I'm just curious; how are all of these football players that left Har-Ber, after last season, going to be allowed to play at Springdale this Fall? I thought that if you changed schools, outside of certain parameters, you were not eligible the next year. I know that if you move districts, the loss of eligibility doesn't apply but I just can't believe that ALL of these players families moved, just around town.
Is there some kind of politics going on here? Does anyone with actual knowledge of the situation know anything they can tell?
Quick and easy transfers between these two are very common. It's just not usual for it to be out of har-ber
Check out the thread "2018 Talk" from earlier this year under 7A.
All players who transferred have already been declared eligible to play in the fall. As another poster stated, in district transfers have been granted for various reasons since the 2 schools split. These transfers fell within a precedence that had already been set.
Quote from: soccerhawg on April 24, 2018, 02:17:36 pm
I'm just curious; how are all of these football players that left Har-Ber, after last season, going to be allowed to play at Springdale this Fall? I thought that if you changed schools, outside of certain parameters, you were not eligible the next year. I know that if you move districts, the loss of eligibility doesn't apply but I just can't believe that ALL of these players families moved, just around town.
Is there some kind of politics going on here? Does anyone with actual knowledge of the situation know anything they can tell?
As you can see by now, no good reason it's allowed. The AAA just follows its rules when it wants, and disregards them when it wants. This particular precedent started the first year of Har-Ber's existence, when the AAA simply allowed every single kid in the new Harber school zone (that wanted to) play for Malzahn's state championship Bulldogs team. But precendent shouldn't really be a factor. The AAA should follow the rules in their own handbook.
Quote from: Rayburn on May 24, 2018, 11:15:47 am
As you can see by now, no good reason it's allowed. The AAA just follows its rules when it wants, and disregards them when it wants. This particular precedent started the first year of Har-Ber's existence, when the AAA simply allowed every single kid in the new Harber school zone (that wanted to) play for Malzahn's state championship Bulldogs team. But precendent shouldn't really be a factor. The AAA should follow the rules in their own handbook.
Harber did not offer varsity football in 2005. Their first year of varsity football was 2006 so yes those seniors were allowed to go to SHS. It's exactly what Bentonville and BVW did in West's first year of varsity football.
Also why shouldn't precedence be a factor? If this has been allowed previously for similar reasons, why shouldn't it be allowed now? No one was saying a word when kids were going from SHS across town but all of the sudden it is a problem.
And to the original posters question, there are no politics involved with the move, just a need for change for all parties involved-players and coaches.
I keep seeing people post about how "no one said anything when kids transferred to Har-Ber." Can someone give some names of student athletes that have transferred that were not forced to move or who were not already in Har-Ber district to begin with?
Naming names of kids, with the exception for accolades, is not a good idea in this board. With that said last season twin brothers played high school football in Springdale, one at Harber and one at SHS. Both started their careers at SHS but one was allowed to move to Harber after his sophomore season. Sad thing is the kid barely saw the field at HB and he would have been an impact player at SHS.
If the moves were approved by the school district, why is this even relevant? Precedence has been set in the district a long time ago on in district transfers- Right, wrong or indifferent. Heck HB coaches have said they will be better without the kids who left so if they feel that way, why does anyone else care?
because a lot of transfers is the first sign of something shady going on.
I understand the initial reaction to transfers. I have thought he same thing when I read where kids transferred.
Instead of immediately going to something shady going on the question should be asked "why do they want to leave?" This question has been asked on other threads regarding this issue and there have been no direct answers on the message board out of respect for all those involved.
Hey Hootens still has Harber picked to finish above SHS in conference so the kids who left must not have been that important.
LOL Rob you are like a hawk watching over this thread swooping down to pounce on anyone who dares post ;D
My understanding of the situation as it has evolved is that it could be a good thing for all involved. I certainly hope so for all current and future players at both schools. The kids who left where good quality players and young men, I wish them well. I would love to see both teams playing each other late in November, that would be fun.
HB Dad ;D ;D ;D
Hopefully it will be the best thing for everyone involved, players and coaches. Should be a fun year and I too hope they meet in late November. It would be great for the community.
Is there a point where we can atleast name the positions of the ones the transferred? I can tell who did by just reading Hootens and some of them will have some impact. One in particular.
QB will be the biggest impact for the success of the team. Other positions are
WR/CB
OLB/TE
WR/RB/S
RB/LB
MLB
Ok, so in the AAA's eyes...there is no problem with a kid transfering 5 miles, according to Google Maps, and can remain eligible athletically? That, in my opinion is ridiculous, but they have been allowing it in LR. I know of a couple kids who have played at 3 different schools in 3 consecutive years...
I don't have the details of this particular situation, but as I've stated in another thread it's really easy in the 7A to pick the school you want to play at. In NWA, there are seven 7A schools within 30 miles of each other and then sprinkle in some quality 4A programs (PR, PG and Shiloh), kids can play where they want in the system that fits them the best. Parents can work for Walmart, a Walmart supplier, Tyson or JB Hunt and live anywhere they want from Bella Vista to Fayetteville. Happens every day, and yes parents do move for their kids schools.
I don't see the big deal here. I think the same scenario could be true for LR, Cabot, Conway, Benton, Bryant or any of the quality smaller schools in the LR area. It's pretty easy in 2018 to find the fit you want for your kids.
In all honestly it shouldn't be a be deal. I've seen a few kids go back in forth between the schools since it opened. My only question is how good will it make Springdale? They got some good kids in deal.
Quote from: businesstron on August 01, 2018, 10:50:39 am
In all honestly it shouldn't be a be deal. I've seen a few kids go back in forth between the schools since it opened. My only question is how good will it make Springdale? They got some good kids in deal.
That's what I'm gonna find out too. I've been under a rock with work and family this summer so I'm trying to get back caught up on what's going on. I should have known there were going to be some changes for both football programs after last season due to a number of events. I know players, coaches, and parents from both schools. After reading some of your posts, I will have to agree that this move was kinda unusual but definitely justified.
Quote from: STBruin on July 27, 2018, 11:05:23 am
Ok, so in the AAA's eyes...there is no problem with a kid transfering 5 miles, according to Google Maps, and can remain eligible athletically? That, in my opinion is ridiculous, but they have been allowing it in LR. I know of a couple kids who have played at 3 different schools in 3 consecutive years...
weren't transfer rules made to restrict public to private and private to private transfers?
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on August 19, 2018, 05:29:09 pm
weren't transfer rules made to restrict public to private and private to private transfers?
EXACTLY...but if your in public school and want to transfer to a public school...its all fair game.
https://www.harberherald.com/news/2018/10/30/former-wildcats-use-academics-to-justify-hardship-requests/
Quote from: sickofwhiners on October 30, 2018, 02:31:42 pm
https://www.harberherald.com/news/2018/10/30/former-wildcats-use-academics-to-justify-hardship-requests/
The video at the end of the article.....is the reason why kids are turning into POS human beings.....look at that fine example that clown is setting.
Quote from: AirWarren on October 30, 2018, 03:20:45 pm
The video at the end of the article.....is the reason why kids are turning into POS human beings.....look at that fine example that clown is setting.
Looks kind of funny to me...... And as for the kids, none of them are POS. All have 3.5 or better GPA's and scored very well on their ACT tests and they do not get in trouble. As for the clown, well that would be me. I can send you the video if you would like. By the way, there is always more to the story than what you read or even see.......
Harber people are just mad because the kids who transferred to SHS beat them and did it in a gut wrenching way and it was the QB that the HC at Harber didn't want who stuck the dagger in them and twisted it.
Have a great day
Interesting time for that article to come out.
Quote from: businesstron on October 30, 2018, 04:24:59 pm
Interesting time for that article to come out.
The really sad part is this is being stirred up by one set of parents at SHS because their son got beat out by one of the transfers so they would rather drag the team down and lose as long as their kid gets to play. THAT is what is wrong with society, not some clown burning stuff he was never going to wear again ;D ;D ;D
Also there were several untrue statements made in the article but journalistic integrity went out the window years ago........
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 30, 2018, 04:38:33 pm
The really sad part is this is being stirred up by one set of parents at SHS because their son got beat out by one of the transfers so they would rather drag the team down and lose as long as their kid gets to play. THAT is what is wrong with society, not some clown burning stuff he was never going to wear again ;D ;D ;D
Also there were several untrue statements made in the article but journalistic integrity went out the window years ago........
Time to turn the page :-\
Integrity...interesting choice of words
OH man....
There is a powderkeg here.
Very interesting the HB school newspaper is the source of this story.
The local media could blow this thing to smithereens if they wanted to divulge the full transfer history between schools.
Sad that it's come to this.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 30, 2018, 04:17:30 pm
Looks kind of funny to me...... And as for the kids, none of them are POS. All have 3.5 or better GPA's and scored very well on their ACT tests and they do not get in trouble. As for the clown, well that would be me. I can send you the video if you would like. By the way, there is always more to the story than what you read or even see.......
Harber people are just mad because the kids who transferred to SHS beat them and did it in a gut wrenching way and it was the QB that the HC at Harber didn't want who stuck the dagger in them and twisted it.
Have a great day
I saw all I need to see with the video embedded and this reply solidified any further thoughts have on the matter/reaction.
Kudos. Best of luck to you guys.
Quote from: B.G. on October 30, 2018, 05:33:30 pm
Very interesting the HB school newspaper is the source of this story.
The local media could blow this thing to smithereens if they wanted to divulge the full transfer history between schools.
Sad that it's come to this.
It's pretty pathetic. Interview the kids and it's about "playing time and getting to the next level". Interview the "parents" and ones filling out the legalities and it's all about education.
I've always been one to defend public schools against private school advantage but this garbage sure does make it hard to continue.
Yup, it doesn't pass the smell test at all. If you're going to leave or transfer then so be it. But don't act like trash about it.
[/quote]
I don't know any of those kids so calling them POS's is not something I'd ever do. The behavior of the dad in front of the kids is sad. The fact that coach Clark was there and ok with I told is also sad. Shame on them both. (And I'm a guy who can't stand Chris Wood or his program) The Dad shows his rear regularly at football games. At least at the ones I've seen him at. So I guess the video should be no shock.
BTW....I don't see much in the way of D-1 potential out of most of the transfers. At all.
Quote from: 5tooldad on October 30, 2018, 07:17:50 pm
I don't know any of those kids so calling them POS's is not something I'd ever do. The behavior of the dad in front of the kids is sad. The fact that coach Clark was there and ok with I told is also sad. Shame on them both. (And I'm a guy who can't stand Chris Wood or his program) The Dad shows his rear regularly at football games. At least at the ones I've seen him at. So I guess the video should be no shock.
BTW....I don't see much in the way of D-1 potential out of most of the transfers. At all.
You are right 5tool, I do tend to get wound up with at football games and sporting events.
For more detail regarding that night, I am a huge Miami Hurricane fan and that was the same night Clemson kicked their butt in the ACC championship game. So when they lose I tend to get hacked and burn Miami stuff so I burned a bunch, and I mean A BUNCH, of Miami stuff. So after burning Miami gear I decided to burn Harber gear and have some laughs with my friends that came over. We had some laughs and moved on. Obviously the video was never intended to get out and the article stated that my son filmed it which is not true. It was another kid who was living with us while his parents moved away due to his dads terminal cancer. We didn't realize he made a video and he ultimately sent it to the Harber coaches. This was after he had transferred to SHS and then went back to Harber.
As far as D1 well those kids that said that probably shouldn't have made a statement that strong but give them credit for having confidence. Also those quotes were taken during an interview in December 2017 while they were still students at Harber but had already been approved by the district to transfer to SHS.
I'm not making excuses, rather just shedding some more insight as to the events that really happened.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 30, 2018, 07:38:09 pm
You are right 5tool, I do tend to get wound up with at football games and sporting events.
For more detail regarding that night, I am a huge Miami Hurricane fan and that was the same night Clemson kicked their butt in the ACC championship game. So when they lose I tend to get hacked and burn Miami stuff so I burned a bunch, and I mean A BUNCH, of Miami stuff. So after burning Miami gear I decided to burn Harber gear and have some laughs with my friends that came over. We had some laughs and moved on. Obviously the video was never intended to get out and the article stated that my son filmed it which is not true. It was another kid who was living with us while his parents moved away due to his dads terminal cancer. We didn't realize he made a video and he ultimately sent it to the Harber coaches. This was after he had transferred to SHS and then went back to Harber.
As far as D1 well those kids that said that probably shouldn't have made a statement that strong but give them credit for having confidence. Also those quotes were taken during an interview in December 2017 while they were still students at Harber but had already been approved by the district to transfer to SHS.
I'm not making excuses, rather just shedding some more insight as to the events that really happened.
i probably shouldn't have thrown in the d1 comment because a) what the heck do I know and b) sounded like a shot at your son and his teammates which was not my intention. And if im being honest, I get fired up at some games too. Not as fired up as you but....
The whole thing has just been a bad look from the get go. And this only magnified it.
But on one thing we agree....Chris Woods is a jerk.
I think the video says a lot about the examples being set, by those present at the bonfire. Shame. If the transcript of the video and the interviews are correct as well as coach Clarks presence, I cannot understand how the AAA allows eligibility.
Quote from: 5tooldad on October 30, 2018, 07:17:50 pm
I don't know any of those kids so calling them POS's is not something I'd ever do. The behavior of the dad in front of the kids is sad. The fact that coach Clark was there and ok with I told is also sad. Shame on them both. (And I'm a guy who can't stand Chris Wood or his program) The Dad shows his rear regularly at football games. At least at the ones I've seen him at. So I guess the video should be no shock.
BTW....I don't see much in the way of D-1 potential out of most of the transfers. At all.
I didn't call his kids that. Or any of those kids involved.
I made a general reference to kids in general regarding their attitudes toward society and authority and the poor people examples they are following.
Quote from: gameoflife on October 30, 2018, 07:53:44 pm
I think the video says a lot about the examples being set, by those present at the bonfire. Shame. If the transcript of the video and the interviews are correct as well as coach Clarks presence, I cannot understand how the AAA allows eligibility.
That was my point as well.
Kids generally do what they are allowed to do. They follow the leader.
Quote from: 5tooldad on October 30, 2018, 07:53:29 pm
i probably shouldn't have thrown in the d1 comment because a) what the heck do I know and b) sounded like a shot at your son and his teammates which was not my intention. And if im being honest, I get fired up at some games too. Not as fired up as you but....
The whole thing has just been a bad look from the get go. And this only magnified it.
But on one thing we agree....Chris Woods is a jerk.
One thing I can agree with him too is I'm a hurricane fan too and I also was disgusted at Clemson trashing Miami lol. I'm not going to drink it up and start burning my gear though haha.
Quote from: gameoflife on October 30, 2018, 07:58:13 pm
Kids generally do what they are allowed to do. They follow the leader.
"Leader".
Quote from: AirWarren on October 30, 2018, 07:54:28 pm
I didn't call his kids that. Or any of those kids involved.
I made a general reference to kids in general regarding their attitudes toward society and authority and the poor people examples they are following.
i know. I WAs more responding to his response. Apologies if it sounded like an accusation.
Quote from: 5tooldad on October 30, 2018, 07:53:29 pm
i probably shouldn't have thrown in the d1 comment because a) what the heck do I know and b) sounded like a shot at your son and his teammates which was not my intention. And if im being honest, I get fired up at some games too. Not as fired up as you but....
The whole thing has just been a bad look from the get go. And this only magnified it.
But on one thing we agree....Chris Woods is a jerk.
No worries man! I know you didn't mean anything about the comment and I certainly didn't take it as a jab. I agree it is a bad look, and I know others are throwing stones, but what if everything you said or did at your own house became visible to the public?? Unfortunately his video did even though no one had knowledge it was being taken. Oh well I own my actions. Coach Clark has been a friend of mine for several years so if he was really recruiting, my son would have played for him all 3 years instead of his senior year. But the context of the article along with the video portray everything in a negative light, especially towards Coach Clark. That was the intent of the journalism department at Harber so congrats to them on accomplishing what they set out to do.
Life goes on my friends.....
Quote from: 5tooldad on October 30, 2018, 08:01:52 pm
i know. I WAs more responding to his response. Apologies if it sounded like an accusation.
You're good. I'm just clarifying for anyone reading.
I usually have no reason to come up to the 7A board, but I'll have my popcorn out for this thread.
classic soap opera material
Quote from: sickofwhiners on October 30, 2018, 02:31:42 pm
https://www.harberherald.com/news/2018/10/30/former-wildcats-use-academics-to-justify-hardship-requests/
Needless to say, this whole scenario sickens me, any coach that would sit there and participate in that foolishness has no business coaching. Great parenting, hey son, let's just leave your team that you been playing with all these years, we are just gonna jump ship when the going gets tough, one heckuva lesson taught there. This is a prime example of the crap the AAA should be handing out punishments on. Absolutely sickened by this. I have coached kids for 25 years, and this by far beats all I have ever seen. And don't ever refer to that dude on the video as a coach, he does not deserve the respect that the title of coach warrants.
Man, who knew Friday Night Lights had some unreleased episodes still out there.
Quote from: beach bum on October 30, 2018, 08:21:38 pm
I usually have no reason to come up to the 7A board, but I'll have my popcorn out for this thread.
Agreed. But, would this be a bigger issue if it were between two schools that had any shot at the title?
The guy in the Red jacket in the background is the Coach?
If the AAA don't step in and do something they are the joke everybody thinks they are. Clear video evidence of recruiting violations.
So at the beginning of the thread, the transfers were OK because Springdale does it all the time and the rest of us shouldn't care because everyone in Springdale is OK with it. Might have to break a few rules and fudge a few forms to slip it past AAA (probably not) but that is OK because everyone in Springdale is happy. But when it becomes clear that everyone in Springdale is NOT happy, let's blame the old school for sour grapes. They should be happy that these mistreated kids are now in a better place. Then 20 minutes later, let's blame parents from the new school. They should be happy that illegal transfers took their kids' spots. Let's sling as much mud as possible to deflect attention away from the source of the dirt.
Quote from: GRN R H-2 X-Deep Over on October 31, 2018, 09:29:04 am
Agreed. But, would this be a bigger issue if it were between two schools that had any shot at the title?
You are probably right....
Quote from: Beaver Fever on October 31, 2018, 10:18:17 am
If the AAA don't step in and do something they are the joke everybody thinks they are. Clear video evidence of recruiting violations.
Quote from: Beaver Fever on October 31, 2018, 10:18:17 am
If the AAA don't step in and do something they are the joke everybody thinks they are. Clear video evidence of recruiting violations.
Why are you even shocked..... I thought this kind of stuff went down all the time in Malvern/Glen Rose/ MC ;D
Maybe, but I've never seen video footage of it. This is a slap in the AAA face.
What if these were two poor delta schools, would it go unnoticed?
Quote from: Beaver Fever on October 31, 2018, 11:38:51 am
Maybe, but I’ve never seen video footage of it. This is a slap in the AAA face.
What if these were two poor delta schools, would it go unnoticed?
It's just a bad look all the way around.
This is sad, but in the end it's just two ugly girls fighting in the school parking lot. Ain't nobody gonna come out looking good, no matter who wins.
Quote from: Spider2 Y Banana on October 31, 2018, 01:54:23 pm
This is sad, but in the end it's just two ugly girls fighting in the school parking lot. Ain't nobody gonna come out looking good, no matter who wins.
Best statement regarding this entire thread
Quote from: Spider2 Y Banana on October 31, 2018, 01:54:23 pm
This is sad, but in the end it's just two ugly girls fighting in the school parking lot. Ain't nobody gonna come out looking good, no matter who wins.
thats why we are all here though. Who doesn't love seeing ugly chicks fight?
Quote from: Spider2 Y Banana on October 31, 2018, 01:54:23 pm
This is sad, but in the end it's just two ugly girls fighting in the school parking lot. Ain't nobody gonna come out looking good, no matter who wins.
Isn't one a little uglier after the fight?
Quote from: Beaver Fever on October 31, 2018, 10:18:17 am
If the AAA don't step in and do something they are the joke everybody thinks they are. Clear video evidence of recruiting violations.
The video was taken 3 weeks after the transfer was approved by the school district. Now please tell me how this is evidence of recruiting? I will wait since you seem to have all the answers....... NOT!!!
I'm sure you became drinking buddies with the coach AFTER the paper work was finished. Doubt that was the first time y'all knocked back a few.
Be careful as we walk through this folks or by board policy we'll have to shut it down.
I will say:
1. Don't jump to conclusions w/o a good look see.
2. This is just not a good look for anyone. Some guilt is to be shared.
I don't find this end game to be a huge surprise. This whole thing was walked on egg shells for the longest time and then once they played the jabs were bound to come out.
I personally am still surprised that a school newspaper was the trigger to the public outcry.
Quote from: beach bum on October 31, 2018, 11:05:11 am
Wouldn't be the first time the AAA was brought proof of recruiting and did nothing about it.
Quote from: Beaver Fever on October 31, 2018, 05:16:58 pm
I'm sure you became drinking buddies with the coach AFTER the paper work was finished. Doubt that was the first time y'all knocked back a few.
No I have been friends with Coach Clark for several years. Is that illegal in the eyes of the law or the AAA? I don't think so. Understand that my son was an All-State performer as a sophomore, one of only 3 in the entire 7A, at Harber so playing time was not an issue. There are some deep, dirty secrets that the administration does not want to get out regarding the coaching staff at Harber... PERIOD.
People have tried to find a smoking gun during this process regarding recruiting for the past 10 months. You know what, nothing has been found because there is nothing to find. When the process is followed and done correctly, there is nothing to hide. I know you conspiracy theorists don't believe that but......
Jump to whatever conclusion you want, but much as everyone wants to believe illegal recruiting or whatever, nothing illegal occurred. Can you say the system is flawed? Absolutely and I will agree with you 100%, but the course of action taken was legal and approved by the appropriate parties all along the way. Nothing was kept hidden at any point and time and believe me, I have a documented timeline of everything that took place because I knew this would get ugly, yes even this ugly.
Heck man dice me up all you want about the video, I can take it. Your opinion of me doesn't matter just like mine of you doesn't matter.
Quote from: B.G. on October 31, 2018, 05:21:50 pm
Be careful as we walk through this folks or by board policy we'll have to shut it down.
I will say:
1. Don't jump to conclusions w/o a good look see.
2. This is just not a good look for anyone. Some guilt is to be shared.
I don't find this end game to be a huge surprise. This whole thing was walked on egg shells for the longest time and then once they played the jabs were bound to come out.
I personally am still surprised that a school newspaper was the trigger to the public outcry.
On top of the coach drinking with new transfer group, The glowing issue is you have kids saying they want to go somewhere to get D1 attention. Ana play football in hopes of getting to the next level.
But the adults filling out the paperwork to transfer state it's an academic issue where SHS offered more educational opportunities.
It's one thing to have he said she said. But this is an instance where you have credible documentation where the dots do not connect.
Interesting. Hbhs lost on 11/10/17 in the playoffs. Rob says the video was done the night of the ACC championship game. That was December 2. And he says the transfers were approved 3 weeks prior to the video. So, unless the school district worked to approve the transfers on Saturday, 11/11/17, the transfers were approved prior to Hbhs's last playoff game.
Quote from: AirWarren on October 31, 2018, 05:31:36 pm
On top of the coach drinking with new transfer group, The glowing issue is you have kids saying they want to go somewhere to get D1 attention. Ana play football in hopes of getting to the next level.
But the adults filling out the paperwork to transfer state it's an academic issue where SHS offered more educational opportunities.
It's one thing to have he said she said. But this is an instance where you have credible documentation.
The quotes were taken from the boys by the Harber journalism department BEFORE they left Harber in December 2017. The boys also said they were transferring for the academics at SHS but the journalism group intentionally left that part out. Shocking huh???
Quote from: sickofwhiners on October 31, 2018, 05:31:57 pm
Interesting. Hbhs lost on 11/10/17 in the playoffs. Rob says the video was done the night of the ACC championship game. That was December 2. And he says the transfers were approved 3 weeks prior to the video. So, unless the school district worked to approve the transfers on Saturday, 11/11/17, the transfers were approved prior to Hbhs's last playoff game.
It does not add up. Period.
Quote from: sickofwhiners on October 31, 2018, 05:31:57 pm
Interesting. Hbhs lost on 11/10/17 in the playoffs. Rob says the video was done the night of the ACC championship game. That was December 2. And he says the transfers were approved 3 weeks prior to the video. So, unless the school district worked to approve the transfers on Saturday, 11/11/17, the transfers were approved prior to Hbhs's last playoff game.
11.15.17 to be exact so 2 and a half weeks. My bad....
Next???
Quote from: AirWarren on October 31, 2018, 05:34:21 pm
It does not add up. Period.
You may need to get an abacus for this one to add up in your mind
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 05:37:32 pm
You may need to get an abacus for this one to add up in your mind
Nah.
Quote from: AirWarren on October 31, 2018, 05:31:36 pm
On top of the coach drinking with new transfer group, The glowing issue is you have kids saying they want to go somewhere to get D1 attention. Ana play football in hopes of getting to the next level.
But the adults filling out the paperwork to transfer state it's an academic issue where SHS offered more educational opportunities.
It's one thing to have he said she said. But this is an instance where you have credible documentation where the dots do not connect.
If you honestly believe that high school journalism article is credible then you must really get your fill of CNN and the rest of the fake news out there.......
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 05:37:32 pm
You may need to get an abacus for this one to add up in your mind
The fact that you are still on here trying to defend that video is utterly dispicable. The fact of the matter is, you pulled the wool over the AAA eyes regarding your kids transfer. Bottom line, end of story.
I don't think you can come up with a suitable explanation for the conduct on the video or for Coach Clarks presence. It suggest recruiting, and activities that just don't look good from a leader of young men.
Quote from: gameoflife on October 31, 2018, 05:43:28 pm
I don't think you can come up with a suitable explanation for the conduct on the video or for Coach Clarks presence. It suggest recruiting, and activities that just don't look good from a leader of young men.
That guy does not deserve the title of coach in front of his name for even being remotely in the area of that video being recorded.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 05:42:48 pm
If you honestly believe that high school journalism article is credible then you must really get your fill of CNN and the rest of the fake news out there.......
Registered republican here.
Try again.
Throw back one with Zack for me. Looks classy.
Quote from: gameoflife on October 31, 2018, 05:43:28 pm
I don't think you can come up with a suitable explanation for the conduct on the video or for Coach Clarks presence. It suggest recruiting, and activities that just don't look good from a leader of young men.
That I will not argue and neither will he. But understand that the only 2 students there were my son, he lives there, and another kid who had moved in with us due to his father having stage 4 cancer and his parents moving away, so he was living with us. No other students were there and since Coach Clark and I have a previous established friendship, there is nothing that constitutes recruiting. That student was the one who filmed everything and has since transferred back to Harber. Mysteriously just shortly after he went back to Harber this video shows up almost 8 months later. Weird isn't it???
The video does make the situation look bad, no doubt about it. It was never intended to get out, but it did and it is what it is.
Quote from: JacketFan on October 30, 2018, 08:43:19 pm
Needless to say, this whole scenario sickens me, any coach that would sit there and participate in that foolishness has no business coaching. Great parenting, hey son, let's just leave your team that you been playing with all these years, we are just gonna jump ship when the going gets tough, one heckuva lesson taught there. This is a prime example of the crap the AAA should be handing out punishments on. Absolutely sickened by this. I have coached kids for 25 years, and this by far beats all I have ever seen. And don't ever refer to that dude on the video as a coach, he does not deserve the respect that the title of coach warrants.
Quote from: JacketFan on October 31, 2018, 05:46:34 pm
That guy does not deserve the title of coach in front of his name for even being remotely in the area of that video being recorded.
Man I am so glad you guys all live in glass houses.........
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 05:51:14 pm
Yeah we read it the first time......
Apparently you can't comprehend it, or you would be humbling yourself, instead, you are on here trying to justify your actions.
Quote from: AirWarren on October 31, 2018, 05:46:58 pm
Registered republican here.
Try again.
Throw back one with Zack for me. Looks classy.
Glad to see we have one thing in common. By the way did you see any actual drinking in the video or just a couple of empty beer bottles?
Quote from: JacketFan on October 31, 2018, 05:52:52 pm
Apparently you can't comprehend it, or you would be humbling yourself, instead, you are on here trying to justify your actions.
I am not justifying anything man. Just adding some more information which obviously you don't want to hear and that's fine. It is a free country to believe what you want to.
Serious question.... Can anyone actually pick out the coach on the video or are you just making assumptions on who you think it is?
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 05:55:39 pm
Serious question.... Can anyone actually pick out the coach on the video or are you just making assumptions on who you think it is?
Whoa did I stump everyone??? It wasn't intended to be a trick question......
I think he's the one putting shirts in the fire because that would make this story even better.
Quote from: OrangeCrush. on October 31, 2018, 06:10:54 pm
I think he's the one putting shirts in the fire because that would make this story even better.
Well at least someone made a guess. No he is not and as a matter of fact he is nowhere near the fire at any point in the video. That is my point to some of these posters. I am sure many of them thought he was one of the 2 main characters by the fire in the video but he was not.....
If he was then yes it would make the story even better..........
Who's the guy in the red sleeves?
Quote from: AirWarren on October 31, 2018, 05:46:58 pm
Registered republican here.
Try again.
Throw back one with Zack for me. Looks classy.
I kinda liked you before you admitted you are a republican!
Quote from: PA Dad on October 31, 2018, 06:18:01 pm
I kinda liked you before you admitted you are a republican!
Welcome to the 7a soap opera PA, 5a board was boring, so I came over for some laughs. ;D ;D ;D
Quote from: OrangeCrush. on October 31, 2018, 06:14:42 pm
Who's the guy in the red sleeves?
It's hard to tell from the video isn't it? Don't really know who is there except for the 2 morons burning the stuff..........
This video is not in and of itself is not what some of you make it out to be.. Yes, it does show some extracurricular behavior among friends, but it's not dispositive of some conspiracy.
If more truth comes to light on collateral aspects of this deal, some of you will bust a gusset.
Quote from: B.G. on October 31, 2018, 06:22:42 pm
This video is not in and of itself is not what some of you make it out to be.. Yes, it does show some extracurricular behavior among friends, but it's not dispositive of some conspiracy.
If more truth comes to light on collateral aspects of this deal, some of you will bust a gusset.
Enlighten us BG, I am all for busting a gusset. ;D
Bottom line... in the end all of this will blow over, because whether any rules were broken or not, the AAA is not going to enforce them and wouldn't dare penalize someone. So let's just all have fun, find a coach to drink with, recruit, and burn shirts.
Quote from: OrangeCrush. on October 31, 2018, 06:26:22 pm
Bottom line... in the end all of this will blow over, because whether any rules were broken or not, the AAA is not going to enforce them and wouldn't dare penalize someone. So let's just all have fun, find a coach to drink with, recruit, and burn shirts.
;D ;D ;D
(http://i336.photobucket.com/albums/n352/maynardgkrebbs/walkslikeaduck_zpsqfigjfm6.jpg) (http://s336.photobucket.com/user/maynardgkrebbs/media/walkslikeaduck_zpsqfigjfm6.jpg.html)
I'm going to let this play out. There are a lot of people very vested and this is very personal to them. I'm going to let this come out as it does on its own.
For those with a sense of board history, you will recall I grew up in Fayetteville and despised SHS for my entire life. Even went through the Gus era with the same mindset. Just. Couldn't stand them. I ripped them to Kingdom Come on this board.
That's no longer the case.
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on October 31, 2018, 06:28:26 pm
(http://i336.photobucket.com/albums/n352/maynardgkrebbs/walkslikeaduck_zpsqfigjfm6.jpg) (http://s336.photobucket.com/user/maynardgkrebbs/media/walkslikeaduck_zpsqfigjfm6.jpg.html)
And you call yourself a PA Fan? :)
Quote from: B.G. on October 31, 2018, 06:30:31 pm
And you call yourself a PA Fan? :)
I was enjoying reading a thread about recruiting that's not about P.A.
Quote from: PA Dad on October 31, 2018, 06:31:53 pm
I was enjoying reading a thread about recruiting that's not about P.A.
I bet.
Quote from: PA Dad on October 31, 2018, 06:31:53 pm
I was enjoying reading a thread about recruiting that's not about P.A.
Me too, the PA stuff was getting old, this is pretty interesting though. :)
Quote from: B.G. on October 31, 2018, 06:30:31 pm
And you call yourself a PA Fan? :)
Kinda, sorta. Well heck, I'll admit it.. YES.
Just enjoying this thread for some morbid reason. Must be the weather or Halloween or something! The Glen Rose thread got deleted so I am surfing other entertaining threads.
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on October 31, 2018, 06:34:07 pm
Kinda, sorta. Well heck, I'll admit it.. YES.
Just enjoying this thread for some morbid reason. Must be the weather or Halloween or something! The Glen Rose thread got deleted so I am surfing other entertaining threads.
Kinda of different not to be the center of attention.
Quote from: B.G. on October 31, 2018, 06:38:05 pm
Kinda of different not to be the center of attention.
Agree
Everyone behave please. Going to a Hween party.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 05:55:39 pm
Serious question.... Can anyone actually pick out the coach on the video or are you just making assumptions on who you think it is?
It's pretty obvious that he is there when someone is yelling his name multiple times...Pretty sure he is in the all red jacket.
Quote from: PA Dad on October 31, 2018, 06:18:01 pm
I kinda liked you before you admitted you are a republican!
No shame, no shame.
The true blue collar man. :D
Quote from: HawkFan03 on October 31, 2018, 06:47:06 pm
It's pretty obvious that he is there when someone is yelling his name multiple times...Pretty sure he is in the all red jacket.
Didn't say he wasn't there. Just asked if anyone could pick him out. You said you were pretty sure he is in the all red jacket. At least you took a stab.
Quote from: B.G. on October 31, 2018, 06:42:01 pm
Everyone behave please. Going to a Hween party.
Come on now.... If I am too old for that then you are too ;D
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 07:03:44 pm
Didn't say he wasn't there. Just asked if anyone could pick him out. You said you were pretty sure he is in the all red jacket. At least you took a stab.
I'm saying his phone text records in the article that were retrieved showed everyone he was there. I'm guessing some people may have skimmed over that part to get to the video.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 07:03:44 pm
Didn't say he wasn't there. Just asked if anyone could pick him out. You said you were pretty sure he is in the all red jacket. At least you took a stab.
I'm trick or treating with a princess.
I'll tend to you later lol
Sure is a lot of especially upset here on the ol' board for a bunch of dudes that don't live in NWA...
Bottom line is this....kids/parents applied for transfer...per SISD procedures, both Principles approved the transfers...the SISD administration said that the transfers met their guidelines and approved the transfers and the AAA reviewed the requests and said they met the AAA guidelines and approved the transfers. The kids and parents did everything that was required of them to transfer and should have no regrets or grief given.
Do I think that they transferred for athletic reason or not liking Chris Wood? Probably, but that is certainly not the only time that that has happened in Springdale going both directions between the schools. And it won't be the last time that it will happen.
Do I think that the kids/parents talked to Coach Clark before requesting the transfers? Of course they did, who wouldn't? As long as he didn't make the initial contact, then there is absolutely nothing to see here. Those types of conversations are held in Ft. Smith at Northside and Southside with kids that, for what ever reason want to transfer to the other school. Both of the Ft. Smith coaches refer them to the FSISD service center to begin the paperwork to see if the transfer will be allowed. After that, it is out of their hands.
Do I agree with what they did, probably not, but I also don't know what the situation was with Coach Wood either. Most folks that have played in the 7A West have heard some of the stories about Woods attitude and people skills with his players, parents and other coaches in the conference. "Prickly" might be a good place to start in the discriptions that I have heard.
Either way, the kids and parents followed the letter of the law and the rest of this stuff could all be healed up with a big tube of Boudreaux Butt Paste available next to the diapers at WalMart...
Quote from: scrapman on October 31, 2018, 07:18:34 pm
I'm saying his phone text records in the article that were retrieved showed everyone he was there. I'm guessing some people may have skimmed over that part to get to the video.
I couldn't even get anything from the video cause I think someone filmed it with a 2005 flip phone....
Quote from: Baitshop on October 31, 2018, 07:19:51 pm
Sure is a lot of especially upset here on the ol' board for a bunch of dudes that don't live in NWA...
Bottom line is this....kids/parents applied for transfer...per SISD procedures, both Principles approved the transfers...the SISD administration said that the transfers met their guidelines and approved the transfers and the AAA reviewed the requests and said they met the AAA guidelines and approved the transfers. The kids and parents did everything that was required of them to transfer and should have no regrets or grief given.
Do I think that they transferred for athletic reason or not liking Chris Wood? Probably, but that is certainly not the only time that that has happened in Springdale going both directions between the schools. And it won't be the last time that it will happen.
Do I think that the kids/parents talked to Coach Clark before requesting the transfers? Of course they did, who wouldn't? As long as he didn't make the initial contact, then there is absolutely nothing to see here. Those types of conversations are held in Ft. Smith at Northside and Southside with kids that, for what ever reason want to transfer to the other school. Both of the Ft. Smith coaches refer them to the FSISD service center to begin the paperwork to see if the transfer will be allowed. After that, it is out of their hands.
Do I agree with what they did, probably not, but I also don't know what the situation was with Coach Wood either. Most folks that have played in the 7A West have heard some of the stories about Woods attitude and people skills with his players, parents and other coaches in the conference. "Prickly" might be a good place to start in the discriptions that I have heard.
Either way, the kids and parents followed the letter of the law and the rest of this stuff could all be healed up with a big tube of Boudreaux Butt Paste available next to the diapers at WalMart...
Some are upset...
Some are looking for something to talk about...
Some are not really upset at this situation in particular but with the AAA and this is just another example of kids transferring in general. How long will it take before a kid is told "NO". We complain about today's society and how kids act and how they want immediate results. The adults are the ones letting them do whatever they want.
I wonder what the percentage is of kids that transfer successfully to the ones the AAA denies? Im saying 100 percent success over the last 5-10 years.
This is actually where the situation gets ridiculous. It is all up to the principals and athletic directors first. Football is a major sport so most of those requested are granted but I know of plenty in other sports that were not granted even though they went through the right channels. They could have easily lied on an address or something but because they actually gave a the true reason it was denied.
While I think what is happening in the video is silly, the kids and their families have the option to transfer and followed the guidelines.
Baitshop I think your analysis is correct. The incongruity is the kids saying they transferred because of football while the parents claimed it was academic. But it could truthfully be both.
What puzzles me is that neither of these schools is in the mix for a playoff run this year. I can understand the grousing about PA because of its success but folks usually care little about schools that are not on the mix. Is this really about this situation or is it about disgust with the AAA in general?
As a former journalist, the fact that the advisor of the Har-Ber Herald actually let that story publish on its website is absolutely appalling.
The quotes read like they are completely made up and it is chock full of errors, fallacies and complete inaccuracies. In an era where people trust journalism less and less each day, the LAST thing that should happen is publishing a story like this and teaching young people that this passes as journalism.
Edit: after getting more information
Quote from: JacketFan on October 31, 2018, 06:33:10 pm
Me too, the PA stuff was getting old, this is pretty interesting though. :)
The PA stuff happened on a parent-to-parent level. I *did* have some proof of that - I will have to check and see if I still have that message. Sorry, I don't post much on here and I'd have to go back a ways and look.
This seems a whole ******* lot bigger than that.
To my knowledge, and I looked around a whole lot, I never saw evidence that PA was engaging in institutional-style recruiting.
Quote from: scrapman on October 31, 2018, 05:29:01 pm
Wouldn’t be the first time the AAA was brought proof of recruiting and did nothing about it.
Listen to scrapman here, folks.
I know of at least one other instance of this intimately - probably the same one scrapman is thinking of. (and not PA or any other private school involved.)
And it was horse crap.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 31, 2018, 05:37:32 pm
You may need to get an abacus for this one to add up in your mind
Get a grip.
Quote from: Baitshop on October 31, 2018, 07:19:51 pm
Bottom line is this....kids/parents applied for transfer...per SISD procedures, both Principles approved the transfers...the SISD administration said that the transfers met their guidelines and approved the transfers and the AAA reviewed the requests
ahahahahahahaha. The great pillar of truth, the AAA.
Quote from: Baitshop on October 31, 2018, 07:19:51 pmand said they met the AAA guidelines and approved the transfers
People have a right to an education and everyone here knows that transfers are just a formality.
Quote from: Baitshop on October 31, 2018, 07:19:51 pmThe kids and parents did everything that was required of them to transfer and should have no regrets or grief given.
That's like saying that money laundering is legal as long as you didn't get caught. "But I filed my taxes you guys! It's legit I promise! All the requirements are right here!"
Quote from: DerekOxford on October 31, 2018, 10:51:42 pm
The quotes are completely made up
Pump the brakes - what?
What the heck is going on out here?
Derek: You basically say this story is made up. What is YOUR evidence of this? Is the video a creation made by "crisis actors"? Even Rob, who is one of the parents doesn't say the students' quotes are "completely made up". He says "The boys also said they were transferring for the academics at SHS but the journalism group intentionally left that part out."
Most journalists tend to record their interviews. It would be interesting to know if the student journalists were savvy enough to do that in this case. It would certainly make it a little more clear who was being forthcoming.
Finally, if the transfers were completed prior to the video, why did the students stay at HBHS through the end of the semester? Given that academics were their clear priority and their belief that SHS was the better school, why didn't the leave immediately?
Quote from: sickofwhiners on November 01, 2018, 09:45:30 am
Derek: You basically say this story is made up. What is YOUR evidence of this? Is the video a creation made by "crisis actors"? Even Rob, who is one of the parents doesn't say the students' quotes are "completely made up". He says "The boys also said they were transferring for the academics at SHS but the journalism group intentionally left that part out."
Most journalists tend to record their interviews. It would be interesting to know if the student journalists were savvy enough to do that in this case. It would certainly make it a little more clear who was being forthcoming.
Finally, if the transfers were completed prior to the video, why did the students stay at HBHS through the end of the semester? Given that academics were their clear priority and their belief that SHS was the better school, why didn't the leave immediately?
No evidence, just reads like a hit job piece with an agenda. If they want to produce audio or video recordings of the interviews they conducted, then I'll retract my statement, but I'm fairly confident that there are none.
Quote from: DerekOxford on November 01, 2018, 10:09:05 am
No evidence, just reads like a hit job piece with an agenda. If they want to produce audio or video recordings of the interviews they conducted, then I'll retract my statement, but I'm fairly confident that there are none.
OK then. What are the "errors fallacies and inaccuracies"?
Surely you can be specific. Those are very direct accusations.
Quote from: Rayburn on November 01, 2018, 10:44:29 am
OK then. What are the "errors fallacies and inaccuracies"?
Surely you can be specific. Those are very direct accusations.
Not going to spell them out on here, and especially not to people hiding behind a screen name. If you want to message me directly, feel free to do so.
Quote from: DerekOxford on November 01, 2018, 10:54:30 am
Not going to spell them out on here, and especially not to people hiding behind a screen name.
Of course not
Last thing I'll say: this is only the beginning.
I will have no more to say on this topic. PM's are always open, and I have my personal Twitter account and email listed.
I think most people understand that questionable transfers take place and have been taking place for years across Arkansas. I think if you look you will see that in the Little Rock area this happens often. I know of at least one current case of this happening in a NLR to Parkview transfer based on "academics". There are stories of some of the past high profile players in LR area schools that have changed districts and sometimes several times. Even to the point of shopping themselves to coaches. This is the easiest way to get a transfer approved.
As for the claims at Har-Ber/Spingdale I think the defense seems shady at best.
Saying that the video was student made and laying its distribution at the feet of a student as if that makes a difference. You say this young man lived with you and now make it sound as if he betrayed you?
The conduct on the video is in very poor taste and the party atmosphere, where the coach is presumably present is just sad. Maybe you should have made sure there wasn't a video to begin with.
Claiming a previous friendship with the coach really doesn't dismiss a possibility of recruiting, you still cannot encourage it. Neither teachers/coaches or supporters. Was he or wasn't he there?
Do you claim that he never, ever encouraged those players to change schools?
Making an accusation that there is some deep dark sinister secret that the Har-Ber district is trying to hide about the coaching staff. Have you proof of this.
The mass transfer of 5 student/Athletes who suddenly decide they need an academic hardship transfer sounds fishing to begin with.
If you wanted to transfer your son, fine, but you sure made a production out of it. I guess your dislike for the Har-Ber coach made your behavior OK.
Quote from: footballfan-tastic on November 01, 2018, 11:59:02 am
I think most people understand that questionable transfers take place and have been taking place for years across Arkansas. I think if you look you will see that in the Little Rock area this happens often. I know of at least one current case of this happening in a NLR to Parkview transfer based on "academics". There are stories of some of the past high profile players in LR area schools that have changed districts and sometimes several times. Even to the point of shopping themselves to coaches. This is the easiest way to get a transfer approved.
As for the claims at Har-Ber/Spingdale I think the defense seems shady at best.
Saying that the video was student made and laying its distribution at the feet of a student as if that makes a difference. You say this young man lived with you and now make it sound as if he betrayed you?
The conduct on the video is in very poor taste and the party atmosphere, where the coach is presumably present is just sad. Maybe you should have made sure there wasn't a video to begin with.
Claiming a previous friendship with the coach really doesn't dismiss a possibility of recruiting, you still cannot encourage it. Neither teachers/coaches or supporters. Was he or wasn't he there?
Do you claim that he never, ever encouraged those players to change schools?
Making an accusation that there is some deep dark sinister secret that the Har-Ber district is trying to hide about the coaching staff. Have you proof of this.
The mass transfer of 5 student/Athletes who suddenly decide they need an academic hardship transfer sounds fishing to begin with.
If you wanted to transfer your son, fine, but you sure made a production out of it. I guess your dislike for the Har-Ber coach made your behavior OK.
Not once have I said my behavior was ok but it was at my house and people, like yourself, can like/dislike and judge me however you want to. Nothing I can do about that.
As for the student we were trying to help him and the real truth is I had to kick him out of my house 6 months after he took this video for illegal drug use. Does that make a difference to you now that you know that fact? You are absolutely correct with your point about making sure no one was making a video. That is one lesson I have learned the hard way.
Proof of deep issues at Harber. I wouldn't make a statement like that without proof. Proof has been brought to the attention of the people in charge, they are aware but to this point, nothing has been done. It's a shame too.
Yes I claim that he never, ever talked about my son going to SHS. There was no need because he knew my son wanted to be at HB with his friends so it was something we just never talked about. Yes he was present at my house as he had been many times before and many times since then. It's called a friendship no matter what it looks like to everyone else. Man when my son was at Harber I drank beer with some of those coaches while we were down in Hoover. Now that was a school sponsored function and a direct violation of Section 8 of the Ethics Code for teachers and coaches. So what is worse, having a coach over to my house and my son and another kid living with me present at an adult gathering or a coach drinking in a cookout setting with parents, coaches and players present? You tell me. One is a direct violation while the other is not but just because some guy went overboard and burned stuff and blasted another coach at one event it just makes it look bad.
As for all the kids transferring at once, man I get that is looks bad and appears to be underhanded. If was on the outside looking in I would probably feel the same way. I am not here to change your minds because that just cannot be done on a message board. What I will say is for these transfers to be approved, there had to be something seriously wrong with the entire situation. It would be great if it could all come to light, but unfortunately it more than likely won't.
Season is almost over and there will be new drama next season for someone else.
Quote from: sickofwhiners on November 01, 2018, 09:45:30 am
Derek: You basically say this story is made up. What is YOUR evidence of this? Is the video a creation made by "crisis actors"? Even Rob, who is one of the parents doesn't say the students' quotes are "completely made up". He says "The boys also said they were transferring for the academics at SHS but the journalism group intentionally left that part out."
Most journalists tend to record their interviews. It would be interesting to know if the student journalists were savvy enough to do that in this case. It would certainly make it a little more clear who was being forthcoming.
Finally, if the transfers were completed prior to the video, why did the students stay at HBHS through the end of the semester? Given that academics were their clear priority and their belief that SHS was the better school, why didn't the leave immediately?
District policy prevented the actual change of schools until the next semester started.
RVW. Let me be clear, I don't know facts, sure I never will. I'm posting based on information provided on this thread and information from people I know and trust.
Your biggest problem is the PR battle has been lost and was early on. The SHS coach looks bad and his PR image is harmed. I know some coaches, all folks seem to, and I have seen them leave situations that you discuss on your post. Alcohol in the presence of student athletes and adults is never a good mix, even when innocent. The burning of HB gear and the atmosphere made that gathering more than just friends getting together at your home. It became much more. It just looks bad. IMO. I always appreciated seeing coaches I know stay away from that mix even in private settings. Just makes sense to take the high road.
For you to consume with coaches in those situations as you say you have is in my opinion in bad taste. You are responsible for your conduct and how you presence in those instances looks. Perception is everything in the public realm. I'm not saying you did anything illegal, immoral and maybe you guys didn't violate transfer protocol but you seem to have lacked good judgement. More importantly your friend the coach did as well and his job is all about setting examples for kids.
I'm sure my opinion doesn't matter to you and that's fine as well but you have spent a lot of time and print in making a case for it not being that bad.
Good luck to you and your son and the rest of those kids.
Quote from: footballfan-tastic on November 01, 2018, 01:01:04 pm
RVW. Let me be clear, I don't know facts, sure I never will. I'm posting based on information provided on this thread and information from people I know and trust.
Your biggest problem is the PR battle has been lost and was early on. The SHS coach looks bad and his PR image is harmed. I know some coaches, all folks seem to, and I have seen them leave situations that you discuss on your post. Alcohol in the presence of student athletes and adults is never a good mix, even when innocent. The burning of HB gear and the atmosphere made that gathering more than just friends getting together at your home. It became much more. It just looks bad. IMO. I always appreciated seeing coaches I know stay away from that mix even in private settings. Just makes sense to take the high road.
For you to consume with coaches in those situations as you say you have is in my opinion in bad taste. You are responsible for your conduct and how you presence in those instances looks. Perception is everything in the public realm. I'm not saying you did anything illegal, immoral and maybe you guys didn't violate transfer protocol but you seem to have lacked good judgement. More importantly your friend the coach did as well and his job is all about setting examples for kids.
I'm sure my opinion doesn't matter to you and that's fine as well but you have spent a lot of time and print in making a case for it not being that bad.
Good luck to you and your son and the rest of those kids.
Oh you are absolutely correct, it IS that bad. My actions BAD. The video BAD. A coach being present during all of this BAD. There is nothing good or positive out of this entire situation and my role and actions are at fault, 100%.
It is just a bad, bad situation no matter how you look at it.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on November 01, 2018, 01:20:39 pm
Oh you are absolutely correct, it IS that bad. My actions BAD. The video BAD. A coach being present during all of this BAD. There is nothing good or positive out of this entire situation and my role and actions are at fault, 100%.
It is just a bad, bad situation no matter how you look at it.
You've owned it. You've admitted the wrongness in all of it. Whatever happens, if anything, is not up to me or anyone else in this thread.
With that said, wishing you and your son a great rest of the way through.
Quote from: AirWarren on November 01, 2018, 01:26:13 pm
You've owned it. You've admitted the wrongness in all of it. Whatever happens, if anything, is not up to me or anyone else in this thread.
With that said, wishing you and your son a great rest of the way through.
Thanks AW. My intention was never to justify my actions but I see where it came off as that what I was trying to do. My goal was just to add true narrative around the entire situation. Even though the narrative does not, and should not, justify my actions it hopefully lets people see there is more to the story than the bonfire.
My biggest disappointment, outside of my actions, is the way the school articles portrayed these kids. Definitely hit below the belt IMO
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on November 01, 2018, 01:30:20 pm
Thanks AW. My intention was never to justify my actions but I see where it came off as that what I was trying to do. My goal was just to add true narrative around the entire situation. Even though the narrative does not, and should not, justify my actions it hopefully lets people see there is more to the story than the bonfire.
My biggest disappointment, outside of my actions, is the way the school articles portrayed these kids. Definitely hit below the belt IMO
well let's face it.....Har-Ber is gonna Har-Ber.
Bad situation all around. What would JW say.......
Two great things about life. Learning from your mistakes and getting second chances.
Quote from: 5tooldad on November 01, 2018, 02:35:50 pm
well let's face it.....Har-Ber is gonna Har-Ber.
Bad situation all around. What would JW say.......
Well JW doesn't think too fondly of old blue that's for sure......
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on November 01, 2018, 03:08:05 pm
Well JW doesn't think too fondly of old blue that's for sure......
that's as it should be
As a 7A West fan, I am not going to comment on the article, video or situation in general. My opinion is just let the powers that be handle it.
I will comment on RVW. He is a great poster on this board and someone who's opinion I respect. He admitted his mistake (and yes we all make them and no he didn't have to publicly on this board) and is moving on. I respect that even more.
Hope this all passes soon and both programs can focus on the playoffs. As emotional as HS football gets, these are still kids playing their guts out (both schools) with their teammates.
I just LOVE how there was nobody whining and moaning for the last 12 years when a majority of the talent transferred West or South before playing a Varsity snap, sometimes after. But now that Springdale gets some talent from the West, it is suddenly a problem and needs to be remedied.
Frankly, I can't say that I'm surprised by this hit job, it speaks for the mentality of the West side.
Rob, let it go. Everyone has their opinion. You've owned it. But the more you talk, the worse it gets.
Quote from: Baitshop on October 31, 2018, 07:19:51 pm
Sure is a lot of especially upset here on the ol' board for a bunch of dudes that don't live in NWA...
Bottom line is this....kids/parents applied for transfer...per SISD procedures, both Principles approved the transfers...the SISD administration said that the transfers met their guidelines and approved the transfers and the AAA reviewed the requests and said they met the AAA guidelines and approved the transfers. The kids and parents did everything that was required of them to transfer and should have no regrets or grief given.
Do I think that they transferred for athletic reason or not liking Chris Wood? Probably, but that is certainly not the only time that that has happened in Springdale going both directions between the schools. And it won't be the last time that it will happen.
Do I think that the kids/parents talked to Coach Clark before requesting the transfers? Of course they did, who wouldn't? As long as he didn't make the initial contact, then there is absolutely nothing to see here. Those types of conversations are held in Ft. Smith at Northside and Southside with kids that, for what ever reason want to transfer to the other school. Both of the Ft. Smith coaches refer them to the FSISD service center to begin the paperwork to see if the transfer will be allowed. After that, it is out of their hands.
Do I agree with what they did, probably not, but I also don't know what the situation was with Coach Wood either. Most folks that have played in the 7A West have heard some of the stories about Woods attitude and people skills with his players, parents and other coaches in the conference. "Prickly" might be a good place to start in the discriptions that I have heard.
Either way, the kids and parents followed the letter of the law and the rest of this stuff could all be healed up with a big tube of Boudreaux Butt Paste available next to the diapers at WalMart...
Why would a kid from Northside ever wanted to transfer and play for Southside? :)
Calm before the storm?
Quote from: DerekOxford on November 01, 2018, 10:54:30 am
Not going to spell them out on here, and especially not to people hiding behind a screen name. If you want to message me directly, feel free to do so.
So you can come on here and call the academic advisor "appalling" for letting the story run because you THINK it has factual errors. But it's OK for you to say the story is made up without any shred of evidence. Interesting thinking.
Quote from: Grizzlyfan on November 02, 2018, 03:34:03 pm
So you can come on here and call the academic advisor "appalling" for letting the story run because you THINK it has factual errors. But it's OK for you to say the story is made up without any shred of evidence. Interesting thinking.
That's why he is a "former journalist".
Quote from: Grizzlyfan on November 02, 2018, 03:34:03 pm
So you can come on here and call the academic advisor "appalling" for letting the story run because you THINK it has factual errors. But it's OK for you to say the story is made up without any shred of evidence. Interesting thinking.
Did I say the story was made up entirely? Sure there's some factual information in it. The quotes absolutely read like they were invented. If they weren't, why hasn't anyone produced any audio or video recordings of the interviews they did. And trust me, there are a whole other set of issues with that story that I won't even get into.
You can attack me all you want, but we will see who is right in the end.
It's funny the link to the article and video no longer work now after the announcement of the HB forfeits. I was going to show someone the article and it's gone like a Hillary Clinton email.
Quote from: Pr8hd on November 02, 2018, 10:58:34 pm
It's funny the link to the article and video no longer work now after the announcement of the HB forfeits. I was going to show someone the article and it's gone like a Hillary Clinton email.
;D
Surely the Sprimgdal School District wouldn't have ordered the story to be taken down without reviewing the information gathered by the reporters. Surely, they wouldn't have done this while the students were away at their national journalism convention.
http://chicago.journalismconvention.org/
The coverup continues.
Somewhere a lawyer is smiling like a Cheshire cat.
What a series of unfortunate events. You mean to tell me that the joke that is currently Har-Ber football got upset over kids leaving to go to the old school and then they [Har-Ber] have to forfeit games for an ineligible player?
This is far more exciting than the first round of the 7A playoffs where all the good teams don't even play.
Quote from: sickofwhiners on November 03, 2018, 07:39:41 am
Surely the Sprimgdal School District wouldn't have ordered the story to be taken down without reviewing the information gathered by the reporters. Surely, they wouldn't have done this while the students were away at their national journalism convention.
http://chicago.journalismconvention.org/
The coverup continues.
What does that mean and how is the link pertinent??
Quote from: GRN R H-2 X-Deep Over on November 03, 2018, 12:22:58 pm
What a series of unfortunate events. You mean to tell me that the joke that is currently Har-Ber football got upset over kids leaving to go to the old school and then they [Har-Ber] have to forfeit games for an ineligible player?
This is far more exciting than the first round of the 7A playoffs where all the good teams don't even play.
You stole the words out of all our mouths we were thinking....
Quote from: TheDale on November 01, 2018, 08:53:52 pm
I just LOVE how there was nobody whining and moaning for the last 12 years when a majority of the talent transferred West or South before playing a Varsity snap, sometimes after. But now that Springdale gets some talent from the West, it is suddenly a problem and needs to be remedied.
Frankly, I can't say that I'm surprised by this hit job, it speaks for the mentality of the West side.
I can't see the Page as someone must have took it down.
Knowing some of the kids that transferred and others that stayed I pray for them all.
It's nit just football...I also know others that transfer or move just based off the schools!
Looks like the entire situation has too many twists and turns to know what really went on.
Can we all agree on one thing?
NWA people are drama queens.
Sheesh...
We been stealing players from each other for 50 or 60 years down here in Sebastian County, and you haven't heard a peep about it.
You new money clowns up there have one little incident, and the whole world has to know it. lol
Y'all need a bigger broom or a bigger rug. Keep that crap in house. Makes you all look bad.
Quote from: grizz on November 03, 2018, 10:42:44 pm
Can we all agree on one thing?
NWA people are drama queens.
Sheesh...
We been stealing players from each other for 50 or 60 years down here in Sebastian County, and you haven't heard a peep about it.
You new money clowns up there have one little incident, and the whole world has to know it. lol
Y'all need a bigger broom or a bigger rug. Keep that crap in house. Makes you all look bad.
Well said; gotta role with the punches.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on October 30, 2018, 04:38:33 pm
The really sad part is this is being stirred up by one set of parents at SHS because their son got beat out by one of the transfers so they would rather drag the team down and lose as long as their kid gets to play. THAT is what is wrong with society, not some clown burning stuff he was never going to wear again ;D ;D ;D
Also there were several untrue statements made in the article but journalistic integrity went out the window years ago........
Let's hear the other side of the story, and if there had actually been a competition that would have also been great. It's my understanding that you, the coach, the booster club president, and the announcer were texting each other about the kid you are talking about in your quote. You have apparently stooped to a new low by talking down 17 year old kids. I think you need to re-evaluate, and take responsibility.
Quote from: grizz on November 03, 2018, 10:42:44 pm
Can we all agree on one thing?
NWA people are drama queens.
Sheesh...
We been stealing players from each other for 50 or 60 years down here in Sebastian County, and you haven't heard a peep about it.
You new money clowns up there have one little incident, and the whole world has to know it. lol
Y'all need a bigger broom or a bigger rug. Keep that crap in house. Makes you all look bad.
Bookface, instagay, and Twatter. Changed the brain function of society.
Quote from: Pr8hd on November 03, 2018, 08:03:01 am
Somewhere a lawyer is smiling like a Cheshire cat.
More than one. The national media is involved now. I expect a story to be forthcoming shortly. The Springdale School District is going to look really bad when it all comes out. Censorship will get you sued and embarrassed.
They didn't expect a bunch of students to stand their ground or know their rights
They were wrong. https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/amberjamieson/a-high-school-newspaper-was-suspended-for-publishing-an
Quote from: Willie_Cutts on December 01, 2018, 01:02:07 pm
They didn't expect a bunch of students to stand their ground or know their rights
They were wrong. https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/amberjamieson/a-high-school-newspaper-was-suspended-for-publishing-an
If the students have everything saved from interviews to back up what they wrote then the Springdale district is about to look real ugly in a lawsuit. If they don't have saved audio or saved documentation then its not very smart on their end also..... As well if they did make anything up then it will turn on them ultimately for printing something inaccurate. You can't just censor something because you don't like what was written or shown on media outlets....... Kind of sounds like what a guy we all know says on TV or tweets saying he wants to do. In this Springdale situation one of the parties is about to look bad, and if its the school district then they have more to lose in negative perception because they are one of the biggest districts in the state if not the biggest now.
The kids have it all and district doesn't care. They censored the kids because they have it all. That's the only reason the kids haven't posted it all.
https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/419294-highschool-newspaper-suspended-over-disruptive-investigation?mode=comments#disqus_thread
Will be very interesting to see what happens over the next month with regards to the district.
Well, we have in fact seen this story picked up by a national feed who is touting the "free press" mantra.
Of course, that article only told the 4th quarter of that story and omitted facts. A real hatchet job. Let's see if the real truth to this story and initial chapter of this story of players that went from SHS to HBHS over the last 5 years comes to light.
A celebrated case of "Fake News" article. ::)
Here is my reference: https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/419294-highschool-newspaper-suspended-over-disruptive-investigation
And then long after the fact, part of the local media plays catchup while other ignore it:
https://5newsonline.com/2018/12/02/hs-newspaper-suspended-after-publishing-investigation-into-football-players-transfers/
Also of note is the 5 News article shows a "Fayetteville" origin for the story. That's misleading too.
Dem/Gaz just posted the story online
The whole NWA transfer thing is a joke. It goes on and in some instances is bragged about. If i recall correctly the FHS announcer stated that FHS had 14 transfers one year ( patton was coach) like it was a race to the finish with a trophy. How many kids transferred from Farmington to FHS. There have been transfers between other districts. The transfer rules are too lenient and I doubt the AAA will do anything about it.
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on December 03, 2018, 01:28:51 pm
Dem/Gaz just posted the story online
ARK Times(Garbage) as well, lol.
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on December 03, 2018, 01:28:51 pm
Dem/Gaz just posted the story online
Even though they new about it all along. They waited to let it break from an outside of the area source and then follow it with their own.
Quote from: B.G. on December 03, 2018, 06:01:06 pm
Even though they new about it all along. They waited to let it break from an outside of the area source and then follow it with their own.
They are OG media. This ain't their first rodeo lol.
No dog in this hunt, in fact, I just found out about the hoopla when my wife told me. My son graduated from HB several years ago and it was no secret that most of the kids did not like to play for Coach Wood. The first time I met him when my son was a sophomore, I told my wife later that he was a dipstick, a power hungry little man and was probably hacked that Gus left him in Springdale. Now, years later, my opinion has not changed a bit. My wife and I continued to go to the HB games for a few years after my son graduated because we knew a lot of the kids. Woods sideline demeanor was still lacking, he still played his favorites and still used the same 6 plays or so. One of the guys sitting close to us predicted 7 plays in a row before he finally got one wrong. If it can be done from the seats, then it stands to reason that an opposing coach could do it even better from watching a little bit of game film. Wood wasted a lot of talented kids over the years just by being a tinpot dictator. Having said all of that, I am not surprised by what is going on now. I remember it going on when I was kid in the 80's. The only difference is that it was Shiloh filching kids from the bigger schools. I am ambivalent if it right or wrong today, but it does go to show the AAA is not doing its job. Like that comes as a shock to those of us that have been watching it go on for a long time. Maybe, when the dust settles, something good will come from it. Maybe. I will say that Rollins and his crew probably shot themselves in the foot with the way that they seem to be handling it, but I have never been fond of Rollins, ever since he allowed the old growth trees (a pecan and a walnut if my memory serves) down that used to sit in front of flat building after telling the students they would be saved. Maybe that is a little petty considering that he has done a good job building schools and doing it responsibly during his tenure, but hey, I liked those trees. I will make some popcorn, sit back and see what happens in the here and now.
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on December 03, 2018, 01:28:51 pm
Dem/Gaz just posted the story online
http://digital.olivesoftware.com/Olive/ODN/ArDemocrat/shared/ShowArticle.aspx?doc=ARDEMOCRAT%2F2018%2F12%2F04&entity=Ar00911&sk=2F5597F4&mode=text
https://splc.org/2018/12/censored-story-athletes-transfers-in-question/
I'd like to ask Coach Clark one thing. Your team went 7-4 this year, and all year long this "incident" has been hovering over your head. Was it worth it?
https://www.nwaonline.com/news/2018/dec/04/springdale-district-silent-on-report-of/
District is allowing the article to be re-posted. "After consideration of the legal landscape..."
Geez who didn't see that coming. ::)
Quote from: HarBer Dad on December 04, 2018, 03:32:03 pm
https://www.nwaonline.com/news/2018/dec/04/springdale-district-silent-on-report-of/
District is allowing the article to be re-posted. "After consideration of the legal landscape..."
Geez who didn't see that coming. ::)
Waiting for the listen Mister
What we need now is the SHS paper to write an article.
Quote from: HarBer Dad on December 04, 2018, 03:32:03 pm
https://www.nwaonline.com/news/2018/dec/04/springdale-district-silent-on-report-of/
District is allowing the article to be re-posted. "After consideration of the legal landscape..."
Geez who didn't see that coming. ::)
I'm sure it had nothing to do with the fact that the article was out there anyway because a bunch of old dudes in administration didn't understand that just because you "delete" an article it is never really gone and those meddling kids can always find it ;). I am sure they would have come to the same conclusion if the article had stayed "deleted" ::)
Quote from: DoYouKnowWhoIThinkIam on December 04, 2018, 09:29:32 am
I'd like to ask Coach Clark one thing. Your team went 7-4 this year, and all year long this "incident" has been hovering over your head. Was it worth it?
+1
Quote from: HarBer Dad on December 04, 2018, 03:32:03 pm
https://www.nwaonline.com/news/2018/dec/04/springdale-district-silent-on-report-of/
District is allowing the article to be re-posted. "After consideration of the legal landscape..."
Geez who didn't see that coming. ::)
So they're admitting they were wrong... Only after being called out for it. How lovely....
It's always prudent to follow the law.
So for 10 years every Tom, Dick, and Herrera that was worth anything in athletics ended up at Har-Ber but the first time the polarity reverses NWA has a meltdown.
Geez if you're gonna have a recruiting scandal at least give the parents a job or something to sweeten the pot.
Quote from: we_hate_the_band on December 05, 2018, 09:00:27 am
So for 10 years every Tom, Dick, and Herrera that was worth anything in athletics ended up at Har-Ber but the first time the polarity reverses NWA has a meltdown.
Geez if you're gonna have a recruiting scandal at least give the parents a job or something to sweeten the pot.
I don't think people are as much upset now about the recruiting going back and forth as they are about the Harber administrators sanctioning their journalism program which is absurd. Recruiting has been going on forever and its never going to stop. A school shutting down their journalism program is something I have not heard of and doing so just because they did not like the negative publicity it gave the Springdale district as a whole...... and I am sure the courts will deem illegal if it all ends up going that far between the kids and the Harber administration.
Am I right or wrong?.... but I thought this is more now about the Harber administration doing what they did than this is about the recruiting. The recruiting thing does not amount to a criminal act. What the Harber administrators did could end up with the judicial system involved if the parents of the kids in the journalism class are mad enough. That's obviously up to them to decide.
Quote from: beach bum on December 05, 2018, 10:22:47 am
I don't think people are as much upset now about the recruiting going back and forth as they are about the Harber administrators sanctioning their journalism program which is absurd. Recruiting has been going on forever and its never going to stop. A school shutting down their journalism program is something I have not heard of and doing so just because they did not like the negative publicity it gave the Springdale district as a whole...... and I am sure the courts will deem illegal if it all ends up going that far between the kids and the Harber administration.
Am I right or wrong?.... but I thought this is more now about the Harber administration doing what they did than this is about the recruiting. The recruiting thing does not amount to a criminal act. What the Harber administrators did could end up with the judicial system involved if the parents of the kids in the journalism class are mad enough. That's obviously up to them to decide.
No you are exactly right. The transfer story was over and had died down. That was a very well researched article by student journalist but had only limited local interest and since football season was over for both teams the story was pretty much a non issue. THE story is Springdale School administration trying to censor and suspend the paper and threatening to fire the advisor over a story they don't claim is inaccurate just that it is inconvenient and does not fit their narrative . It is interesting that if you look at the national articles about this (Buzzfeed News, SPLC, Chicago Tribune etc)
everyone gets that it is about Freedom of the Press and Censorship and NOT about football or Harber VS Springdale. Unfortunately if you read any of the comments on the local stories a lot of it comes back to the "Well Harber has done this for years and they are especially upset because they got beat...". Do you seriously think the national media (and this is now a national story) cares if some Springdale Arkansas High School football player's transfers were legal or not? For the love of God THIS IS NO LONGER A FOOTBALL STORY THIS IS A FREEDOM OF THE PRESS STORY... and it is not over yet. The administration needs to be careful what they ask for. How is it going to look if the next issue of the paper they want to "review prior to publication" has a scathing article about censorship and how this whole thing played out ? Do you approve it or not? I am sure a lot of national publications would be interested in that decision....
Well, the original story was the amount of negativity that occurred between the transfers and the end of the game between the two. That was kept on the down low. The article is liking reading the final chapter of a book without reading the book.
Quote from: beach bum on December 05, 2018, 10:22:47 am
I don't think people are as much upset now about the recruiting going back and forth as they are about the Harber administrators sanctioning their journalism program which is absurd. Recruiting has been going on forever and its never going to stop. A school shutting down their journalism program is something I have not heard of and doing so just because they did not like the negative publicity it gave the Springdale district as a whole...... and I am sure the courts will deem illegal if it all ends up going that far between the kids and the Harber administration.
Am I right or wrong?.... but I thought this is more now about the Harber administration doing what they did than this is about the recruiting. The recruiting thing does not amount to a criminal act. What the Harber administrators did could end up with the judicial system involved if the parents of the kids in the journalism class are mad enough. That's obviously up to them to decide.
Timing. Story is released week 10 of football season. There's no doubt that the story was released to spite the other high school. At the time of the release, both high schools are in the playoffs. By the end of the week, one is forfeiting games and out.
My theory is simple, this whole incident was an embarrassment to Springdale Public Schools. I'm not pointing fingers but all involved have their parts in it. It is admirable that the HB student newspaper actually had the moxie to do the grunt work for a story that the NWADG would just polish and wax over. However, regardless of the intentions of the kids who transferred, they are just kids. Can't Discipline the kids for doing their jobs, blame it on the Advisor. Rookie Mistake.
If I were a parent and my child was mentioned by name by a student newspaper at another school, I would be irate. It's borderline bullying. Bullying, by definition in most school handbooks, is organized and ongoing harassment. I could see certain parents winning that fight.
Here's the long and short of it: Kids left because they wanted change. People were upset on both sides. Somebody tried to pet a burning dog and now it's Christmas and their world is on fire.
If stories are true its a combination of the bad PR and the way in which the school paper and those in charge handled it. When you work for the school and the boss asked to read controversial pieces before they are printed, you are borderline insubordinate if you do not make the piece available before printing. Most school administrators don't like surprises.
Quote from: game on on December 05, 2018, 01:22:24 pm
If stories are true its a combination of the bad PR and the way in which the school paper and those in charge handled it. When you work for the school and the boss asked to read controversial pieces before they are printed, you are borderline insubordinate if you do not make the piece available before printing. Most school administrators don't like surprises.
School administration is not a dictatorship that can censor something just because they don't like what they hear.... Schools are tax payer funded institutions not above the 1st amendment... Your job can fire you for saying something they don't like as they are private institutions, but a tax payer funded institution can not censor a news paper...... period. There was no insubordination whatsoever. Just an offended administrator who was in the wrong.
I didn't say an administrator would or would not censor, but as the school leader I have no problem with them knowing or asking to know what is coming out in the school paper. As I said, administrators don't like surprises. My understanding is the courts have ruled several times on the issue of freedom of press in the school paper. Asking to know in advance is not censorship. One of the most important things for a school to function well is cooperation and trust all the way up and down the scale.
couple of points:
if I was a parent and my kid was mentioned by name in a school newspaper I would probably be more upset with my kid and say something like "When you were approached by someone who identified themselves as doing an article on the transfers for the school paper why did you agree to talk to them and say that you were going to the other school just for football?" This is not even close to bullying. This is not saying the players sucked or anything like that. this was actual reporting with interviews and sources to back them up.
As for allowing the administration or principal prior access, student journalist and their advisors are protected under state law in Arkansas from just such actions from what I understand from many of the national articles. It's a little different than the principal asking to see the lesson plans for math class. It is not insubordination , it is exercising freedom of the press . As long as the articles are factual and do not meet the established criteria of being demeaning or slanderous ect the advisor is within her rights to refuse prior approval.
This comes from the NSPA, (National Scholastic Press Association). "While there exists fairly strong case law holding that prior review is unconstitutional at the public college level, there is no similar legal authority that flatly prohibits the practice in high schools. Indeed at least one federal appellate court has stated clearly that, "Writers on a high school newspaper do not have an unfettered constitutional right to be free from pre-publication review," and the Supreme Court, while not quite as blunt, has said that school officials can exercise "prepublication control" over school-sponsored high school media, even absent written guidelines."
The article in question was a clarification of "prior review" versus "prior restraint".
^^^^THIS^^^^
It's a class/extracurricular activity, not a job.
Coach Clark gonna make it through this mess ok?
Why wouldn't he..?? Did he violate some Springdale school district or AAA policy?
I'm really referring to the video that leaked earlier this year.
That's what I'm talkin about too...
While he may regret going to one of the transfers home, I don't think that that's a violation of a Springdale school system or AAA rule. May not have look good, but I'm not sure that it's illegal either.
Quote from: footballfan-tastic on December 05, 2018, 06:27:24 pm
This comes from the NSPA, (National Scholastic Press Association). "While there exists fairly strong case law holding that prior review is unconstitutional at the public college level, there is no similar legal authority that flatly prohibits the practice in high schools. Indeed at least one federal appellate court has stated clearly that, "Writers on a high school newspaper do not have an unfettered constitutional right to be free from pre-publication review," and the Supreme Court, while not quite as blunt, has said that school officials can exercise "prepublication control" over school-sponsored high school media, even absent written guidelines."
The article in question was a clarification of "prior review" versus "prior restraint".
From what I understand from this article unless certain are met (obscene etc) prior review by administration is against the Arkansas law passed in 1995 https://splc.org/2018/12/arkansas-high-school-paper-republishes-censored-story-but-prior-review-and-threat-to-advisers-job-remain/
Im a little confused, how do you know if there is any type of rule violation in the school newspaper unless you have read it first. You know Nancy Pelosi, "pass it so you can find out what's in it".
Now take 15 min and read another viewpoint. https://50yearsandcounting.blog/2018/12/10/pound-of-flesh-context-the-blurb-society-and-the-weaponization-of-the-school-newspaper/
^^seems to me the author is prepared to retire soon
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on December 11, 2018, 01:42:50 pm
^^seems to me the author is prepared to retire soon
Not hardly. She has several years left to be a positive leader at SHS
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on December 11, 2018, 01:51:46 pm
Not hardly. She has several years left to be a positive leader at SHS
Good thing
Quote from: B.G. on December 11, 2018, 01:22:44 pm
Now take 15 min and read another viewpoint. https://50yearsandcounting.blog/2018/12/10/pound-of-flesh-context-the-blurb-society-and-the-weaponization-of-the-school-newspaper/
Somebody had a lot of time to spill their feelings. Unfortunately there are people on both sides of every issue and usually a million different views on who is right and who is wrong. I'll only address a couple of issues since i don't think my views will change any minds.
Coach Clark. He has done a good job at getting SHS back to being competitve. He made a huge PR error in staying at the parent party in which swearing and burning of HBHS gear was practiced. His choice to go was fine, but to stay and get himself identified on the video was bad. He should have excused himself when it got ugly. That would have been a better message to his players, his community.
As for the article in HBHS. I'm a supporter of teacher/administrator supervision. I have little problem with prior review as long as that's what it is, just review to make certain standards are met. I'm all for freedom of speech but responsible freedom of speech.
I do take a bit of issue with the "rich school" claim for HBHS. The free/discounted lunch count at HBHS is 48% and SHS is 70%. A difference but honestly 50% is high. It just shows the community, entire community of Springdale is not as priveleged as many believe. Yes many do well, but many do not and there are disadvantaged students at both schools.
I applaud the good fight that many teachers fight daily. I commend the work that coaches do. The problem is the unfortunate high level of importance placed on athletics. It's a big deal, was and is to me still but the anger that people seem to come to over a Friday night game is often disturbing. That a group of students and their parents were so unhappy with a coach or program that they collectively chose to transfer isn't new and not necessarily even a bad thing. What is bad is that the process was obviously not clearly and openly followed. The fault there is on everyone concerned. If you want to leave and have reasons that fit the rules established by the school district and the AAA, so be it. File your papers, transfer your children and do the grown up thing and stay quiet unless there is a reason to go to the administrators to complain. Airing dirty laundry in the press, even the school press is hard on everyone and did it serve a purpose? I doubt it.
Most of those kids will graduate this school year I believe and hopefully they all had good experiences after the transfer. I understand at least one transferred back to HBHS. I could be wrong on that. Problem now is you have helped to widen the divide in your city over high school athletics. You have also opened the door to open transfers whenever you don't like a coach or teacher. I love the concept of local schools and the school community. I think its a great bond for those who attend their local school. Moving across town to attend the "better" school is a shame and every possible attempt should be made to make schools as equal in opportunity as possible.
Quote from: B.G. on December 11, 2018, 01:22:44 pm
Now take 15 min and read another viewpoint. https://50yearsandcounting.blog/2018/12/10/pound-of-flesh-context-the-blurb-society-and-the-weaponization-of-the-school-newspaper/
Very interesting viewpoint, and it really explains a lot about the mentality of that community, and kudos to her on writing it. Give that teacher a medal.
Har-Ber is ridiculous
HarBer has some work to do to get back in the hunt for a conference and state title. Most things run in cycles.
The west has changed some in the last few years, a little more balance on the top end but overall fallen off in comparison to the east.
Quote from: game on on December 19, 2018, 03:17:35 pm
The west has changed some in the last few years, a little more balance on the top end but overall fallen off in comparison to the east.
Things do tend to go in cycles. Fan base, coaches and administration changes all figure into the equation. Har-Ber will come back, but it will take some different mind set in coaching and still be all for a community of students for ALL of Springdale.
Quote from: B.G. on December 11, 2018, 01:22:44 pm
Now take 15 min and read another viewpoint. https://50yearsandcounting.blog/2018/12/10/pound-of-flesh-context-the-blurb-society-and-the-weaponization-of-the-school-newspaper/
First time I've seen this. That's 15 minutes of my life I'll never get back.
In a bizarre turn of events, a group of Springdale High students, including some talented football and basketball athletes, began attending Har-Ber High School this week.
Let the fireworks begin...again.
Tis the season.
Guarantee there will not be any fireworks this time. Kids have been moving to Har-Ber from Springdale for years, and the administrators never cared. It was only when they were moving the wrong direction last year that the stuff hit the fan. This will tell the general public if the district really holds both schools on the same regard, or if there really is a red-headed step child.
Quote from: theoleballcoach on March 09, 2019, 05:50:41 pm
Guarantee there will not be any fireworks this time. Kids have been moving to Har-Ber from Springdale for years, and the administrators never cared. It was only when they were moving the wrong direction last year that the stuff hit the fan. This will tell the general public if the district really holds both schools on the same regard, or if there really is a red-headed step child.
Guarantees. Hmm. Anyway, for the record, I don't think these players were recruited. I do think, however, the district has been at fault for allowing athletes to transfer for atheletic purposes under the disguise of transferring for academic purposes. It's a sham. Players, parents, and coaches need to learn to work through their differences and stop asking for (and receiving) special treatment when they face some adversity or simply can't get along. Sometimes you have to play for a coach you don't like. Just like with adults—sometimes you have to work for a boss you don't like.
Transfer portal is open.
Preach
Quote from: theoleballcoach on March 09, 2019, 05:50:41 pm
Guarantee there will not be any fireworks this time. Kids have been moving to Har-Ber from Springdale for years, and the administrators never cared. It was only when they were moving the wrong direction last year that the stuff hit the fan. This will tell the general public if the district really holds both schools on the same regard, or if there really is a red-headed step child.
I wish the 7A west would not allow any transfers within the conference. Its been going on for years and does nothing good for the sport. Second coaches shouldn't be able to encourage kids to transfer and yes it has been going on for years.
Athletics transfers (mainly by using a so-called change of address) have been happening across America for decades, and it will continue to happen. There is nothing anyone in a free society can do to stop it. "Putting a stop to it" with local level tyrants would be disastrous, and using state level tyrants to achieve it would even be worse.
The reason this story is so interesting is the psych aspect - we can't turn away from getting a view of the narcissistic hypocrisy of Har-Ber screaming and yelling when they don't get their way, when they know they are guilty of much worse. When they even had a side-issue of an ineligible player during all this; ignored by the news stories.
The supposed Edward R Murrow moments for the HB school paper and the newspaper adviser are cringeworthy. A drama queen leading a little army of new entitled drama queens. I'm no fan of case law run amok (I'm a constitutional fan), but the very reasonable court case decision presented by one poster here defining the difference between college level newspapers and high school level, fell on deaf ears, because some on here are drama queens themselves, and refuse to let go of their infantile arguments.
Making the bonfire into an issue is another example of a Har-Ber temper tantrum.
And I heard one of the Springdale to Har Ber transfers...transferred back to Springdale for the Spring semester... what do you want to bet they thought Springdale would have the better baseball team...
Quote from: STBruin on April 05, 2019, 10:21:07 pm
And I heard one of the Springdale to Har Ber transfers...transferred back to Springdale for the Spring semester... what do you want to bet they thought Springdale would have the better baseball team...
You heard wrong. No one has transferred back to either school with the exception of one who went to SHS last spring then went back to HB during the summer.
We do have transfers from SHS to HB this Spring for basketball with the word one will be playing FB as well.
Additionally, the HB basketball has several new looks.
Such is life.
Quote from: Rob Van Winkle on April 06, 2019, 10:46:23 am
You heard wrong. No one has transferred back to either school with the exception of one who went to SHS last spring then went back to HB during the summer.
My apologies
Hey Rob,
Was that you or your family who had the anniversary announcement at the game tonight?
Quote from: 5tooldad on April 22, 2019, 10:53:07 pm
Hey Rob,
Was that you or your family who had the anniversary announcement at the game tonight?
Yes it was! Appreciate the BV fans for making that happen!