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Do you hear that?

Started by Red Devil Alum, November 28, 2015, 11:51:08 am

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Lionheart88

Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 01:51:53 pm
The fart sniffing on this thread has gotten to the point that it's almost sickening. To call any football coach a "genius" is rediculous!

I don't care what they have done or how they do it.
+1

Grond

Quote from: Lionheart88 on November 29, 2015, 02:11:03 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 01:51:53 pm
The fart sniffing on this thread has gotten to the point that it's almost sickening. To call any football coach a "genius" is rediculous!

I don't care what they have done or how they do it.
+1

-1 & -1

"Stupid is as stupid does."

PA Dad

"A genius is a person who displays exceptional intellectual ability, creativity, or originality, typically to a degree that is associated with the achievement of new advances in a domain."

I think Coach Kelley meets that definition with the originality of his scheme.  As far as I can determine, he is the only coach in the world who runs his scheme.  That's exceptional originality.

What definition of genius are you using, and how does Kelley fail to meet it?

purpleswag

Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:21:57 pm
"A genius is a person who displays exceptional intellectual ability, creativity, or originality, typically to a degree that is associated with the achievement of new advances in a domain."

I think Coach Kelley meets that definition with the originality of his scheme.  As far as I can determine, he is the only coach in the world who runs his scheme.  That's exceptional originality.

What definition of genius are you using, and how does Kelley fail to meet it?



Websters dictionary- smug: having or showing the annoying quality of people who feel very pleased or satisfied with their abilities or achievements etc.

Overdahill

^^ I like your self portrait :P

PA Dad

Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 02:42:17 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:21:57 pm
"A genius is a person who displays exceptional intellectual ability, creativity, or originality, typically to a degree that is associated with the achievement of new advances in a domain."

I think Coach Kelley meets that definition with the originality of his scheme.  As far as I can determine, he is the only coach in the world who runs his scheme.  That's exceptional originality.

What definition of genius are you using, and how does Kelley fail to meet it?



Websters dictionary- smug: having or showing the annoying quality of people who feel very pleased or satisfied with their abilities or achievements etc.

Cute, but you didn't answer my question.  If you're going to make a statement, you should be prepared to defend it with a rational, fact based explanation.  If you can do that, please enlighten us.  If you can't, be man enough to admit you were off base.

Maynard G Krebs

Re Coach Kelley and his "system" , methods or whatever you wish to call it.  This is a cut and paste from a post of mine in 2008 about some talk about the Pulaski Theory".  I've hi-lited in bold what I think is one of the most important element of what makes PA successful. 


Class 5A Bulletin Board Material / Re: Helena-West Helena vs Pulaski Academy
« on: September 07, 2008, 08:38:07 pm »
To begin with, congratulations to Helena-West Helena Central High School on their victory Friday night. 

I am growing weary of the postings on this thread that question Coach Kelley and his decisions, the personal attacks on other posters and the snide remarks about the HWH community. 

All the pre-game smack talk and repartee did not originate from the PA community.  The verbal attacks aimed at HWH and its recent curfew situation came from posters outside the central AR area.  This can be easily confirmed by scanning the posts.  No poster affiliated with PA has made excuses or whined about the game.   I have made two trips to HWH for ball games the past three years and have not witnessed anybody act inappropriate, rude or disrespectful to the out of town visitors.  The sole exception is the incident last Friday when a thrown rock shattered the window on a fan bus.  I will not judge the entire community by one bad apple.  As a matter of fact, before the broken window incident, I personally thanked the ladies at the gate for being good hosts and I also had the opportunity to congratulate some of the Cougars as they headed to their dressing room and they were very polite.

As for Coach Kelley and his philosophy that has been dubbed "the Pulaski Theory":  As a fan, armchair QB and such, it is easy to criticize.  Coaches Wood and DePriest have already adequately addressed it on why PA does what it does.  Consider these results of the past several years on PA's 4th down conversion success:
      2007 – 49% 
      2006 – 59%
      2005 – 46%
      2004 – 47%
      2003 – 50%
I have not taken time to analyze field position of all the attempts, but what I think is important is what the players believe.  And they believe that every offensive play, regardless of down or field position is a scoring opportunity.  After the Monticello game last year (referenced in an earlier post by Coach Wood), I began to quiz my son about the failed conversion from our own 6 yard line, and before I could get the question completed, my son cut me short and looked me straight in the eye and said, "We did the right thing!"  At that time, I began to understand the mindset of the Bruins and Coach Kelley, and I find the conviction of the coaching staff and players inspiring

My son played for Coach Kelley for three years and I cannot begin to tell you how much my son admires and respects him, both as a coach and as a man.  He is a man of strong character and has taught the young men he has coached many lessons in life that transcend athletics.

For all the posters that feel it necessary to make personal attacks and insults, please stop it.  As for those that consider Coach Kelley's coaching strategy as arrogant, I suggest you learn to distinguish confidence from arrogance.  I apologize for the length of this post, but it is actually an abbreviated version of what I wanted to say.

PA Dad


purpleswag

Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:58:30 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 02:42:17 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:21:57 pm
"A genius is a person who displays exceptional intellectual ability, creativity, or originality, typically to a degree that is associated with the achievement of new advances in a domain."

I think Coach Kelley meets that definition with the originality of his scheme.  As far as I can determine, he is the only coach in the world who runs his scheme.  That's exceptional originality.

What definition of genius are you using, and how does Kelley fail to meet it?



Websters dictionary- smug: having or showing the annoying quality of people who feel very pleased or satisfied with their abilities or achievements etc.

Cute, but you didn't answer my question.  If you're going to make a statement, you should be prepared to defend it with a rational, fact based explanation.  If you can do that, please enlighten us.  If you can't, be man enough to admit you were off base.

Can you? Has he invented something? Has he changed the way the game is played? Someone said that he got the stats from a book. So I read my history book and make an A on every test.....am I a history "genius?" He read about it and applied it to his scheme. I'm not saying that he isn't a good or even great coach because he wins a lot of games, But you guys really need to get over yourselves.

There is absolutely no way that you can prove that he is the only coach that on-side kicks the ball or goes for it on 4th down. And there is also no way I can prove the opposite.

purpleswag

Again not saying he's not an excellent coach. That's not my intention at all. Just that genius is a bit much

PA Dad

M. M
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 03:14:14 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:58:30 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 02:42:17 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:21:57 pm
"A genius is a person who displays exceptional intellectual ability, creativity, or originality, typically to a degree that is associated with the achievement of new advances in a domain."

I think Coach Kelley meets that definition with the originality of his scheme.  As far as I can determine, he is the only coach in the world who runs his scheme.  That's exceptional originality.

What definition of genius are you using, and how does Kelley fail to meet it?



Websters dictionary- smug: having or showing the annoying quality of people who feel very pleased or satisfied with their abilities or achievements etc.

Cute, but you didn't answer my question.  If you're going to make a statement, you should be prepared to defend it with a rational, fact based explanation.  If you can do that, please enlighten us.  If you can't, be man enough to admit you were off base.

Can you? Has he invented something? Has he changed the way the game is played? Someone said that he got the stats from a book. So I read my history book and make an A on every test.....am I a history "genius?" He read about it and applied it to his scheme. I'm not saying that he isn't a good or even great coach because he wins a lot of games, But you guys really need to get over yourselves.

There is absolutely no way that you can prove that he is the only coach that on-side kicks the ball or goes for it on 4th down. And there is also no way I can prove the opposite.

Actually, I explained my reasoning above.  It's based upon the originality of his scheme. 

You're right that I can't prove that he's the only coach that uses his scheme.  But, the fact that you can't name another coach who does so tends to prove my point.  If he's the only one we can name, I'd say he's original.

Taking the research and applying it like no one else has qualifies as original in my book.

It's fine if you want to denigrate him or me.  Many others have.  But I think the facts are on my side.

I'm not sure what I'm supposed to get over?  Pride in the originality of our coach?  Please enlighten me.

purpleswag

November 29, 2015, 04:02:28 pm #111 Last Edit: November 29, 2015, 04:36:42 pm by purpleswag
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 03:24:53 pm
M. M
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 03:14:14 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:58:30 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 02:42:17 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:21:57 pm
"A genius is a person who displays exceptional intellectual ability, creativity, or originality, typically to a degree that is associated with the achievement of new advances in a domain."

I think Coach Kelley meets that definition with the originality of his scheme.  As far as I can determine, he is the only coach in the world who runs his scheme.  That's exceptional originality.

What definition of genius are you using, and how does Kelley fail to meet it?



Websters dictionary- smug: having or showing the annoying quality of people who feel very pleased or satisfied with their abilities or achievements etc.

Cute, but you didn't answer my question.  If you're going to make a statement, you should be prepared to defend it with a rational, fact based explanation.  If you can do that, please enlighten us.  If you can't, be man enough to admit you were off base.

Can you? Has he invented something? Has he changed the way the game is played? Someone said that he got the stats from a book. So I read my history book and make an A on every test.....am I a history "genius?" He read about it and applied it to his scheme. I'm not saying that he isn't a good or even great coach because he wins a lot of games, But you guys really need to get over yourselves.

There is absolutely no way that you can prove that he is the only coach that on-side kicks the ball or goes for it on 4th down. And there is also no way I can prove the opposite.

Actually, I explained my reasoning above.  It's based upon the originality of his scheme. 

You're right that I can't prove that he's the only coach that uses his scheme.  But, the fact that you can't name another coach who does so tends to prove my point.  If he's the only one we can name, I'd say he's original.

Taking the research and applying it like no one else has qualifies as original in my book.

It's fine if you want to denigrate him or me.  Many others have.  But I think the facts are on my side.

I'm not sure what I'm supposed to get over?  Pride in the originality of our coach?  Please enlighten me.

I apologize if you think my posts were to "denigrate" you or Coach Kelley. It wasn't my intention to do so.

I feel this is simply a difference in the way we interpret the use of the word "genius."

IDK maybe genius also implies that it comes easy to him. I would be willing to bet that a lot of what people call genius is just absolute preparation and perspiration on the part of the coaches and players

If you have the time I would love to read about the achievement of any new advances that he has come up with.






PA Dad

Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 04:02:28 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 03:24:53 pm
M. M
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 03:14:14 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:58:30 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 02:42:17 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:21:57 pm
"A genius is a person who displays exceptional intellectual ability, creativity, or originality, typically to a degree that is associated with the achievement of new advances in a domain."

I think Coach Kelley meets that definition with the originality of his scheme.  As far as I can determine, he is the only coach in the world who runs his scheme.  That's exceptional originality.

What definition of genius are you using, and how does Kelley fail to meet it?



Websters dictionary- smug: having or showing the annoying quality of people who feel very pleased or satisfied with their abilities or achievements etc.

Cute, but you didn't answer my question.  If you're going to make a statement, you should be prepared to defend it with a rational, fact based explanation.  If you can do that, please enlighten us.  If you can't, be man enough to admit you were off base.

Can you? Has he invented something? Has he changed the way the game is played? Someone said that he got the stats from a book. So I read my history book and make an A on every test.....am I a history "genius?" He read about it and applied it to his scheme. I'm not saying that he isn't a good or even great coach because he wins a lot of games, But you guys really need to get over yourselves.

There is absolutely no way that you can prove that he is the only coach that on-side kicks the ball or goes for it on 4th down. And there is also no way I can prove the opposite.

Actually, I explained my reasoning above.  It's based upon the originality of his scheme. 

You're right that I can't prove that he's the only coach that uses his scheme.  But, the fact that you can't name another coach who does so tends to prove my point.  If he's the only one we can name, I'd say he's original.

Taking the research and applying it like no one else has qualifies as original in my book.

It's fine if you want to denigrate him or me.  Many others have.  But I think the facts are on my side.

I'm not sure what I'm supposed to get over?  Pride in the originality of our coach?  Please enlighten me.

I apologies if you think my posts were to "denigrate" you or Coach Kelley. I wasn't my intention to do so.

I feel this is simply a difference in the way we interpret the use of the word "genius."

IDK maybe genius also implies that it comes easy to him. I would be willing to bet that a lot of what people call genius is just absolute preparation and perspiration on the part of the coaches and players

If you have the time I would love to read about the achievement of any new advances that he has come up with.

We can certainly disagree about whether the originality of Coach Kelley is sufficient to qualify as genius.

As far as new "advances" t think you can just read the posts on this board.  I think everyone agrees that PA is hard to prepare for because no one else runs that scheme.  I call that an advance.

As far as preparation and perspiration, I think you're right.  Clarence Darrow, a famous trial lawyer in his day, said that genius is "99% perspiration and 1% inspiration."

purpleswag

Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 04:38:38 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 04:02:28 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 03:24:53 pm
M. M
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 03:14:14 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:58:30 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 02:42:17 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 02:21:57 pm
"A genius is a person who displays exceptional intellectual ability, creativity, or originality, typically to a degree that is associated with the achievement of new advances in a domain."

I think Coach Kelley meets that definition with the originality of his scheme.  As far as I can determine, he is the only coach in the world who runs his scheme.  That's exceptional originality.

What definition of genius are you using, and how does Kelley fail to meet it?



Websters dictionary- smug: having or showing the annoying quality of people who feel very pleased or satisfied with their abilities or achievements etc.

Cute, but you didn't answer my question.  If you're going to make a statement, you should be prepared to defend it with a rational, fact based explanation.  If you can do that, please enlighten us.  If you can't, be man enough to admit you were off base.

Can you? Has he invented something? Has he changed the way the game is played? Someone said that he got the stats from a book. So I read my history book and make an A on every test.....am I a history "genius?" He read about it and applied it to his scheme. I'm not saying that he isn't a good or even great coach because he wins a lot of games, But you guys really need to get over yourselves.

There is absolutely no way that you can prove that he is the only coach that on-side kicks the ball or goes for it on 4th down. And there is also no way I can prove the opposite.

Actually, I explained my reasoning above.  It's based upon the originality of his scheme. 

You're right that I can't prove that he's the only coach that uses his scheme.  But, the fact that you can't name another coach who does so tends to prove my point.  If he's the only one we can name, I'd say he's original.

Taking the research and applying it like no one else has qualifies as original in my book.

It's fine if you want to denigrate him or me.  Many others have.  But I think the facts are on my side.

I'm not sure what I'm supposed to get over?  Pride in the originality of our coach?  Please enlighten me.

I apologies if you think my posts were to "denigrate" you or Coach Kelley. I wasn't my intention to do so.

I feel this is simply a difference in the way we interpret the use of the word "genius."

IDK maybe genius also implies that it comes easy to him. I would be willing to bet that a lot of what people call genius is just absolute preparation and perspiration on the part of the coaches and players

If you have the time I would love to read about the achievement of any new advances that he has come up with.

We can certainly disagree about whether the originality of Coach Kelley is sufficient to qualify as genius.

As far as new "advances" t think you can just read the posts on this board.  I think everyone agrees that PA is hard to prepare for because no one else runs that scheme.  I call that an advance.

As far as preparation and perspiration, I think you're right.  Clarence Darrow, a famous trial lawyer in his day, said that genius is "99% perspiration and 1% inspiration."

Great quote! I was trying to reference that quote because I had heard it before but didn't know who said it.

Would you agree that any scheme that's not seen often is difficult to prepare for?

PA Dad

Our quotes are getting too long so I thought I'd reply without the quote.

I will agree that any scheme not often seen is difficult to prepare for.  And we may be talking degrees of difference, but I think about everyone agrees that Kelley's scheme is not just different - it is unique, as in one of a kind.  That's why I say it is original.

PA Dad

Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 01:51:53 pm
The fart sniffing on this thread has gotten to the point that it's almost sickening. To call any football coach a "genius" is ridiculous!

I don't care what they have done or how they do it.

You said that you did not intend to denigrate either Coach Kelley or me.  You are surely denigrating someone.  If not Kelley or me, who?

purpleswag

Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 04:58:09 pm
Our quotes are getting too long so I thought I'd reply without the quote.

I will agree that any scheme not often seen is difficult to prepare for.  And we may be talking degrees of difference, but I think about everyone agrees that Kelley's scheme is not just different - it is unique, as in one of a kind.  That's why I say it is original.

In my opinion there are a lot of guys that have a "one of a kind" offense. Nobody does what Art Briles does with his receivers split really wide (as far as I know, but I will admit that my know,edge is limited) but he isn't doing anything anybody else couldn't do. He hasn't changed anything about the game which is what I would call a genius.

It's all in how it's applied. PA still has to have 7 on the line before the snap, they run the same routes everyone else does and probably do it fast like a lot of people do now days.

People call Nick Saban a genius and I disagree. He's just better at what he does than most coaches. Same can be said for Kelley I'm sure you would agree.

purpleswag

Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 05:26:34 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 01:51:53 pm
The fart sniffing on this thread has gotten to the point that it's almost sickening. To call any football coach a "genius" is ridiculous!

I don't care what they have done or how they do it.

You said that you did not intend to denigrate either Coach Kelley or me.  You are surely denigrating someone.  If not Kelley or me, who?

That was my, apparently, failed attempt at humor. Which was aimed at the use of the term genius

Grond

Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 05:29:35 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 04:58:09 pm
Our quotes are getting too long so I thought I'd reply without the quote.

I will agree that any scheme not often seen is difficult to prepare for.  And we may be talking degrees of difference, but I think about everyone agrees that Kelley's scheme is not just different - it is unique, as in one of a kind.  That's why I say it is original.

In my opinion there are a lot of guys that have a "one of a kind" offense. Nobody does what Art Briles does with his receivers split really wide (as far as I know, but I will admit that my know,edge is limited) but he isn't doing anything anybody else couldn't do. He hasn't changed anything about the game which is what I would call a genius.

It's all in how it's applied. PA still has to have 7 on the line before the snap, they run the same routes everyone else does and probably do it fast like a lot of people do now days.

People call Nick Saban a genius and I disagree. He's just better at what he does than most coaches. Same can be said for Kelley I'm sure you would agree.

So, do you think the term "genius" should not be applied to sports?

PA Dad

Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 05:29:35 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 04:58:09 pm
Our quotes are getting too long so I thought I'd reply without the quote.

I will agree that any scheme not often seen is difficult to prepare for.  And we may be talking degrees of difference, but I think about everyone agrees that Kelley's scheme is not just different - it is unique, as in one of a kind.  That's why I say it is original.

In my opinion there are a lot of guys that have a "one of a kind" offense. Nobody does what Art Briles does with his receivers split really wide (as far as I know, but I will admit that my know,edge is limited) but he isn't doing anything anybody else couldn't do. He hasn't changed anything about the game which is what I would call a genius.

It's all in how it's applied. PA still has to have 7 on the line before the snap, they run the same routes everyone else does and probably do it fast like a lot of people do now days.

People call Nick Saban a genius and I disagree. He's just better at what he does than most coaches. Same can be said for Kelley I'm sure you would agree.

It's not just offense.  It's onside kicking and going for it on fourth down.  You've already admitted you can't name any coach, present or past, who does that.  That is original.

purpleswag

Quote from: Grond on November 29, 2015, 05:34:17 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 05:29:35 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 04:58:09 pm
Our quotes are getting too long so I thought I'd reply without the quote.

I will agree that any scheme not often seen is difficult to prepare for.  And we may be talking degrees of difference, but I think about everyone agrees that Kelley's scheme is not just different - it is unique, as in one of a kind.  That's why I say it is original.

In my opinion there are a lot of guys that have a "one of a kind" offense. Nobody does what Art Briles does with his receivers split really wide (as far as I know, but I will admit that my know,edge is limited) but he isn't doing anything anybody else couldn't do. He hasn't changed anything about the game which is what I would call a genius.

It's all in how it's applied. PA still has to have 7 on the line before the snap, they run the same routes everyone else does and probably do it fast like a lot of people do now days.

People call Nick Saban a genius and I disagree. He's just better at what he does than most coaches. Same can be said for Kelley I'm sure you would agree.

So, do you think the term "genius" should not be applied to sports?

If the person changed the way the game is played then yes. I believe there have been geniuses in the sport of football and other sports.

My inclination is that the word "guru" should be used in place of genius in most cases. Because a lot of people are just masters at their craft and not necessarily a genius.

purpleswag

Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 05:39:29 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 05:29:35 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 04:58:09 pm
Our quotes are getting too long so I thought I'd reply without the quote.

I will agree that any scheme not often seen is difficult to prepare for.  And we may be talking degrees of difference, but I think about everyone agrees that Kelley's scheme is not just different - it is unique, as in one of a kind.  That's why I say it is original.

In my opinion there are a lot of guys that have a "one of a kind" offense. Nobody does what Art Briles does with his receivers split really wide (as far as I know, but I will admit that my know,edge is limited) but he isn't doing anything anybody else couldn't do. He hasn't changed anything about the game which is what I would call a genius.

It's all in how it's applied. PA still has to have 7 on the line before the snap, they run the same routes everyone else does and probably do it fast like a lot of people do now days.

People call Nick Saban a genius and I disagree. He's just better at what he does than most coaches. Same can be said for Kelley I'm sure you would agree.

It's not just offense.  It's onside kicking and going for it on fourth down.  You've already admitted you can't name any coach, present or past, who does that.  That is original.

You're absolutely right. Without researching it further I'm not able to name any team that does both together. I do know that many coaches have been going for it on fourth down for years. A lot of ground and pound teams do it all the time.

I'm sure there has been teams that have experimented with onside kicking every time.

Do you feel that there are many coaches out there who people would consider original?

Grond

Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 05:46:26 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 05:39:29 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 05:29:35 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 04:58:09 pm
Our quotes are getting too long so I thought I'd reply without the quote.

I will agree that any scheme not often seen is difficult to prepare for.  And we may be talking degrees of difference, but I think about everyone agrees that Kelley's scheme is not just different - it is unique, as in one of a kind.  That's why I say it is original.

In my opinion there are a lot of guys that have a "one of a kind" offense. Nobody does what Art Briles does with his receivers split really wide (as far as I know, but I will admit that my know,edge is limited) but he isn't doing anything anybody else couldn't do. He hasn't changed anything about the game which is what I would call a genius.

It's all in how it's applied. PA still has to have 7 on the line before the snap, they run the same routes everyone else does and probably do it fast like a lot of people do now days.

People call Nick Saban a genius and I disagree. He's just better at what he does than most coaches. Same can be said for Kelley I'm sure you would agree.

It's not just offense.  It's onside kicking and going for it on fourth down.  You've already admitted you can't name any coach, present or past, who does that.  That is original.

You're absolutely right. Without researching it further I'm not able to name any team that does both together. I do know that many coaches have been going for it on fourth down for years. A lot of ground and pound teams do it all the time.

I'm sure there has been teams that have experimented with onside kicking every time.

Do you feel that there are many coaches out there who people would consider original?

But you are severely limiting the term "genius" as it applies to football.

Kelley has some unusual tactics. But I think he is much more deserving of the term "genius" in the aspects of player management and play calling.

I'm curious: Do you think there is another school playing SMARTER football than Pulaski Academy?

purpleswag

Quote from: Grond on November 29, 2015, 05:57:43 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 05:46:26 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 05:39:29 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 05:29:35 pm
Quote from: PA Dad on November 29, 2015, 04:58:09 pm
Our quotes are getting too long so I thought I'd reply without the quote.

I will agree that any scheme not often seen is difficult to prepare for.  And we may be talking degrees of difference, but I think about everyone agrees that Kelley's scheme is not just different - it is unique, as in one of a kind.  That's why I say it is original.

In my opinion there are a lot of guys that have a "one of a kind" offense. Nobody does what Art Briles does with his receivers split really wide (as far as I know, but I will admit that my know,edge is limited) but he isn't doing anything anybody else couldn't do. He hasn't changed anything about the game which is what I would call a genius.

It's all in how it's applied. PA still has to have 7 on the line before the snap, they run the same routes everyone else does and probably do it fast like a lot of people do now days.

People call Nick Saban a genius and I disagree. He's just better at what he does than most coaches. Same can be said for Kelley I'm sure you would agree.

It's not just offense.  It's onside kicking and going for it on fourth down.  You've already admitted you can't name any coach, present or past, who does that.  That is original.

You're absolutely right. Without researching it further I'm not able to name any team that does both together. I do know that many coaches have been going for it on fourth down for years. A lot of ground and pound teams do it all the time.

I'm sure there has been teams that have experimented with onside kicking every time.

Do you feel that there are many coaches out there who people would consider original?

But you are severely limiting the term "genius" as it applies to football.

Kelley has some unusual tactics. But I think he is much more deserving of the term "genius" in the aspects of player management and play calling.

I'm curious: Do you think there is another school playing SMARTER football than Pulaski Academy?

I completely agree with you. My opinion about what a genius in the sport is limited, however, if we throw around the term genius all the time don't you think it loses its importance?

As far as playing smarter it all depends on what you mean by smarter football. Do you think that playing like PA is the only way to play smart football?

purpleswag

I forgot about the player managment and play calling stuff. He is, probably, without a doubt a "people person."

As far as play calling if we were to say he is a genius at play calling then we are saying that he really doesn't have to prepare for the play calls. I'm sure a lot of preparation goes into what is called play by play.

Also years of experience help with that as well. Lots can be said about experience.

Red Devil Alum

Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 06:17:33 pm
I forgot about the player managment and play calling stuff. He is, probably, without a doubt a "people person."

As far as play calling if we were to say he is a genius at play calling then we are saying that he really doesn't have to prepare for the play calls. I'm sure a lot of preparation goes into what is called play by play.

Also years of experience help with that as well. Lots can be said about experience.
With all the other discussions, let's not lose sight of the fact that LRCA is preparing for basketball season right now.  ;)

Grond

First of all, this whole "genius" argument is far too theoretical to be winnable. The person that wins is usually the one that is more committed to the argument; which is not me.   :-\

I am not a genius. I have a BS and MS in engineering; I have worked with NASA and the Strategic Defense Initiative and the Dept. of Defense, and the automotive industry. I have met a lot of people that THOUGHT they were geniuses, and I have been lucky enough to know a few actual geniuses. (For fun, google "Auburn hypervelocity facility".)

My personnel definition of "genius" would be someone with a combination of INTELLIGENCE and ACCOMPLISHMENT. My definition also doesn't require an ACT/SAT score.

Coach Kelley probably doesn't consider himself a genius. But his accomplishments may be the closest thing to "genius" that has been in Arkansas football for a very long time. The football program at Pulaski Academy has reached a level of REPEATED success that is difficult to dismiss.

In no way am I associated with PA. I am from northeast Arkansas, and I am the fan of a school with far less success in football. My respect for PA is due to the way their boys perform; all the boys doing the dirty details that require extra coaching effort. From o-linemen falling back with the correct footwork, to defensive backs turning correctly depending on how the receiver breaks on a route.

We seem to be in an era, such that "talent" is the make-all/end-all. "We lost? Well, we just didn't have the TALENT." "They won? Well, it was because of their TALENT." "Sorry boys, we couldn't win because this class just doesn't have the TALENT." As I said earlier, good coaches teach that TEAM can overcome individual TALENT.

Kelley is probably not a "genius". But he is a "winner", and that is what counts.  ;)

PA Dad

November 29, 2015, 08:14:38 pm #127 Last Edit: November 29, 2015, 08:18:38 pm by PA Dad
Quote from: Grond on November 29, 2015, 07:59:25 pm
First of all, this whole "genius" argument is far too theoretical to be winnable. The person that wins is usually the one that is more committed to the argument; which is not me.   :-\

I am not a genius. I have a BS and MS in engineering; I have worked with NASA and the Strategic Defense Initiative and the Dept. of Defense, and the automotive industry. I have met a lot of people that THOUGHT they were geniuses, and I have been lucky enough to know a few actual geniuses. (For fun, google "Auburn hypervelocity facility".)

My personnel definition of "genius" would be someone with a combination of INTELLIGENCE and ACCOMPLISHMENT. My definition also doesn't require an ACT/SAT score.hh

Coach Kelley probably doesn't consider himself a genius. But his accomplishments may be the closest thing to "genius" that has been in Arkansas football for a very long time. The football program at Pulaski Academy has reached a level of REPEATED success that is difficult to dismiss.

In no way am I associated with PA. I am from northeast Arkansas, and I am the fan of a school with far less success in football. My respect for PA is due to the way their boys perform; all the boys doing the dirty details that require extra coaching effort. From o-linemen falling back with the correct footwork, to defensive backs turning correctly depending on how the receiver breaks on a route.

We seem to be in an era, such that "talent" is the make-all/end-all. "We lost? Well, we just didn't have the TALENT." "They won? Well, it was because of their TALENT." "Sorry boys, we couldn't win because this class just doesn't have the TALENT." As I said earlier, good coaches teach that TEAM can overcome individual TALENT.

Kelley is probably not a "genius". But he is a "winner", and that is what counts.  ;)

Well said.  Maybe we can end the discussion here.  Whether he is a genius, a winner, or an extraordinarily successful coach, there is no doubt that he is unusual and unique.

Overdahill

thanks Grond! I majored in football and weight training so I am glad you can speak for me and others like me. The Guy and the guys that coach and play for him all get to be winners!

Maynard G Krebs

Maybe we can just agree he is pretty smart guy.

p.s.  I am not a genius, but I stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night😌

Maynard G Krebs

Quote from: Red Devil Alum on November 29, 2015, 07:42:22 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 06:17:33 pm
I forgot about the player managment and play calling stuff. He is, probably, without a doubt a "people person."

As far as play calling if we were to say he is a genius at play calling then we are saying that he really doesn't have to prepare for the play calls. I'm sure a lot of preparation goes into what is called play by play.

Also years of experience help with that as well. Lots can be said about experience.
With all the other discussions, let's not lose sight of the fact that LRCA is preparing for basketball season right now.  ;)

That explains the cricket sounds

Yellowcake

Another note on the preparation issue. I picked up my daughter from junior high basketball practice at the PA gym today. Just inside the door, in front of the concession stand in about a 15 x 15  tiled floor area, a coach was working with about 9 or 10 what appeared to be 9th grade lineman. Shorts and t-shirts. They were working on pass blocking technique. Leg and feet movement and arm extension.

It is year round. It is fundamentals and technique. It is commitment to a belief. Players and coaches. And the results are what they are. Success in spades.

I pointed it out to my daughter. I told her this is an example of why the win. Always striving to get better and be the best they can be at what they are doing on the field.


Complete Biased PoV

Purple swag,

You may have your own opinion, but the opinion I respect much more is that of a major publication.  Coach Kelley was named to the TIME magazine's top innovators list in 2008-2009.  So there is that...... :-*

Maynard G Krebs

Quote from: Yellowcake on November 29, 2015, 09:44:34 pm
Another note on the preparation issue. I picked up my daughter from junior high basketball practice at the PA gym today. Just inside the door, in front of the concession stand in about a 15 x 15  tiled floor area, a coach was working with about 9 or 10 what appeared to be 9th grade lineman. Shorts and t-shirts. They were working on pass blocking technique. Leg and feet movement and arm extension.

It is year round. It is fundamentals and technique. It is commitment to a belief. Players and coaches. And the results are what they are. Success in spades.

I pointed it out to my daughter. I told her this is an example of why the win. Always striving to get better and be the best they can be at what they are doing on the field.

Bingo

purpleswag

Quote from: Complete Biased PoV on November 29, 2015, 10:01:19 pm
Purple swag,

You may have your own opinion, but the opinion I respect much more is that of a major publication.  Coach Kelley was named to the TIME magazine's top innovators list in 2008-2009.  So there is that...... :-*

The same magazine that voted Hitler man of the year? I'm kidding  ;D

Thats your right to respect a magazine articles opinion and that's certainly an accomplishment. I have my opinion on what a genius is and you guys clearly have a difference in opinion.

I would absolutely agree that he is an innovator with the way he uses data to make decisions. In fact that may be better than guru which I used earlier.



Chief_Osceola™

November 30, 2015, 03:55:37 pm #135 Last Edit: December 04, 2015, 10:47:16 pm by Chief_Osceola™
n/m

AirWarren

Coach k. In my youthful years as a lumberjack, I would be lying if I said there wasn't a time in my life where I detested PA.

HOWEVER, as the years go by and I read posts like this, see what you did with the team from Missouri, etc I become a bigger fan of you, PA, and the program you've built.

Kudos to you. Merry Christmas coach k. Hope to see another warren match up soon. We got some studs coming up :D

Thanks for all you do with Arkansas high school football.

Overdahill

Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on November 29, 2015, 08:32:38 pm
Quote from: Red Devil Alum on November 29, 2015, 07:42:22 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 06:17:33 pm
I forgot about the player managment and play calling stuff. He is, probably, without a doubt a "people person."

As far as play calling if we were to say he is a genius at play calling then we are saying that he really doesn't have to prepare for the play calls. I'm sure a lot of preparation goes into what is called play by play.

Also years of experience help with that as well. Lots can be said about experience.
With all the other discussions, let's not lose sight of the fact that LRCA is preparing for basketball season right now.  ;)

That explains the cricket sounds

i can't remember a week where I enjoyed the cricket sounds more ;D

Maynard G Krebs

Quote from: Overdahill on December 01, 2015, 12:20:33 pm
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on November 29, 2015, 08:32:38 pm
Quote from: Red Devil Alum on November 29, 2015, 07:42:22 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 06:17:33 pm
I forgot about the player managment and play calling stuff. He is, probably, without a doubt a "people person."

As far as play calling if we were to say he is a genius at play calling then we are saying that he really doesn't have to prepare for the play calls. I'm sure a lot of preparation goes into what is called play by play.

Also years of experience help with that as well. Lots can be said about experience.
With all the other discussions, let's not lose sight of the fact that LRCA is preparing for basketball season right now.  ;)

That explains the cricket sounds

i can't remember a week where I enjoyed the cricket sounds more ;D

Drove out Hwy 10 this a.m. For the first time since Friday night and noticed the football stadium still has not been cleaned up.  Cups all around the perimeter of the field and the home stands left with trash and poster remnants.  It was quiet and desolate.

Red Devil Alum

Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on December 01, 2015, 03:34:25 pm
Quote from: Overdahill on December 01, 2015, 12:20:33 pm
Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on November 29, 2015, 08:32:38 pm
Quote from: Red Devil Alum on November 29, 2015, 07:42:22 pm
Quote from: purpleswag on November 29, 2015, 06:17:33 pm
I forgot about the player managment and play calling stuff. He is, probably, without a doubt a "people person."

As far as play calling if we were to say he is a genius at play calling then we are saying that he really doesn't have to prepare for the play calls. I'm sure a lot of preparation goes into what is called play by play.

Also years of experience help with that as well. Lots can be said about experience.
With all the other discussions, let's not lose sight of the fact that LRCA is preparing for basketball season right now.  ;)

That explains the cricket sounds

i can't remember a week where I enjoyed the cricket sounds more ;D

Drove out Hwy 10 this a.m. For the first time since Friday night and noticed the football stadium still has not been cleaned up.  Cups all around the perimeter of the field and the home stands left with trash and poster remnants.  It was quiet and desolate.
And glorious.

Coach Kelley, PA


[/quote]

Can you? Has he invented something? Has he changed the way the game is played? Someone said that he got the stats from a book. So I read my history book and make an A on every test.....am I a history "genius?" He read about it and applied it to his scheme. I'm not saying that he isn't a good or even great coach because he wins a lot of games, But you guys really need to get over yourselves.


[/quote]

http://content.time.com/time/specials/packages/article/0,28804,1934027_1934003_1933979,00.html



I didn't think I had invented anything but according to the above link and Time Magazine, in 2009 I had the 33rd best invention of the year.  LOL

MDXPHD

December 01, 2015, 10:01:49 pm #141 Last Edit: December 01, 2015, 10:06:58 pm by MDXPHD
I was gonna stay off but I had some free time tonight. It's embarrassing how many people suck up on this board lol. Also, you shouldn't have to post a link to help solidify yourself as a genius. Trying to come across humble while at the same time being egotistic isn't a good combo. It's interesting that you have been on here quite a bit during the championship week while staying dark all season.

I'm sure the PA fans knew I would chime in lol. I won't have much free time after tonight but I'm sure glad I got on. This thread took too much of a bow down and kiss someone's feet turn.

PA Dad

Quote from: MDXPHD on December 01, 2015, 10:01:49 pm
I was gonna stay off but I had some free time tonight. It's embarrassing how many people suck up on this board lol. Also, you shouldn't have to post a link to help solidify yourself as a genius. Trying to come across humble while at the same time being egotistic isn't a good combo. It's interesting that you have been on here quite a bit during the championship week while staying dark all season.

I'm sure the PA fans knew I would chime in lol. I won't have much free time after tonight but I'm sure glad I got on. This thread took too much of a bow down and kiss someone's feet turn.

One thing we always know- your hatred of PA will always surface.

MDXPHD

Such a strong word choice.

PA Dad

Quote from: MDXPHD on December 01, 2015, 10:21:14 pm
Such a strong word choice.

Yes, but appropriate.  You've made that very obvious.

MDXPHD

Oh I don't hate anyone. Fishing is just one of my favorite sports. I enjoy watching PA play, especially when the lose..even though it doesn't happen too much. I also like that they have a lot of dedicated posters on here.

PA Dad

Quote from: MDXPHD on December 01, 2015, 10:26:01 pm
Oh I don't hate anyone. Fishing is just one of my favorite sports. I enjoy watching PA play, especially when the lose..even though it doesn't happen too much. I also like that they have a lot of dedicated posters on here.

And you just love getting under my skin!

MDXPHD

December 01, 2015, 10:41:55 pm #147 Last Edit: December 01, 2015, 10:45:18 pm by MDXPHD
Haha. It's easier some days than others. The HP thread was a lot of fun earlier this year. I'll see y'all around if I have some free time. Don't miss me too much.

PA Dad

Quote from: MDXPHD on December 01, 2015, 10:41:55 pm
Haha. It's easier some days than others. The HP thread was a lot of fun earlier this year. I'll see y'all around if I have some free time. Don't miss me too much.

What really aggravates me is that I know your game now but you still succeed in getting under my skin!  I know better, but you're just dang good.  Dang!

Grond

Quote from: MDXPHD on December 01, 2015, 10:01:49 pm
I was gonna stay off but I had some free time tonight. It's embarrassing how many people suck up on this board lol. Also, you shouldn't have to post a link to help solidify yourself as a genius. Trying to come across humble while at the same time being egotistic isn't a good combo. It's interesting that you have been on here quite a bit during the championship week while staying dark all season.

I'm sure the PA fans knew I would chime in lol. I won't have much free time after tonight but I'm sure glad I got on. This thread took too much of a bow down and kiss someone's feet turn.

Still "soggy" after the Friday night loss?  ::)

If you want to get Batesville supporters mad, you talk about the persistent stories that their football program conducts about 20% more practices than are allowed by AAA.

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