Fearless Friday Bulletin Boards

Occasionally I end up with a shot or two that doesn't fit on my web site (as it is now) but I want to share them - at least with the guys/gals in the pics.

That's why these three pics are here.  If you know these guys, please let them know that they can copy these pics and print 'em, put them on the FB page or e-mail 'em to grandma (my preference is that they send 'em to grandma  ;).)





I'm fond of the punt series.  Since PA doesn't normally punt, I don't get a lot of practice shooting this.  I think the first two shots are okay, but I really need to work on that last one - getting the action of the ball and the kicker in better focus while still in the same frame.

What shutter speed were you using.

I think the ball blur is due to shutter speed , not focus,

Great pics, anyway, all of them!

Quote from: bird dog on September 20, 2009, 02:41:08 pmWhat shutter speed were you using.

I think the ball blur is due to shutter speed , not focus.

1/400.  Because of lighting on this field, I have to really open my camera up.  I set the f-stop at 2.8 and my ISO was 6400.

Because the f-stop is so wide open I get very little depth of field.

It is something I really, really have to work on when I shoot in low-light areas.

I would love to hear suggestions from anyone to help with the ball blur because I think it is my error in focusing more than the camera.

QuoteGreat pics, anyway, all of them!

Thanks!   ;D

Yep, its a balancing act, especially as the sun is going down, between getting shutter speed, ISO, and aperature just right.

Looks like you were fortunate to be at a well lighted field, judging from what I see. Teams with black jerseys just dont show up very well at some of the places I shoot, 2AA.

Quote from: bird dog on September 20, 2009, 04:50:25 pmLooks like you were fortunate to be at a well lighted field, judging from what I see. Teams with black jerseys just dont show up very well at some of the places I shoot, 2AA.

Gee thanks!  You just made me snort coffee out of my nose cos I was laughing so hard.   ;)

Yes, PA has a good field, but I wouldn't call it "well-lighted."

Sad thing is the PA guys, the ones in the dark jersey's are wearing blue - not black - and those shots were taken sometime after 9 p.m.

I love shooting there because not only is football fun to shoot - it is the most challenging field I shoot on - you can't be complacent - you always have to be aware of the  action and lights.

I haven't shot any 2AA around here, but I did shoot some very small schools years ago when I was in Texas and shooting football for newspapers.  Light was challenging back then too - only a different challenge because I used film cameras.  Pushing film to 1600 was about as daring as we got back then.  LOL

I enjoy the challenge of low-light situations with lots of movement.  If someone is standing still in broad daylight I can hardly get a picture.  But, if you are moving and it's dark, I'll get the shot.  Go figure. 

They look good to me, Even better at 6400, Im surprised they arent noisy. What kind of camera and lens are you using?
Do you use a flash ?

Quote from: onegearruss on September 20, 2009, 10:14:51 pmThey look good to me, Even better at 6400, Im surprised they arent noisy. What kind of camera and lens are you using?
Do you use a flash ?

Thanks.  They get some noise when I start to blow them up large-size.  For use on the web and small prints they stay pretty clear.

No flash.  It is rare for me to use a flash - ever.  A reknowned rock photographer once told me to chunk the flash because it makes pictures look fake.  He told me to learn to shoot without one.

So, I put the flash up and I rarely take it out.

This is my first season to shoot with Canon's new EOS 5D - Mark II.  It is a bit of adjustment from my regular 5D but I'm learning to like it.

I use a Canon L-Series 70-200 - 2.8 - lense.  It is my workhorse and I shoot just about everything with it.

No Flash is the only way to go!

Quote from: Rhonda Elizabeth on September 20, 2009, 10:47:17 pm

Quote from: onegearruss on September 20, 2009, 10:14:51 pmThey look good to me, Even better at 6400, Im surprised they arent noisy. What kind of camera and lens are you using?
Do you use a flash ?

Thanks.  They get some noise when I start to blow them up large-size.  For use on the web and small prints they stay pretty clear.

No flash.  It is rare for me to use a flash - ever.  A reknowned rock photographer once told me to chunk the flash because it makes pictures look fake.  He told me to learn to shoot without one.

So, I put the flash up and I rarely take it out.

This is my first season to shoot with Canon's new EOS 5D - Mark II.  It is a bit of adjustment from my regular 5D but I'm learning to like it.

I use a Canon L-Series 70-200 - 2.8 - lense.  It is my workhorse and I shoot just about everything with it.

See you have a much nicer lens and camera then me.

Quote from: bird dog on September 20, 2009, 10:52:53 pm
No Flash is the only way to go!

Im shooting 1/200, 2.8, and 1000. I need a flash for my pictures are dark and my iso is already TOO HIGH.

Quote from: Rhonda Elizabeth on September 20, 2009, 04:22:14 pmI would love to hear suggestions from anyone to help with the ball blur because I think it is my error in focusing more than the camera.

That's not going to be an error in focusing...a quick calculation shows at a focus distance of 30 yards and 200mm at f/2.8, you've got a seven foot depth of field. It's simply shutter speed, or lack thereof.

To freeze any kind of motion, you're going to have to get above 1/1000...something you simply can't do at the stadiums in Arkansas. I was able to get over 1/1000 at the new Cowboys Stadium earlier this season, and can usually get the same at War Memorial and DWR Stadium. But that's something you'll only see at professional and major Division I schools that have hundreds of lights—not a school with three light poles on either side of the field.

In most of the OP's photos, you can see the lights cycling. It's because there's just not enough light on the field. At the bigger stadiums mentioned above, the cycling effect tends to cancel out.

Quote from: C_A_Morris on September 21, 2009, 12:22:38 am

Quote from: Rhonda Elizabeth on September 20, 2009, 04:22:14 pmI would love to hear suggestions from anyone to help with the ball blur because I think it is my error in focusing more than the camera.

That's not going to be an error in focusing...a quick calculation shows at a focus distance of 30 yards and 200mm at f/2.8, you've got a seven foot depth of field. It's simply shutter speed, or lack thereof.

Accckkk!  You brought up math!  In a discussion about photography!!  Oh the horror!   ;)

Okay, seriously.  It might be a quick calculation for you, but I have to consult my little book on photography and pull out the calculator to come up with my depth of field, but I didn't think that shooting at 2.8 would give you seven feet in any situation. 

Depth of field is something I have to literally stop and think about - which I usually don't have time to do with the type of work I do - so I just usualy think of the lower f-stops and nearly nothing and the higher ones much broader and go from there.

QuoteTo freeze any kind of motion, you're going to have to get above 1/1000...something you simply can't do at the stadiums in Arkansas. I was able to get over 1/1000 at the new Cowboys Stadium earlier this season, and can usually get the same at War Memorial and DWR Stadium. But that's something you'll only see at professional and major Division I schools that have hundreds of lights—not a school with three light poles on either side of the field.

I disagree to a point.  I can freeze action quite well in the 400-500 range.  1/1000 and above is nice, but not required.

I do agree that lighting is an issue at many high schools, but last year I shot on the road a lot and found several schools had really nice lights.  Lakeside and Greenwood come to mind.

War Memorial was so bright that the first time I shot there I couldn't get accustomed to the lighting and most of my first shots were over-exposed.  LOL  I've never shot at cowboy stadium.

QuoteIn most of the OP's photos, you can see the lights cycling. It's because there's just not enough light on the field. At the bigger stadiums mentioned above, the cycling effect tends to cancel out.

Please post that in law somewhere for  me.  I try to tell people that the lights cycle and the impact it has on my work and they look at me like I've lost my mind.

I've had people stare at the field trying to see what I'm talking about and then they turn to me and say "nope, don't see it" and give me that 'you just ain't too bright look.'

I'll show people a series of rapid-fire shots of a stationary person - no change in settings and they can see the change in the lighting, but insist that I did it by changing something on my camera.

Of course lighting has taught me a wonderful life lesson - you don't always see everything that is there and sometimes what we do see isn't what is actually happening ...

quote
I disagree to a point.  I can freeze action quite well in the 400-500 range. 
quote

Yes, you can if its a person running, but not a football in flight and Definitely not a baseball in flight.

The posts from C.A. Morris, Bird dog and Onegearruss have some excellent points.

If I may - in a nutshell - some ball blur is going to be a given for sports shots in many of the high school venues in this state because of lighting.

It is a relief to hear that others battle these same issues because I see others shooting on Friday nights and it makes me wonder ...

They all seem to be doing this without much effort and many get great shots.  I've wondered if they know some magic trick with a camera that I have yet to learn.

I do realize that some of those folks aren't that good and I've seen some work that should never have been shown to anyone.  LOL

Bottom line, it's nice to know that I'm not the only one out there struggling to get that "perfect shot."

Thanks guys.

depth of field calculator:

http://www.dofmaster.com/dofjs.html

Can be helpful

Quote from: bird dog on September 20, 2009, 10:52:53 pm
No Flash is the only way to go!

Flash for football is OK, if you know what you are doing.

Low flash for football or it produces terrible shadows

And I have shot at P.A. And C.A.C.  Both stadiums have poor lighting.  Those are great photos considering the circumstances.  It's tough.  Good job Rhonda. 

Quote from: photographer on September 17, 2013, 07:15:09 pm
Low flash for football or it produces terrible shadows

Are saying that the flash should be below the camera? If so, the flash output must be well balanced or you will have large shadows rising behind your subject.

No I mean turn it down manually

Quote from: photographer on September 20, 2013, 12:49:12 pm
No I mean turn it down manually

My bad. I misunderstood your meaning.