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Officiating at 5A state tournament

Started by The A-Team, March 04, 2017, 06:02:03 pm

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The A-Team

First I want o say that I'm not a referee badger.  But I have to say that this was the worst officiating I have ever seen in any tournament nevertheless the state tournament. The lasted entirely too long. Mainly because the refs blew their whistles continuously. There was so many incorrect calls, officials confused on signals, and officials calling out of their area. It's like they thought the people was there to see them perform not the kids. I think that's the last 5A tournament for me. Technical fouls was administered more than ever. It was embarrassing.

woopork

I agree with you. I hate when parents nonstop yell at the officials because most of the time parents are dumbly biased, but this has been ridiculous. Its like they are all power hungry. Let the kids play ball and call it when there's an actual foul cause you can't consistently call all these touch fouls.

sevenof400

Quote from: The A-Team on March 04, 2017, 06:02:03 pm
First I want o say that I'm not a referee badger.  But I have to say that this was the worst officiating I have ever seen in any tournament nevertheless the state tournament. The lasted entirely too long. Mainly because the refs blew their whistles continuously. There was so many incorrect calls, officials confused on signals, and officials calling out of their area. It's like they thought the people was there to see them perform not the kids. I think that's the last 5A tournament for me. Technical fouls was administered more than ever. It was embarrassing.

Maybe the coaches and players should learn to control their tempers. 

mijally

Someone needs to invent an electronic jersey for players to wear like they do in fencing. Every time you're touched with a certain amount of pressure a red light goes off and it's a foul.  No arguing. Of course with the way players flop they would probably just hit themselves to try and draw a foul.

The A-Team

Quote from: sevenof400 on March 04, 2017, 06:23:50 pm
Maybe the coaches and players should learn to control their tempers.
Maybe the AOA should enforce the coaches box rule all year and not wait until state. And maybe they shouldn't call a tech on a kid who was not even involved in the play.

Yellowcake

I guess you had to be there tonight. It was sad and pathetic. i hope the championship games get better.

MDXPHD

I wonder how many people complaining about the refs support teams that advanced to the championship...

beach bum

Quote from: sevenof400 on March 04, 2017, 06:23:50 pm
Maybe the coaches and players should learn to control their tempers.

+1....  I played for the same coach for 7th-12th grade and witnessed him get a technical foul once in six years. It amazes me how often I see some of these coaches get techs. I agree they should learn to control their temper.

Ozark Hog

Witness some really bad calls this year, and what makes it worse is when the official who is not even in position to make the call will blow his whistle while the official with a better view doesn't call anything!

sevenof400

Quote from: Ozark Hog on March 05, 2017, 10:24:24 am
Witness some really bad calls this year, and what makes it worse is when the official who is not even in position to make the call will blow his whistle while the official with a better view doesn't call anything!

This is a problem with the 3 man system of officiating.  In the days of two man, a pair of referees typically worked together for most of the year and, as a result, knew their partner well.  They could (more easily) work as a team, projecting a consistent level of what was (and was not) acceptable (i.e. what was - and was not - a foul).

For all of the positives that can be cited about 3 man crews, the lack of continuity of crews is one of the most serious criticisms that exist.  Come playoff time, it is likely that a decent number of referees may not have worked together before and that creates an additional burden on the referees to call a consistent game. 

Yellowcake

Quote from: MDXPHD on March 05, 2017, 09:39:35 am
I wonder how many people complaining about the refs support teams that advanced to the championship...

The ultimate troll with a single agenda.
Ask around. But stick to talking to folks who were there. I encourage you to visit with objective ones who had no dog in the fight.
May not line up with your agenda, though. And it's all about your agenda.

FanOfAllTime

Quote from: Yellowcake on March 05, 2017, 11:18:38 am
The ultimate troll with a single agenda.
Ask around. But stick to talking to folks who were there. I encourage you to visit with objective ones who had no dog in the fight.
May not line up with your agenda, though. And it's all about your agenda.

Wow. 

Fact based accusations or personal speculation?   

MDXPHD

March 05, 2017, 12:41:35 pm #12 Last Edit: March 05, 2017, 12:46:35 pm by MDXPHD
I predict the answer to my question is none. None of the people complaining have a team in the championship. And I also predict that none of them ref, even though they could because they have plenty of time to go to all of these games and complain.

The A-Team

Quote from: MDXPHD on March 05, 2017, 09:39:35 am
I wonder how many people complaining about the refs support teams that advanced to the championship...
i didn't have a did in the fight. I'm just a realist.

The A-Team

Quote from: MDXPHD on March 05, 2017, 12:41:35 pm
I predict the answer to my question is none. None of the people complaining have a team in the championship. And I also predict that none of them ref, even though they could because they have plenty of time to go to all of these games and complain.
Give up predicting. It's not your thing. Because you just don't know how WRONG you are.

Red Devil Alum

Quote from: MDXPHD on March 05, 2017, 12:41:35 pm
I predict the answer to my question is none. None of the people complaining have a team in the championship. And I also predict that none of them ref, even though they could because they have plenty of time to go to all of these games and complain.
When you take two seconds to think about it, this is a dumb post.

Grond

I think there is a problem, in general, with high school basket in that it is "OK to hound the refs".

The game has become more complicated; "walking", unless very obvious, is difficult to call; "3 seconds in the lane" almost ceases to exist.

The difficulty of calling The Game has made it easier to criticize the way it is called.

When they start cancelling games because of a lack of refs, maybe something will be done to simply the calls.

hogfan7

In most cases, at least two officials should be on the whistle, hand up for the call.  I rarely see two officials making the call now.  I will say this, if Brad Davidson is your partner, he tries very hard to be timely with his other referees.  He does a good job.

Rulesman

Quote from: hogfan7 on March 07, 2017, 12:30:13 pm
In most cases, at least two officials should be on the whistle, hand up for the call.  I rarely see two officials making the call now.
Two officials making the same call is not necessarily a good thing. If 2 officials are making the same call, it usually means 2 officials are ball watching, leaving one to watch everything else.

MDXPHD

Quote from: Rulesman on March 07, 2017, 01:58:13 pm
Two officials making the same call is not necessarily a good thing. If 2 officials are making the same call, it usually means 2 officials are ball watching, leaving one to watch everything else.

How dare you defend these horrible people who don't get paid enough to officiate. Yet, they choose to do it and get bashed by these fans (who would definitely be better refs), which allows us to have high school sports.

jrhall2

There would be no argument as long as there was consistency. With consistency I believe everyone would be accepting of the officiating. If your going to call touch fouls call them both ways and let the coaches know before the game you are going to call it tight. If you are going to let the teams play a little then let them know that and call it both ways. Do not let a less physical team play physical on one end and as soon as the bigger, faster team starts playing physical its a foul on that end. I have also seen it change throughout the course of the game. When a team starts to show their dominance all of a sudden what was not a foul in the 1st quarter all of a sudden is in the second half when there is a substantial lead, which I understand about adjustments but officials have to understand coaches and players adjust their style of play usually at half depending on how the first half was called. If it is a physical game the first half, they change to be more physical, and then without warning in the second half referees completely change and start calling touch fouls. Also I have seen crews where one ref may hardly blow a whistle and let the kids play ball, bumping and being physical unless it impedes the play of the game, then another referee will blow his whistle as soon as a player drives right before he makes contact anticipating the foul. Like with anything consistency is the biggest key, know what your going to get before it happens. Also, remember us fans are there to see the kids play ball, not the officials, or the coaches griping either. Griping and being rude does the coach no good, being inconsistent and rude does the official no good. It is a double edged sword. As soon as both sides agree both are human and that mistakes are made every now and then but its your personal job to do the best at officiating or coaching that you can, the better experience all of us will get watching these games.

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