, Bagwell WS vs. White Sox. This was a looooooong wait for a title.....and so sweet.
43, I'll see you all that and raise you the Toy Cannon and a certain 5' 7" second baseman with an elbow flap batting stance who went on to be a part of the Big Red Machine. :-)
I know, I know..... but they went to the Dodgers and Reds so I did not want to mention them. Beating the LAsordas last night was so, how can I put this, therapeutic for enduring those years when those two teams were so great and pummelled us with regularity. How could we trade Jimmy Wynn and Joe Morgan to division rivals? I mean, Joe Morgan for Tommy Helms, no less....... To this day I cannot for the life of me understand some of the things that happened back then.
104 wins in the regular and all that pay roll in LA..... All for nothing ;D
I respect the greatness and grit of that team, but...................was so happy to beat that organization!
Sutton
Yeager
Garvey
Lopes
Russell
Cey
Smith
Wynn
Monday
and company were so good in the 70s..............
Then Valenzuela beating out Ryan for Cy Young during strike season...........
Then Lasorda's handling of Jose Cruz (only player to not enter the game) and Bill Doran (not even getting chosen when at the time he was having the best year of any second baseman in the NL) in All Star games...........
Yes; I believe you could say I have a healthy disrespect for the organization as much as I respect the teams they've had.
Sorry for the interruption. Back on topic: Astros WIN!!!!
Quote from: RATTLER43 on November 02, 2017, 01:50:37 pm
I respect the greatness and grit of that team, but...................was so happy to beat that organization!
Sutton
Yeager
Garvey
Lopes
Russell
Cey
Smith
Wynn
Monday
and company were so good in the 70s..............
Then Valenzuela beating out Ryan for Cy Young during strike season...........
Then Lasorda's handling of Jose Cruz (only player to not enter the game) and Bill Doran (not even getting chosen when at the time he was having the best year of any second baseman in the NL) in All Star games...........
Yes; I believe you could say I have a healthy disrespect for the organization as much as I respect the teams they've had.
Sorry for the interruption. Back on topic: Astros WIN!!!!
I always thought it was cool when Bill Russell came to Shreveport to manage the Swamp Dragons.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/bullpen/Shreveport_Swamp_Dragons
I saw a trivia question that was kind of interesting.
The 1985 Kansas City Royals and the 2017 Houston Astros are the only two teams in baseball history to win two game sevens in one year.
The rest of the story is the League Championship format only expanded from best of five to best of seven in 1985 but I still think it sounds good.
Good stuff. But 1985 is getting further and further away from now! So it is becoming an even greater accomplishment.
http://m.mlb.com/news/article/260400478/astros-title-56-seasons-in-the-making/
Good read. Don Wilson left us too soon as well.
For J.R. Richard who was close to leading us to the promised land.....
For Dickie Thon who was on his way to greatness and was beaned.....
For Nolan Ryan and Mike Scott.....
The list is endless.
But the long-enduring fans, we are a happy bunch right now.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on November 02, 2017, 03:31:29 pm
Good read. Don Wilson left us too soon as well.
For J.R. Richard who was close to leading us to the promised land.....
For Dickie Thon who was on his way to greatness and was beaned.....
For Nolan Ryan and Mike Scott.....
The list is endless.
But the long-enduring fans, we are a happy bunch right now.
Dickie Thon and J R Richards were ball players. Truly examples of what might have been.
Yes. Stars. Richard would have been the final piece to knock off the Phillies in that series. Vern Ruhle had a great second half, but Richard was absolutely dominant.
Then Thon would have been the stud on the Nolan Ryan, Mike Scott, Bob Knepper group who lost to the Mets. Maybe the extra bat that gets us the runs to prevail in those close games.
We will never know but I know both were great for that brief period of time.
Richards played his high school ball in Ruston, LA. He was 6' 8" his senior year and nobody scored a run on him. Plus he hit four home runs in one game.
Richards and Ryan were quite the combo. Too bad most folks thought Richards' "dead arm" was just his complaining about Ryan being a million dollar man and not the precursor to the stroke it really was.
I just read an article on Richard. Not sure how he didn't win the Cy Young that year (the article blames it on split votes but just look at the stats.). He also passed the eye test for greatness. I love the part about him dominating the Dodgers!!!
https://www.astrosdaily.com/hall/Richard_JR.html
Quote from: RATTLER43 on November 02, 2017, 04:58:49 pm
I just read an article on Richard. Not sure how he didn't win the Cy Young that year (the article blames it on split votes but just look at the stats.). He also passed the eye test for greatness. I love the part about him dominating the Dodgers!!!
https://www.astrosdaily.com/hall/Richard_JR.html
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSRJHTZbYmI
Enjoyed most of the video. What a great talent.
https://www.mlb.com/video/flores-on-who-the-astros-won-for/c-1866425483
https://www.mlb.com/video/most-memorable-astros-moments/c-1866443183?tid=7417714
Quote from: RATTLER43 on November 02, 2017, 03:31:29 pm
Good read. Don Wilson left us too soon as well.
For J.R. Richard who was close to leading us to the promised land.....
For Dickie Thon who was on his way to greatness and was beaned.....
For Nolan Ryan and Mike Scott.....
The list is endless.
But the long-enduring fans, we are a happy bunch right now.
I don't think that ball Pujols hit off Lidge in 2005 has come down yet.
Quote from: bleudog on November 03, 2017, 08:10:26 pm
I don't think that ball Pujols hit off Lidge in 2005 has come down yet.
That's a running joke at our house. "Hey, it's still going......" while looking toward the sky.
Quote from: bleudog on November 03, 2017, 08:10:26 pm
I don't think that ball Pujols hit off Lidge in 2005 has come down yet.
That ball was destroyed. It took every bit of air out of the stadium with it.
This ran in the Houston paper:
(https://scontent-ort2-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/19260600_10159441533210431_6845822873251385634_n.jpg?oh=5884ebf65ffc806b6c7165e72c0b33c9&oe=5AACA84C)
Altuve, Springer win silver slugger at their respective positions.
Altuve = MVP!!!!
Altuve has been named the Player of the Year by the Sporting News and Baseball America, has won the AL Hank Aaron Award and two MLBPA Players Choice Awards for the Major League Player of the Year and the AL Most Outstanding Player. He also took home his fourth consecutive Silver Slugger Award.
Altuve, who made his fifth All-Star team, won his third career and second consecutive batting title after leading the Major Leagues with a .346 batting average. He also led the AL in hits (204) and became the first player in Major League history to be the outright leader in hits in his league in four consecutive seasons. World Series champion. American League MVP.
Quite a season and quite a player.
You gotta love it. I wonder how many execs wouldn't have given Altuve a shot because he doesn't fit the "metric."
True. He is truly amazing. Read an article that said at age 27 only Aaron, Cobb, and Rose had more hits.
Not Astros news, but MLB discussion: where is Chipper Jones on your all-time list of 3rd basemen?
I've got
Schmidt
Robinson
Brett
Chipper
Mathews
Boggs
Beltre
Top three in any order for me.
George Springer is the first player in MLB HISTORY with a leadoff homer on opening day in back-to-back seasons.
Hopefully just one of many Springer Dingers this season.
For sure!
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/mets/rusty-staub-beloved-mets-icon-dead-73-article-1.3902929
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/s/staubru01.shtml
Anti-Major league baseball fan here. haha. Just Kidding. I like to go to a game in person every once in a while. Cool to see a big league ballpark.
Astros move on...
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 08, 2018, 07:32:25 pm
Astros move on...
They're about to take it back to back!!
Quote from: beach bum on October 08, 2018, 07:33:45 pm
They're about to take it back to back!!
Sounds good to me.
...and to me.
What is your take on game 1 and Sale vs. Verlander?
Analysis and Prediction
Hoping we get to Sale. Picking Astros in 6.
Stros play well on the road. Would be nice to get at least one of the first group where it's cold. Verlander is a hoss.
Good start. It's 2-0 good guys in the bottom of the second.
Stros haiving a great top of the ninth. Up 7-2 with one out and a runner on second.
Hope Cole follows JV's gritty game with his own great game.
That's been the pattern. Hopefully it continues.
They just plain outplayed us....
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 19, 2018, 07:30:53 am
They just plain outplayed us....
Yep. But 100+ wins and a final four appearance is a lot better than it has been some years.
Agreed. And a little more focus when we return next year should be fine. I still think we are the better team..... just not in this series. Errors, bad judgement on basepaths, could not throw strikes at times, etc. They just outplayed us. They, on the other hand, seemed intensely focused as evidenced by plays by Andrew B. and Mookie B. that reminded me of plays we made on our run last year. So, here is to a great year and hopefully back on top next year!
I don't like the Red Sox one bit, and even though I'm a diehard fan of the Birds, I have some affinity to the Stros; however, if the Red Sox had to win that series, I'm glad it was on the back of Benny Baseball.
Quote from: WPWells on October 19, 2018, 02:20:53 pm
I don't like the Red Sox one bit, and even though I'm a diehard fan of the Birds, I have some affinity to the Stros; however, if the Red Sox had to win that series, I'm glad it was on the back of Benny Baseball.
He went all or nothing on the last play of game four and it worked out well for his team.
Hoping for another October celebration!
It is all opinion and such, but if they could win another title, I believe it puts them in the discussion of greatest teams ever.
I know the Ruth/Gehrig Yankees, Dimaggio yanks, Mantle, Berra, Ford yanks belong and dominated for decades.
Orioles of the 60s and 70s with Brooks and Frank Robinson plus the incredible pitching with Palmer leading the way. (Grich is way overlooked).
Big Red Machine Bench, Rose, Morgan, Perez, Foster ... and Oakland Mr. October, Catfish, Rollie, Blue Moon, Vida, Holtzman, Lindblad, Rudi, Tenace, Sal, Campy, Scrap Iron, Angel, and Jesus (gotta love the names/nicknames) ... of the 70s with greats all over the field.
Yanks with the dynasty and Braves Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz, and Chipper of the 90s/00s.
among so many other great teams of the past.
....
Verlander, Cole, Grienke staff plus Altuve, Bregman, Springer. Sprinkle in Alvarez, Correa, and Brantley and it has the chance for all-time greatness.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 02, 2019, 11:16:01 am
It is all opinion and such, but if they could win another title, I believe it puts them in the discussion of greatest teams ever.
I know the Ruth/Gehrig Yankees, Dimaggio yanks, Mantle, Berra, Ford yanks belong and dominated for decades.
Orioles of the 60s and 70s with Brooks and Frank Robinson plus the incredible pitching with Palmer leading the way. (Grich is way overlooked).
Big Red Machine Bench, Rose, Morgan, Perez, Foster ... and Oakland Mr. October, Catfish, Rollie, Blue Moon, Vida, Holtzman, Lindblad, Rudi, Tenace, Sal, Campy, Scrap Iron, Angel, and Jesus (gotta love the names/nicknames) ... of the 70s with greats all over the field.
Yanks with the dynasty and Braves Maddux, Glavine, Smoltz, and Chipper of the 90s/00s.
among so many other great teams of the past.
....
Verlander, Cole, Grienke staff plus Altuve, Bregman, Springer. Sprinkle in Alvarez, Correa, and Brantley and it has the chance for all-time greatness.
My family ended up staying in the same hotel the '72 A's were staying in when they were in KC to play the Royals. I was in pre-teen autograph Heaven.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_Oakland_Athletics_season
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Oakland_Athletics_season
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1974_Oakland_Athletics_season
Wow! Autograph Heaven is right. That team was loaded.
I was an Astros fan attending games with Dierker and Cedeno being my favorites in the early then mid-70s. As the years went by, I realized that most of my autographs included the likes of Stretch Suba, Mike Fischlin, Joaquin Andujar, Mark Lemongello, Bo McLaughlin, Hoggy Hermann, and the like. But, they were gracious to wait for all 5 of us seeking autographs (of the maybe 3,000 total fans in the 'dome.) and they were free!!
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 02, 2019, 02:01:24 pm
Wow! Autograph Heaven is right. That team was loaded.
I was an Astros fan attending games with Dierker and Cedeno being my favorites in the early then mid-70s. As the years went by, I realized that most of my autographs included the likes of Stretch Suba, Mike Fischlin, Joaquin Andujar, Mark Lemongello, Bo McLaughlin, Hoggy Hermann, and the like. But, they were gracious to wait for all 5 of us seeking autographs (of the maybe 3,000 total fans in the 'dome.) and they were free!!
From my 'Dome trip before I hit double digits in age. (note the price :o )
(https://scontent-dfw5-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/62262022_10206457196066114_6560284432622682112_n.jpg?_nc_cat=108&_nc_oc=AQlrkml82nA2WN8H4xVkIG8yVMdE0kAHTgPcfxIaVQ2yLbww_HJsU944aarEBY3_bbU&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-1.xx&oh=b311fc3a1de46fb341c1cdd402fd1a4c&oe=5E336EDD)
I made another trip about 30 years later to make sure my then 10 year old son saw a game in the 'Dome before the 'stros move downtown. We got Lima to autograph a cap for him that day.
Love it. Good stuff.
Verlander - awesome!
Cole - incredible!
Grienke - throwing strikes and getting bombed ...
Our bats have cooled off. Rays pitching is on fire right now.
Hope Cole has something in the tank. We look vulnerable.
Rays look good. Must give them credit.
Nine more wins. But one of those has to be tonight.
I like your way of thinking. I actually think if we win the series, we are right back in the driver's seat. (It's tomorrow night, btw.) I think Grienke will be much better going forward in the playoffs and our studs will be back to normal rest.
Need to string some hits together to help Cole. The relief group was effective yesterday. Just got to JV early and we couldn't drive in runs.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 09, 2019, 10:01:37 am
I like your way of thinking. I actually think if we win the series, we are right back in the driver's seat. (It's tomorrow night, btw.) I think Grienke will be much better going forward in the playoffs and our studs will be back to normal rest.
Need to string some hits together to help Cole. The relief group was effective yesterday. Just got to JV early and we couldn't drive in runs.
Well dang, I got my days mixed up. Those two other #5s thru me off. ;D
Still need nine wins with the next game a suitcase game.
The excitement of a game 5 ...
Yep. 9 big ones.
Bring on the Yankees.
Eight wins to go.
Yes! Cole was dealing again.
Astros postseason play is limited when talking historically; yet, historically amazing games have been played:
Dodgers/Astros in strike season
Phillies/Astros was best I had seen at that point
Mets/Astros topped it
Astros/Cardinals that Pujols hit is still going......
Astros/Yankees 2017
Astros/Dodgers Games 2 and 5 may the best ever!!
Astros/Yankees again (last night, Correa made thee key plays to make it look like it could go 7 now and join the previous great series)
Time for Cole to go to work and Astros hitters to come alive with men on base.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 14, 2019, 08:17:45 am
Astros postseason play is limited when talking historically; yet, historically amazing games have been played:
Dodgers/Astros in strike season
Phillies/Astros was best I had seen at that point
Mets/Astros topped it
Astros/Cardinals that Pujols hit is still going......
Astros/Yankees 2017
Astros/Dodgers Games 2 and 5 may the best ever!!
Astros/Yankees again (last night, Correa made thee key plays to make it look like it could go 7 now and join the previous great series)
Time for Cole to go to work and Astros hitters to come alive with men on base.
Great list. +1
Those Phillies and Mets series were epic.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1980_National_League_Championship_Series
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1986_National_League_Championship_Series
Don't forget: https://www.crawfishboxes.com/2012/4/24/2971026/astros-history-18-inning-2005-nlds-game-against-the-atlanta-braves (I found the Chris Burke SGA bobblehead in a flea market a few years ago)
Yes sir. Nice addition.
Five more to go.
Hopefully JV has a World Series invitation in his pocket on the plane trip back to Houston.
Agreed.
Nice to see Greinke pitch well against that formidable lineup last night. Relievers were so good. Astros home runs won it, but all those Yankee errors were a big surprise and a help to the cause to put it away.
Altuve walks it off, 2-run homer to win it in the 9th to send the Astros to the World Series
AAAALLLLLLLTTTTTUUUUVVVVEEEE!!!!!
The 'streauxs are geauxin' to the WORLD SERIES!
Four wins to go.
Ryan, Mays, Biggio, and Altuve are my all time favorites with Altuve moving up the ranks quickly!! What a team, series, game, Play, and player!
Nothing better than seeing the Yankees and Cardinals lose... Way to go Astros.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 20, 2019, 12:22:18 pm
Ryan, Mays, Biggio, and Altuve are my all time favorites with Altuve moving up the ranks quickly!! What a team, series, game, Play, and player!
What, no Cruz, Morgan, Wynn, Cedeno or Bagwell? ;D
Cedeno and Dierker join Bagwell, Richard, Scott, and Morgan as favorites. Verlander, Bregman, Springer moving on up.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 20, 2019, 09:27:37 pm
Cedeno and Dierker join Bagwell, Richard, Scott, and Morgan as favorites. Verlander, Bregman, Springer moving on up.
J.R. was something. Very sad story.
Not on Richard's level talent wise and his physical issue was caused by something completely different, but I always liked Dickie Thom.
Yes! Thon was on track to be a great.
I thought J. R. was the best pitcher in baseball when it happened. Like Ryan and Koufax, he had found his control and was dominant. Very sad.
No Glenn Davis? That guy made the whole offense go back in the 80's.
Davis was good. So many Astros from which to choose!
Quote from: Chief_Osceola™ on October 21, 2019, 01:38:41 pm
No Glenn Davis? That guy made the whole offense go back in the 80's.
Hopefully Springer passes Davis' (and Cedeno's) home run total in the next four games. ;D
CLICK HERE (http://houston.astros.mlb.com/stats/sortable.jsp?c_id=hou#sortColumn=hr§ionType=sp&playerType=ALL&statType=hitting&season=2019&season_type=ALL&game_type='R'&elem=%5Bobject+Object%5D&tab_level=child&click_text=Sortable+Player+hitting&league_code='MLB'&page=1&ts=1571684818634)
Cedeno was my favorite for years when I was a kid. Super talented.
It's getting close to that time.......
Go 'stros!!!
Not a good start. I thought they were going to pull it out though.
Six games to get four wins.
Bregman needs to get rolling. We left so many opportunities out there last night. I still believe.
Implosion
'Streauxs take game three 4-1
Greinke came through in a big way. Harris too.
'Streauxs headin' back to H-Town with a 3-2 series lead.
Need one more win.
Greinke, Urquidy, and Cole!!!
I hope the Astros blow them out. After watching an entire stadium boo my president, there's no way I'll ever root for that trash team in D.C. ever again.
Quote from: Chief_Osceola™ on October 28, 2019, 12:55:55 pm
I hope the Astros blow them out. After watching an entire stadium boo my president, there's no way I'll ever root for that trash team in D.C. ever again.
Swampers (and not the good kind from Muscle Shoals).
Time for JV to nail this down. Hope he brings his A game tomorrow.
Astros owner, Jim Crane in a classy move, stopped by to shake hands with the president and to greet our First Lady.
Game 7 ...
Verlander trade made the difference two years ago. Hoping the Greinke trade does this year.
Greinke was awesome. May not be enough as Harris gives up the home run.
That was by far the worst called third strike that I have seen all year on Correa. Home plate umpire has to be better than that in game 7 of the World Series.
Ouch, 6-2 Washington, top of 9th with two outs, come on Stros, gonna need a rally in the bottom of the 9th.
Losing two in Houston with Cole on the mound for one of them was huge. Hats off to the Nationals. They were the better team.
Congrats to the Nationals! We witnessed history, and we will probably never see it again. The Washington Nationals won all 4 games in Houston, none at there home field. Unbelievable!
Not trying to stir anything up. Just genuinely curious what the perspective is from Astro fans? What are your guys feelings about this whole thing?
Quote from: OB11 on January 21, 2020, 11:54:30 am
Not trying to stir anything up. Just genuinely curious what the perspective is from Astro fans? What are your guys feelings about this whole thing?
Wished they wouldn't have gone that route. Disappointed the coaching staff thought it was needed. They were/are good enough to compete without the help. It does taint the accomplishments.
But that being said, teams have been figuring out ways to steal signs (with and without cameras) for as long as there have been signs.
https://www.chicagotribune.com/sports/white-sox/ct-chicago-white-sox-jack-mcdowell-sign-stealing-20200117-vjqmgecsxrh5jepqldntttsouu-story.html
https://thebaseballcodes.com/2015/09/24/yogi-berra-rip/
For some reason, the media is acting like Houston invented sign stealing. My personal thought is the media has a L.A. bias and is taking up the Dodgers' cause.
Houston took the hit. They got the largest fine that could be given, lost their top two draft picks for the next two years, and had a field manager and general manager banned for one year (with ownership deciding to take that to the next level).
But, the MLB is like the NFL in that they are copy cat leagues. With as much movement among teams of player as there is, the thought that Houston and Boston are the only teams that are doing this is naive. My guess is some of the coaching "justification" was, we get this done to us on the road so we have to do it in our park to keep the field level.
MLB doesn't want the full number of teams that do something like this to come to light.
P.S.
I'm an Altuve fan. Look at his 2017 splits. He had more hits and a better average away than he did at home.
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/split.fcgi?id=altuvjo01&year=2017&t=b
And wasn't Houston the only team in MLB history to lose a World Series by losing all four of their home games?
Not necessarily an Astros fan, but my two cents is that this was a whole lot more than the traditional sign stealing. I may be way off-base here, but I think this is distant second only to the "Black Sox." I know the steroids was bad, but that was a hush situation mostly involving individual player's decisions. This Astros deal was organization-wide. Everyone knew it was wrong, but nobody said anything. I am shocked we haven't seen the hammer (a very heavy one) fall on players yet. I definitely think this is worse than Pete Rose.
The dumbest part about this entire situation is that with trades and free agency, they had to know this was going to get found out!
Quote from: Coach DePriest, Shiloh Christian on January 21, 2020, 02:34:33 pm
Not necessarily an Astros fan, but my two cents is that this was a whole lot more than the traditional sign stealing. I may be way off-base here, but I think this is distant second only to the "Black Sox." I know the steroids was bad, but that was a hush situation mostly involving individual player's decisions. This Astros deal was organization-wide. Everyone knew it was wrong, but nobody said anything. I am shocked we haven't seen the hammer (a very heavy one) fall on players yet. I definitely think this is worse than Pete Rose.
The dumbest part about this entire situation is that with trades and free agency, they had to know this was going to get found out!
I still have to agree with Black Jack. La Russa should get credit for being the father of the center field camera and electronic notification - thirty years ago.
And Tony's in the HOF.
Quote from: bleudog on January 21, 2020, 02:46:03 pm
I still have to agree with Black Jack. La Russa should get credit for being the father of the center field camera and electronic notification - thirty years ago.
And Tony's in the HOF.
My fault for not reading the link. Also ridiculous. Crazy that we are just now hearing about it.
The Yogi Berra story is just baseball.
Quote from: Coach DePriest, Shiloh Christian on January 21, 2020, 03:51:31 pm
My fault for not reading the link. Also ridiculous. Crazy that we are just now hearing about it.
The Yogi Berra story is just baseball.
The Berra story makes it into all the Yogi-ism books and is funny to everybody but pitchers.
It even made the congressional record. (Bunning wen't on to become a senator.)
From the Congressional Record:
Mr. Speaker, I might trespass upon my friendship with the gentleman from Kentucky [Mr. Bunning] to tell the Members a true story.
I think I have the year right. 1958. Maybe it was 1968, but I am going to say 1958. The gentleman from Kentucky [Mr. Bunning] was pitching for the Detroit Tigers against the New York Yankees.
The New York Yankees had a first base coach named Bob Turley, a former pitcher who was very skilled at stealing signs. Every time Jim would throw a fastball, Turley would whistle, and the batters knew what the pitch was.
Now, the first batter up was Bobby Richardson, and Jim got him out. The second batter up was Tony Kubek, the shortstop. Jim got him out. The third batter stepped in, Mickey Mantle, and Jim walked over to the first base coach, Turley, and he said, ``If you whistle, I am going to hit him right in the back with a pitch.''
Jim took the mound. He got his sign and he was at the top of his windup when Turley whistled. Jim decided to cross everybody up. He threw a slider. It got away from him, and hit Mantle right in the back. Mantle headed toward the mound with his bat, but decided better of it, and trotted down to first base.
The next batter was Yogi Berra. Yogi stepped in, pounded the plate, looked at Jim Bunning and said, ``Hey, Jim, if Turley whistles, I ain't listening.''
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CREC-1996-03-05/html/CREC-1996-03-05-pt1-PgH1698.htm
But Yogi was an Astros bench coach from 1985-1989. Houston did play in the 1986 NLCS; no reports of Yogi whistling though. ;D
(https://scontent-dfw5-2.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/83198307_912872292461159_3262447567379628032_n.jpg?_nc_cat=1&_nc_ohc=2zfj-71__AYAX-p8Ecf&_nc_ht=scontent-dfw5-2.xx&oh=3112e9fa0be0501af0b9e7fa7337d00b&oe=5ED67FFE)
Quote from: Coach DePriest, Shiloh Christian on January 21, 2020, 02:34:33 pm
Not necessarily an Astros fan, but my two cents is that this was a whole lot more than the traditional sign stealing. I may be way off-base here, but I think this is distant second only to the "Black Sox." I know the steroids was bad, but that was a hush situation mostly involving individual player's decisions. This Astros deal was organization-wide. Everyone knew it was wrong, but nobody said anything. I am shocked we haven't seen the hammer (a very heavy one) fall on players yet. I definitely think this is worse than Pete Rose.
The dumbest part about this entire situation is that with trades and free agency, they had to know this was going to get found out!
I've been an Astros fan for nearly 50 years. They knew the rule, they broke it anyway, and got punished. Black eye for my team and all of its players. Altuve was moving toward being an all time favorite like Ozzie. I believe that opportunity is now gone.
I must disagree with you about it being worse than Rose. Bet on their games. Lied for decades. Breaking rules and lying about it is at the heart of it all. Both corrupt. But Not betting was always a cardinal rule. Players have been stealing signs forever. That's the insignificant difference for me.
The stink of it all ...
Knew the rule, broke the rule, got punished. It'll take me awhile to get past it. Uggghhhh.
Quote from: bleudog on January 21, 2020, 04:19:24 pm
The Berra story makes it into all the Yogi-ism books and is funny to everybody but pitchers.
It even made the congressional record. (Bunning wen't on to become a senator.)
From the Congressional Record:
Mr. Speaker, I might trespass upon my friendship with the gentleman from Kentucky [Mr. Bunning] to tell the Members a true story.
I think I have the year right. 1958. Maybe it was 1968, but I am going to say 1958. The gentleman from Kentucky [Mr. Bunning] was pitching for the Detroit Tigers against the New York Yankees.
The New York Yankees had a first base coach named Bob Turley, a former pitcher who was very skilled at stealing signs. Every time Jim would throw a fastball, Turley would whistle, and the batters knew what the pitch was.
Now, the first batter up was Bobby Richardson, and Jim got him out. The second batter up was Tony Kubek, the shortstop. Jim got him out. The third batter stepped in, Mickey Mantle, and Jim walked over to the first base coach, Turley, and he said, ``If you whistle, I am going to hit him right in the back with a pitch.''
Jim took the mound. He got his sign and he was at the top of his windup when Turley whistled. Jim decided to cross everybody up. He threw a slider. It got away from him, and hit Mantle right in the back. Mantle headed toward the mound with his bat, but decided better of it, and trotted down to first base.
The next batter was Yogi Berra. Yogi stepped in, pounded the plate, looked at Jim Bunning and said, ``Hey, Jim, if Turley whistles, I ain't listening.''
https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/CREC-1996-03-05/html/CREC-1996-03-05-pt1-PgH1698.htm
But Yogi was an Astros bench coach from 1985-1989. Houston did play in the 1986 NLCS, but no reports of Yogi whistling. ;D
Yogi was a treasure.
I do believe Rose will eventually be in the HOF. One of the 50, maybe 25 greatest of all time. Loved that he played hard every play and his aggressiveness.
To your statement about steroids, I personally have it second to throwing a series. I always loved baseball in its steeped tradition in statistics. I could dig deep and compare Walter Johnson to Bob Feller, Sandy Koufax to Steve Carlton, Juan Marichal to Pedro Martinez, Nolan Ryan to Randy Johnson. Steroids ruined that. Barry Bonds was going along with Hank Aaron type numbers but McGuire and Sosa juiced up to chase the record. Then Bonds juiced his already greatness up to put up Ruth plus Williams numbers. Tainted. Then they lied about it. It's that corruption thing again.
Yes, I am a purist. I love a 2-1 pitchers dual. Don't like players or baseballs juiced up. How can I compare Clemens to Gibson? How can I compare A-Rod to anyone? Or any steroids era player to Mays?
But I will go on loving baseball because they, like all of us, make mistakes.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on January 23, 2020, 10:10:07 am
To your statement about steroids, I personally have it second to throwing a series. I always loved its steeped tradition in statistics. I could dig deep and compare Walter Johnson to Bob Feller, Sandy Koufax to Steve Carlton, Juan Marichal to Pedro Martinez, Nolan Ryan to Randy Johnson. Steroids ruined that. Barry Bonds was going along with Hank Aaron type numbers but McGuire and Sosa juiced up to chase the record. Then Bonds juiced his already greatness up to put up Ruth plus Williams numbers. Tainted. Then they lied about it. It's that corruption thing again.
Yes, I am a purist. I love a 2-1 pitchers dual. Don't like players or baseballs juiced up. How can I compare Clemens to Gibson? How can I compare A-Rod to anyone? Or any steroids era player to Mays?
But I will go on loving baseball because they, like all of us, make mistakes.
Very well said. Part of the reason I love baseball so much is the history and tradition behind it. Scandals like this are bad for the game, but I'll still go on enjoying it.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on January 23, 2020, 09:56:27 am
I do believe Rose will eventually be in the HOF. One of the 50, maybe 25 greatest of all time. Loved that he played hard every play and his aggressiveness.
I heard someone who called into a sports radio show about an effort to get Joe Jackson in the HOF. The group's effort hinged on Jackson getting a "lifetime" ban from baseball and Jackson was no longer alive.
If it works, that's kind of the ultimate good-news-bad-new thing for Pete though. :o
I'm still trying to process the severity of this to a certain extent. Stealing signs has always been a part of the game, but using technology is a very significant thing to do. This isn't getting a couple of AB's with a runner on second stealing the sign before the other team changes it or a pitcher tipping his pitches. This is serious to me. The fact that a coach helped the player-led effort is stunning and that the organization seemed to know from top to bottom is alarming.
That said, I think MLB was about as serious as they could be with the sanctions. I read that five million is the most they could fine (not sure if that's accurate), but that's not a big deal, but losing four draft picks is. Especially for a team trying to replenish a farm system that has lost several good prospects in trades as they aim to contend every year. The suspensions were long enough for Hinch and Luhnow, but I think the Astros had to fire them. You combine this with the Taubman incident and just trading for Osuna and there's some firepower there. Not to mention Hinch's smugness at times about the whole thing. I'm wondering if the owner should have faced some punishment, but this was an unprecedented event so I don't expect MLB to satisfy everyone.
People will say, well the Astros were good enough that it didn't matter if they cheated, which is the same argument people use for the Patriots and all of their "incidents." That just doesn't fly with me. Don't get me wrong, Houston is crazy talented, but once you get to the playoffs, especially deep into the playoffs where teams are more even, things like knowing what pitch is coming can make all the difference in winning and losing.
Sports are supposed to be fair. Granted, certain outside forces can have an impact on a game like officials, weather, injuries, sickness, etc. Sometimes those things happen, but a team deliberately cheating is so out of bounds to me.
As for where it ranks on scandals, I mean, I feel like the only thing I can really point to is the NBA referee scandal to shave points because players/coaches have no control over that. It's about equal to me with steroids and the Black Sox scandal. The only thing that might knock steroids down on my list is that, while it was rampant, it was up to individual player's choices. It wasn't an organizational philosophy for any teams, at least to my knowledge.
Just my two cents though, I'm interested to see how Houston responds. They should still be good, and of course something like this coming out that doubts their success could be a source of inspiration for many players. So we will see.
After the pitifully, poor press conference the Astros had yesterday, it's hard to believe they'd have enough sense to come up with anything innovative in sign stealing technique.
https://www.si.com/mlb/2020/01/23/sign-stealing-history-astros-red-sox
https://www.si.com/mlb/2019/11/13/sign-stealing-baseball-history
And out of curiosity:
2017 Splits W L RS RA W-L%
Home (81) 48 33 395 327 .593
Road (81) 53 28 501 373 .654
https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/HOU/2017-schedule-scores.shtml
Seems like they did better when they had to guess what was being thrown.
I am an Astros fan.
I believe they knowingly broke the rule. They were punished. I believe they earned punishment. I will not go into all that stuff about other teams doing it. I am a believer that if you knowingly do wrong, you earned punishment whether anyone else is doing it or not. If they look into others, I will be fine with it. If they set an example and move on, I will deal with it.
I still believe it had little to no positive effect. It was a corrupt effort to try to gain an advantage but failed.
Still an Astros fan. Moving on from the fiasco and looking forward to the season.
Quote from: bleudog on February 14, 2020, 10:59:42 am
And out of curiosity:
2017 Splits W L RS RA W-L%
Home (81) 48 33 395 327 .593
Road (81) 53 28 501 373 .654
https://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/HOU/2017-schedule-scores.shtml
Seems like they did better when they had to guess what was being thrown.
If I were an Astros fan, I think this is probably what would frustrate me the most. Why? Why cheat? Those guys are already talented enough, so why even do it?
But Jesus Christ most of them don't even seem to be a little remorseful about it.
One of my childhood favorites.
https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28960200/ex-astros-slugger-jimmy-wynn-nicknamed-toy-cannon-dies-78
Same. As kids, we always ventured to that seat to look at how far it was from home plate. He truly was a great player.
https://www.chron.com/sports/astros/article/Hall-of-Famer-Joe-Morgan-the-Astro-who-got-away-15639252.php
I have him top 5 all time at 2nd base, maybe #1. True greatness. Time marches on....
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 14, 2020, 11:25:51 am
I have him top 5 all time at 2nd base, maybe #1. True greatness. Time marches on....
He was one of the greats at the position that is for sure
Rogers Hornsby, Joe Morgan, Rod Carew*, Eddie Collins, Craig Biggio, Nap Lajoie, Jackie Robinson are my top 7 in about any order. Carew was awesome but also spent half a career at first base.
Quote from: RATTLER43 on October 14, 2020, 02:48:09 pm
Rogers Hornsby, Joe Morgan, Rod Carew*, Eddie Collins, Craig Biggio, Nap Lajoie, Jackie Robinson are my top 7 in about any order. Carew was awesome but also spent half a career at first base.
No Sandberg?
He is next tier with Altuve, Grich, Cano, Alomar, Whitaker, Maz, Fox, etc.