I am wondering about the current state of football. With spring ball, summer padded camps, and 30 or so required work outs are they hurting player numbers? I have noticed several boys dropping the sport. My son is in the 9th grade and several boys are on the verge of quitting football. My son enjoys the extra work and attends a couple camps and trains on his own during the summer. All kids are not like my son. He lives for football. I am afraid they are losing to many boys that would help down the road. Just wondering because to many good athletic boys have left the sport in his school. It is to the point I don't think they will be competitive next season. It hurts me knowing how hard my son has worked and he will not have supporting players to be successful.
I literally just had a similar phone conversation about training junior high aged kids in distance running.... We were talking about how much training a growing kid can take really? I kind of go by the theory you almost have to treat teenagers the same as an older athlete transitioning into their mid 30's where I almost am now. I think especially in the rural south people get a false perception that our teenage years are our best athletically when in reality between about 22 and 32 is when the body actually peaks where it can handle the most work load. What I mean by that is I know soon I will have to give my body 2 or maybe even 3 more rest days per month. I won't change the volume I do on the days I workout, but will utilize a little more rest days. I can still run/workout 6 days a week right now but I know that will change soon. Heck, I remember in my early and mid 20's jogging 15 days in a row when the intensity was low training for a marathon or half marathon and not thinking anything of it. That would not be wise anymore. What I mean is I go by the theory kids can handle the high work load on the days they are working out in the summer, but 14 and 15 year old kids need more recovery than their 17 and 18 year old counterparts after heavy workloads. There definitely is a delicate line when it comes to junior high aged kids especially in creating burn out. I just think its wise to give junior high kids a few more rest days than senior high each month. I really am not sure of the right answer though. Just my two cents. I like the thought process you are thinking along though. It's an interesting topic.
It sounds like you may be on to something.
On the predictions thread on the MMQB board, I noted the increasing prevalence of developing players at the grade-school level. I've noticed this to be a focus at Pottsville and elsewhere.
The dilemma described could be a side effect of such a practice.
Stories like this make me wonder if the concept of JV teams was a prescience of sorts.
I get what you are saying beach bum. I think I am not asking how much can a devoted kid take. I am asking how much the average kid will take. We all wish our school would have 25 kids that are totally committed to football for each grade. I think it is more like 5 or 6 per grade and the rest are just along for the ride. The kids that might develop in later years are not seeing a reward for their current effort. These are the ones dropping the sport. I am afraid it will result in low numbers in the Jr and SR years. Football is a team sport and numbers are important. It is the dropping numbers that worry me.
I'll go for a personal experience.
As a kid, I was a swimmer. Competitive. Summer league for the Warren Waves. We swam against local teams consisting of Monticello, el dorado(had a summer and year round program), crossett, Camden, magnolia. Summer meets that were regional with a championship meet at OBU in Arkadelphia to close out the summer. As I got better and better, coaches would call and ask me to join their year round league. My parents would pass on it. I began going to summer camps in searcy and OBU for a week where I would swim with year round swimmers across the state. I was competing with them regularly in exhibition swims. At that point we learned that you could go and compete with year round swimmers in meets to qualify for nationals/jr Olympics etc so we began doing that. These swim meets where in eldorado, fort smith, searcy and Little Rock and they were week long meets sometimes every month of my summer. I was training 3 times a day in the summer. The 6am practice at Warren's YMCA, private lessons mid day, then the afternoon practice back at the Y. Then I would go put in an hour or two at my grandparents pool. As I continued to improve my craft, I eventually joined a year round swimming team. Every night after school I was practicing. Meets on the weekends hours away. My coach was limiting my participation in other sports(because how swimming muscle and other sports muscle have a negative effect on each other "allegedly") so it became an issue with my football. As I got closer to teen years, didn't have much of a relationship with my buddies, working in the summer in tomatoes with my buddies. None of that aka being a kid. Finally I dropped swimming around the age of 13. I was worn out, my parents told me to continue doing the meeting hours from Warren and sometimes out of state it would require me to be home schooled. And I had just had enough. And that 7 years of constant training burned me smooth out. To the point where football didn't even interest me because of the constant go go go. So I'm here to tell you, someone who worked out and practiced 24/7 from age 6-13, burn out is real and it can be a bad thing. But man about 30 lbs later I wish I could swim like that again on the daily lol.
I practiced basketball at least 2 hours a day every day from age 7 until 15. Didn't get burned out but hurt my knee. Wish now I had spent the time in football and basketball playing golf. Because of my knee I got no college offers. That and being 6'1, slow, and having a 14 inch vertical.
AirWarren makes good points. I see impact from other activities being a bigger issue than football itself. Football has easily become one of the shortest season sports due to AAA regulations. Sure, it gets rolling during the hottest time of year, as well as a time most kids deem for "resting, sitting on the couch and playing x-box." So, I'd agree, if burn out occurs it may be because of other school activities or reasons, but not a time consumption issue. It seems baseball has become a year round sport for many due to the travel ball popularity. Most Jr. and Sr. High basketball programs practice and condition year round. It's good for kids to choose which activity they are passionate about and stick to it, whether it be 3 or just 1.
Quote from: Sigmund Sauer on July 11, 2018, 10:52:51 am
AirWarren makes good points. I see impact from other activities being a bigger issue than football itself. Football has easily become one of the shortest season sports due to AAA regulations. Sure, it gets rolling during the hottest time of year, as well as a time most kids deem for "resting, sitting on the couch and playing x-box." So, I'd agree, if burn out occurs it may be because of other school activities or reasons, but not a time consumption issue. It seems baseball has become a year round sport for many due to the travel ball popularity. Most Jr. and Sr. High basketball programs practice and condition year round. It's good for kids to choose which activity they are passionate about and stick to it, whether it be 3 or just 1.
AAU basketball.
Travel baseball.
Now, soccer in central Arkansas has become the same as AAU/year round baseball.
With my daughter, it's one activity a year. She is interested in gymnastics so that's what she is involved in. I refuse to have her at the ball field 24/7 in the summer away from doing things a kid should be doing. We have tried softball but it was for a year. And I hate being at the ball field so if I'm paying for it then I'm going to have to like it. She has done cheer which was fun for her. And she has done basketball through upward. We coached her team which was a blast. And she was good at it. I think as parents we should listen to the kids likes and needs vs our own needs and focus in on what the kid is good at and focus on that. Too much can go a long way with a kid.
She was just accepted into a school that is a non football school but has baseball, cheer, softball, tennis, basketball, and golf. I actually hope it stays away from football because the academics are front and center and football people will start allowing "stud athletes" into the school to win and allow academic standards to fall to put all emphasis on football. God willing, I'm hoping to raise another RN in the family, an engineer or doctor....not a lifelong letterman jacket wearer hahaha.
AW you know everyone loves the guys that wear their letterman jackets to their son's games.
Quote from: Gray lizard on July 10, 2018, 04:01:31 pm
I am wondering about the current state of football. With spring ball, summer padded camps, and 30 or so required work outs are they hurting player numbers? I have noticed several boys dropping the sport. My son is in the 9th grade and several boys are on the verge of quitting football. My son enjoys the extra work and attends a couple camps and trains on his own during the summer. All kids are not like my son. He lives for football. I am afraid they are losing to many boys that would help down the road. Just wondering because to many good athletic boys have left the sport in his school. It is to the point I don't think they will be competitive next season. It hurts me knowing how hard my son has worked and he will not have supporting players to be successful.
I've been thinking kids don't put in near as much as we did in the past. They're limited to when and how much they can practice. Kids are fairly weak minded anymore and constantly need to be entertained. Going to workouts/practice was about the only entertainment we had. I don't feel sorry for them at all. Pour it to them, push em hard.
Quote from: nastynice on July 11, 2018, 12:40:25 pm
I've been thinking kids don't put in near as much as we did in the past. They're limited to when and how much they can practice. Kids are fairly weak minded anymore and constantly need to be entertained. Going to workouts/practice was about the only entertainment we had. I don't feel sorry for them at all. Pour it to them, push em hard.
I agree with this too. I always wonder what kids do these days. Never see them outside. I guess they are too busy duck face picture taking for each other. We didn't have an iphone with snapcrap, twatter, and bookface on it. We found ponds, creeks, and backroads to mess around on. Man, I used to catch some fish in the summer time as a kid. Also had three summer jobs....so I always had some cash in my pocket lol.
Quote from: bigchief72455 on July 11, 2018, 12:10:19 pm
AW you know everyone loves the guys that wear their letterman jackets to their son's games.
It's amazing.
Quote from: bigchief72455 on July 11, 2018, 12:10:19 pm
AW you know everyone loves the guys that wear their letterman jackets to their son's games.
While screaming contain at the ends and blaming the safety on every deep pass. Defense has changed dad. Sometimes the safety has the flats and sometimes the OLB has contain.
Quote from: Oldman on July 11, 2018, 01:44:20 pm
While screaming contain at the ends and blaming the safety on every deep pass. Defense has changed dad. Sometimes the safety has the flats and sometimes the OLB has contain.
"The running back missed the hole again....he needs to look for the hole....!!!!!!!!"
Quote from: AirWarren on July 11, 2018, 02:05:16 pm
“The running back missed the hole again....he needs to look for the hole....!!!!!!!!”
We have a rule in the press box. If you want to question play calling you have to say what you would call before the play is ran.
You played basketball Oldman?! 😂
Quote from: DeltaBoy on July 11, 2018, 03:52:03 pm
You played basketball Oldman?! 😂
Basketball, football, baseball, tennis, and golf. No track because of deceiving speed.
Quote from: Oldman on July 11, 2018, 04:00:44 pm
Basketball, football, baseball, tennis, and golf. No track because of deceiving speed.
Tennis is fun.
A lot easier to enjoy putting the work in when you know you're playing for a contender.
Quote from: STUNNA on July 11, 2018, 06:26:48 pm
A lot easier to enjoy putting the work in when you know you're playing for a contender.
Also....great point.
Do a lot high schools still play JV schedules? Arkadelphia hasn't played one in years and when Friday is the the only game the writing is on the wall for a lot of players. Do they put in tons of time and effort to never step foot on the field or do they explore other options? There's nothing wrong with either choice but that's another reason you may see a drop off in participation.
Sorry, wrong string.
Quote from: Oldman on July 11, 2018, 10:43:14 am
I practiced basketball at least 2 hours a day every day from age 7 until 15. Didn't get burned out but hurt my knee. Wish now I had spent the time in football and basketball playing golf. Because of my knee I got no college offers. That and being 6'1, slow, and having a 14 inch vertical.
Was that a legit 14?
Quote from: Jsmith48 on July 11, 2018, 11:00:11 pm
Do a lot high schools still play JV schedules? Arkadelphia hasn't played one in years and when Friday is the the only game the writing is on the wall for a lot of players. Do they put in tons of time and effort to never step foot on the field or do they explore other options? There's nothing wrong with either choice but that's another reason you may see a drop off in participation.
I believe there was a rule put in place a few years ago when all the concussion rage hit that players could only play 5 or 6 quarters a week. That rule kills teams like Warren who normally field 40 or less kids. It's fine if your starter doesn't get hurt, but if he does and your 2nd string guy played 4 quarters on Monday, you're in a jam.
Quote from: Oldman on July 12, 2018, 09:12:52 am
Depends
Hopping off the bottom bleacher doesn't count.
Coming from an older ex-player and big fan it just seems like kids have no time to be kids any more. I understand that the summer long work has to be done to be competitive because every one else is going to do it. On the other hand if they are just going to be home playing video games, etc,stuffing chips or out getting into trouble it's a good thing. A lot of kids would probably rather be working out with friends, etc that putting up with home life. Just thinking out loud. Forgive me.
The growth in the amount of time that athletic programs ask of its participants is a question that should be studied and definite guidelines instituted to regulate. Oh, yeah the AAA does that to some degree. Dead period for instance. Different states have different rules. In the quest for excellence, championships, the programs seek more time and commitment. I hear parents ask or sometimes complain about why our team doesn't win enough. Often blame is directed toward the coaches. I also hear complaints about coaches expecting too much from the athletes. Can't really have it both ways. Winning takes lots of time/effort and commitment and frankly many teens are not willing to give it. Championships show a commitment to time and dedication that not every team gives nor does every athlete give to the same amount. Just my observations.
Quote from: gameoflife on July 12, 2018, 03:56:56 pm
The growth in the amount of time that athletic programs ask of its participants is a question that should be studied and definite guidelines instituted to regulate. Oh, yeah the AAA does that to some degree. Dead period for instance. Different states have different rules. In the quest for excellence, championships, the programs seek more time and commitment. I hear parents ask or sometimes complain about why our team doesn't win enough. Often blame is directed toward the coaches. I also hear complaints about coaches expecting too much from the athletes. Can't really have it both ways. Winning takes lots of time/effort and commitment and frankly many teens are not willing to give it. Championships show a commitment to time and dedication that not every team gives nor does every athlete give to the same amount. Just my observations.
This I can understand. It is dependent on the younger kids seeing the success of the ones before them. The problem maybe in schools that have not had success. The kids just don't stick with it long enough to see the rewards.
I think kids are pushed to hard. Its almost impossible to play more than one sport anymore much less have a part time job to learn the value of money. I worked during the summers from junior high through college scouting cotton to make my money for school clothes and spending money. Mom and dad gave my so much for school clothes and if i wanted better or more I had to have the money to pay for it. I even worked in between 2 a day practices till school started. There are families that love all the travel and being tied up in it. Its good for them I guess or they wouldn't be doing it. Not for a single dad that works on the road a few days a week. Too much to expect from my parents to shuffle around with all they already do.
My daughter got burned out on softball a year or two ago. She liked the social aspect but was too time consuming especially at her age. It would have been 1 hour plus drive one way once or twice a week just for practice and every weekend gone for months. A portion of that 1-2k a month i would have spent on lessons, tournament fees, hotels, food, etc. invested in a college fund would be much better money invested in her future.
Bulldog, scouting cotton. I had a several friends that did that during their school years. Always said it was a great summer job. I also had friends who didn't work at all, their parents were huge supporters of their kids participation in athletics and so didn't push them to work. Their feeling was that if they were working their a#$ off to maximize their skills then that was their job at the time. Difference in what you want, what your kid wants. Neither is right or wrong.
We (Lamar) lift/practice/condition 7-12th grade Tuesday and Thursday at 8am. We do four 7-7 (Usually Monday Nights) activities, and four padded team camp type things with Sr high. Our Jr High has had 3 team camps.
I feel like this schedule gives the kids some time in the summer, and also works them hard.
Quote from: Coach Jones on July 13, 2018, 04:14:55 pm
We (Lamar) lift/practice/condition 7-12th grade Tuesday and Thursday at 8am. We do four 7-7 (Usually Monday Nights) activities, and four padded team camp type things with Sr high. Our Jr High has had 3 team camps.
I feel like this schedule gives the kids some time in the summer, and also works them hard.
This all seems very sensible.... Consistency is really the key and your schedule has that.
I read it somewhere above, but kids almost have to specialize in one sport anymore. Every major sport has become a year-round activity. And it's fairly recent too. There are 2 reasons why this is so: the term 'measurables' working its way into sports vernacular, and Tiger Woods. Bear with me on this - measurables are becoming the gold standard for what recruiters seem to focus on. 40 times, 90+ velo, exit velocity, launch angle (aka the stupidest baseball hitting metric ever conceived), vertical, etc. Due to this, kids have to attend camps, showcases, tournaments, etc. so that their measurables can be evaluated. If they aren't good enough, they have to continue working to improve certain areas, which turns into a year-round endeavor. Further, the year-round nature of sports has led to an increase in injuries.
Now for the second part - since Tiger Woods started winning everything, parents noticed how he was raised to be a champion golfer, and they all think their kid is going to be the next prodigy at whatever sport they show an inkling of talent for at an early age. Therefore, they push their kids to a particular sport, and feed into the one sport year-round issue mentioned above. The problem is, for 99.9% of kids, they aren't going to be the next Tiger Woods. Or Michael Jordan. Or Tom Brady.
Anyway, I say all that to say this - playing one sport all year has really zero advantages over playing multiple sports. Aside from the injury stats, I'd like to have some numbers that show how many kids quit due to burnout. And here's another layer - coaches have to bear some of the responsibility. Many will push kids to play their sport only. A kid that can play multiple sports will always choose the one that is less demanding of their time if forced to make a decision of one sport or another.
It's sad how sports have evolved to get to this point. I was fortunate enough to play 3 sports, and I never did any of them out of season. Football was played in the fall, basketball after football, and baseball after that and then a little in the summer. I would attend one camp for each sport every summer, but never worked on one sport over another out of season. I also had the opportunity to play a sport after high school too, and I decided on baseball because it was my best sport and I liked it the most. And looking back, I feel lucky that I didn't have to make that choice until after high school.
Quote from: Chief_Osceola™ on July 16, 2018, 01:55:58 pm
I read it somewhere above, but kids almost have to specialize in one sport anymore. Every major sport has become a year-round activity. And it's fairly recent too. There are 2 reasons why this is so: the term 'measurables' working its way into sports vernacular, and Tiger Woods. Bear with me on this - measurables are becoming the gold standard for what recruiters seem to focus on. 40 times, 90+ velo, exit velocity, launch angle (aka the stupidest baseball hitting metric ever conceived), vertical, etc. Due to this, kids have to attend camps, showcases, tournaments, etc. so that their measurables can be evaluated. If they aren't good enough, they have to continue working to improve certain areas, which turns into a year-round endeavor. Further, the year-round nature of sports has led to an increase in injuries.
Now for the second part - since Tiger Woods started winning everything, parents noticed how he was raised to be a champion golfer, and they all think their kid is going to be the next prodigy at whatever sport they show an inkling of talent for at an early age. Therefore, they push their kids to a particular sport, and feed into the one sport year-round issue mentioned above. The problem is, for 99.9% of kids, they aren't going to be the next Tiger Woods. Or Michael Jordan. Or Tom Brady.
Anyway, I say all that to say this - playing one sport all year has really zero advantages over playing multiple sports. Aside from the injury stats, I'd like to have some numbers that show how many kids quit due to burnout. And here's another layer - coaches have to bear some of the responsibility. Many will push kids to play their sport only. A kid that can play multiple sports will always choose the one that is less demanding of their time if forced to make a decision of one sport or another.
It's sad how sports have evolved to get to this point. I was fortunate enough to play 3 sports, and I never did any of them out of season. Football was played in the fall, basketball after football, and baseball after that and then a little in the summer. I would attend one camp for each sport every summer, but never worked on one sport over another out of season. I also had the opportunity to play a sport after high school too, and I decided on baseball because it was my best sport and I liked it the most. And looking back, I feel lucky that I didn't have to make that choice until after high school.
Well said Chief
Quote from: AirWarren on July 11, 2018, 01:23:34 pm
I agree with this too. I always wonder what kids do these days. Never see them outside. I guess they are too busy duck face picture taking for each other. We didn't have an iphone with snapcrap, twatter, and bookface on it. We found ponds, creeks, and backroads to mess around on. Man, I used to catch some fish in the summer time as a kid. Also had three summer jobs....so I always had some cash in my pocket lol.
Most of them are playing Fortnite in between duck face pics...
Quote from: $aintMaximu$ on July 19, 2018, 07:45:27 am
Most of them are playing Fortnite in between duck face pics...
Why you hating on ForkKnife? Quack, quack.
Quote from: KASH dba The Lumberjack on July 20, 2018, 08:17:00 am
Why you hating on ForkKnife? Quack, quack.
I actually like the game myself...
I agree with the statement about not seeing kids outside just playing sports much anymore, changing times I guess. As for not practicing off season sports during the summer, I think if you want to maximize your ability and want to be a top athlete you have to work on your skills. This means some sort of strength, speed and skills work. Working on the sport you play with specific activities designed to enhance skills for that sport is best but you can work on general skills, speed, flexibility, coordination, strength and so on and get a lot of good out of it. IMO only a few gifted kids can not work out in the summer and still play at a high level but most teams have plenty of kids that are not gifted and so they don't get left too far behind on their own teams by not working out, so they don't. The programs that win, and win often and consistantly have lots of kids that participate in off-season because they have to do so in order to compete for a spot and/or the coach demands it for playing time. Overall I think athletes are better, genetics and good health are part of that but I think dedication and hard work is not as it once was. Kids are too often encouraged to quit when they don't like something, the work, the coach, it interferes with their "free time".
I agree with others on this post, that baseball, aau basketball, etc., are taking alot of time from kids. As far as for football, if you add up the hours, it really isn't that bad. Most teams want you to work out 2-3 times a week. one of those days is usually a team camp or 7 on 7. Assuming a camp or 7 on 7 takes 3-5 hrs of your time, and a workout takes 1-2, in the two months before 2 a days you only have spent on average about 30-35 hours. somewhere around 4-6 hours a week. I know all schools do things differently. But i have seen kids that have basketball camp on monday, football on tuesday, weights on wednesday, baseball games on thursdays, and 7 on 7 on fridays, and then baseball on weekends. We live in a go,go,go society and everyone pushes to work harder. I believe that some seperation from seasons must be enforced somehow, just not sure how that would work. I am an advocate for playing multiple sports, but basketball and baseball do not have a season anymore, they are year around.
Quote from: $aintMaximu$ on July 20, 2018, 08:44:20 am
I actually like the game myself...
Me too. My daughter thought my son and I were saying ForkKnife instead of FortNite.
There was a mention of Tiger Woods on here about how he got so good was that he practiced one sport everyday, same motion every day until he perfected it. Heard this morning he's had 4 back surgeries and he's no more than a couple years over 40.
Quote from: KASH dba The Lumberjack on July 23, 2018, 10:54:38 am
There was a mention of Tiger Woods on here about how he got so good was that he practiced one sport everyday, same motion every day until he perfected it. Heard this morning he's had 4 back surgeries and he's no more than a couple years over 40.
Yup. Gotta have a lower back to be able to play golf especially at that level. His back is garbage.
Quote from: KASH dba The Lumberjack on July 23, 2018, 10:54:38 am
There was a mention of Tiger Woods on here about how he got so good was that he practiced one sport everyday, same motion every day until he perfected it. Heard this morning he's had 4 back surgeries and he's no more than a couple years over 40.
Which lends credence to the argument that kids shouldn't specialize in one sport at an early age, probably even through high school. Kids aren't physically developed enough to do the same repeatable motions for hours a day.
Didn't read all the way through this thread and don't spend much time on the 4A board. I agree our kids spend to much time on sports and not enough "kid" time
However if you follow the states around us, especially Texas, those kids play football year round in some form or fashion. I guess if we want our kids to compete on the same level as them we have to endure the summer workouts and team camps. But that is just my opinion.
I don't have a problem pushing kids out of their comfort zone at all. My question is, how does today's high school athlete compare to one from 20 years ago? I would venture to bet there's not a lot of differences. The work was just being put in differently. With today's football it seems like everything revolves around the skill positions but the reality is if your line can't hold a block the best QB and WR in the state aren't going to do much.
On another note regarding participation declining.....have you looked at some of the practice schedules? It's like they are built around a teacher or coache's schedule. The simple fact is not everyone can build their work schedule around high school sports practices. For example, if little Johnny has practice from 9am-11am and mom and dad both work out of town, what is little Johnny going to do? Miss practice, be penalized, miss playing time, etc. I am fortunate that my kids have transportation to the oddly scheduled practices, but it hasn't always been that way.
Quote from: TurfToe on July 26, 2018, 01:12:20 pm
For example, if little Johnny has practice from 9am-11am and mom and dad both work out of town, what is little Johnny going to do?
I don't know maybe catch a ride with someone?
Quote from: SUGARTOWN on July 26, 2018, 02:49:42 pm
I don't know maybe catch a ride with someone?
Unless everyone hates Little Johnny. He has gotten in trouble for years.
Then little Johnny probably doesn't need to be on the team if he causes that many problems
Little Johnny could just walk or ride a bike like we used too
Quote from: BigLion10 on July 27, 2018, 12:15:28 pm
Little Johnny could just walk or ride a bike like we used too
I used to bike around town thinking it was the greatest thing in the world until I could drive. I would ride it straight up to the gym doors and right on into the gym I'd go to shoot some hoops.... Most kids now think they are too cool for that and would not ride a bike around.
Quote from: SR30 on July 26, 2018, 08:38:06 pm
Then little Johnny probably doesn't need to be on the team if he causes that many problems
Do you remember little Johnny jokes?
Quote from: Sigmund Sauer on July 11, 2018, 10:52:51 am
AirWarren makes good points. I see impact from other activities being a bigger issue than football itself. Football has easily become one of the shortest season sports due to AAA regulations. Sure, it gets rolling during the hottest time of year, as well as a time most kids deem for "resting, sitting on the couch and playing x-box." So, I'd agree, if burn out occurs it may be because of other school activities or reasons, but not a time consumption issue. It seems baseball has become a year round sport for many due to the travel ball popularity. Most Jr. and Sr. High basketball programs practice and condition year round. It's good for kids to choose which activity they are passionate about and stick to it, whether it be 3 or just 1.
Agree and disagree.
At most schools in Arkansas, football is the driving school sport. Meaning that's where the emphasis is focused. Most schools, at least 5a down have coaches that coach multiple sports (head baseball coach is also an assistant football coach, etc.). Being that football is the driving sport, emphasis on football is literally year round. Offseason workouts for football b/4 baseball practice, etc. Everything takes a backseat to football; so if you're a kid that doesn't see much reward for all that work (playing time, scholarship potential), the logical (to some) conclusion is to forgo all that hard work and free up a lot of time for something else of interest.
Unless little Johnny is a stud and then he can do what he pleases.
Quote from: Oldman on July 26, 2018, 03:17:50 pm
Unless everyone hates Little Johnny. He has gotten in trouble for years.
Rascal steals packages from porches, I don't blame everyone for hating him.
Quote from: Oldman on July 11, 2018, 02:51:23 pm
We have a rule in the press box. If you want to question play calling you have to say what you would call before the play is ran.
I'd love to see a a rule in the stands that if you want to officiate from the bleachers you have wear a striped shirt and a dunce hat with flashing LEDs's to qualify... ;)
Back on subject... several have mentioned "kids should be doing things a kid should be doing" outside of traditional sports seasons and the school schedules. We've had a significant shift in society/culture in the last 20 years with the advent of electronic technology within our daily lives.
Prior to that, kids went outside, interacted face to face and majority would engage in neighborhood sports activities in their free time. Even your non-athletic kids would get involved in pickup football, baseball, basketball games among their peers in their neighborhood. In my case on the coast we had surfing in the mix as well...
It was a natural progression from non-organized activities to sports programs and a lot of natural talent came from those neighborhood activities. Add to that a lot of kids could endure summer weather much better due to natural conditioning.
Whereas today... kids don't engage in non-organized outdoor sports hardly at all. Parents and school programs have also taken the competitive aspects and raised the bar way out of reach from just a fun factor. Even non-competitive programs like cheer now expect nearly Olympic level gymnastics just to make the squad. If you aren't a college D1 or pro-prospect in any high school sport then what's the point of kids pushing themselves in all of these sports development programs..?
Kids can make a fair value judgement on investing their time and effort in this stuff and that's why I think you are seeing a lot of fallout from these programs. The competitive push and pressures are too high. The rewards and fun factors too low. Sadly the passion for a sport that was born on a corner lot or public sports complex by a neighborhood full of kids looking to "play" can't be found in a game console, TV or PC with A/C cranked all day...
^ Well said. Technology, and more specifically social media, has had a big hand in the decline. Fortnite is putting a lot more nails in the coffin.
Some people would say that we are raising generations of kids that don't have the same work ethic of past groups. We want it easy and we want it now. If I have to work real hard for a long time it isn't worth it. Sort of like the give every kid a trophy for participating mentality.
I guess I'm out of step and just don't get it but I thought kicking butt with your friends on the football field was about the most fun thing ever and that the prep work to pull it off was pretty fun too; I mean who doesn't want to get bigger, stronger, and faster in HS or college? Yes we paid a price in terms of time and effort but it seemed a very worthwhile price to me. And, no we didn't win every game but just competing all out in every game was still rewarding
The 2 comments before this one are absolutely spot on! +1 +1
Quote from: gameoflife on September 01, 2018, 07:37:13 pm
Some people would say that we are raising generations of kids that don't have the same work ethic of past groups. We want it easy and we want it now. If I have to work real hard for a long time it isn't worth it. Sort of like the give every kid a trophy for participating mentality.
If kids are being raised to be lazy, then it's our fault. I can work circles around my kids and my kids are by no means lazy compared to their peers. My son works for me and is attending apprenticeship school for four years and I treat him like an employee for 8hrs a day. I pay his cell phone bill because I can justify its work related but the rest of the bills are his responsibility.
No matter what sport he's played, he was taught to do his job. I feel like that has helped in transitioning to adulthood. His class was undefeated because of the hard work it took to go the extra mile as a team.
"criticism isn't easy for their ears,
they feel like they know most everything.
See they grew up with undeserved confidence,
cause they got trophies just for Participating"*
*Micah Tyler
Quote from: Chief_Osceola™ on July 16, 2018, 01:55:58 pm
I read it somewhere above, but kids almost have to specialize in one sport anymore. Every major sport has become a year-round activity. And it's fairly recent too.
It's sad how sports have evolved to get to this point. I was fortunate enough to play 3 sports, and I never did any of them out of season. Football was played in the fall, basketball after football, and baseball after that and then a little in the summer. I would attend one camp for each sport every summer, but never worked on one sport over another out of season. I also had the opportunity to play a sport after high school too, and I decided on baseball because it was my best sport and I liked it the most. And looking back, I feel lucky that I didn't have to make that choice until after high school.
The Chief here is spot on with his point. Are we really helping the young men and women by asking them to specialize in one sport? I have had a little league mother bite my head off, but major league scouts are looking to see what other sports young men are playing besides baseball. Why? As the scouts and front office officials explain it, other sports help develop the over athletic ability of players. The drills done in basketball can help an outfielder with a chance to jump a wall and rob a home run. The skills learned on how to fight through or slip step a pick and roll in basketball can also be used to defeat a lead blocker in football and lead to a tackle on Friday night.
I do not know if the pressure is the same for ladies to concentrate on one sport but it is pretty obvious how the speed and agility drills in basketball can help a lady play defense on the softball diamond, or the jumping and timing drills in volleyball could help in the basketball court.
Let us also not forget that this is about fun. Such a small percentage of players in any sport any given year will play at the next level are we really doing them a favor by forcing one sport specialization in Jr. High or High School? Let them play!
I think this topic has reached the point where this much is enough.
Quote from: AirWarren on July 11, 2018, 11:12:17 am
AAU basketball.
Travel baseball.
Now, soccer in central Arkansas has become the same as AAU/year round baseball.
With my daughter, it's one activity a year. She is interested in gymnastics so that's what she is involved in. I refuse to have her at the ball field 24/7 in the summer away from doing things a kid should be doing. We have tried softball but it was for a year. And I hate being at the ball field so if I'm paying for it then I'm going to have to like it. She has done cheer which was fun for her. And she has done basketball through upward. We coached her team which was a blast. And she was good at it. I think as parents we should listen to the kids likes and needs vs our own needs and focus in on what the kid is good at and focus on that. Too much can go a long way with a kid.
She was just accepted into a school that is a non football school but has baseball, cheer, softball, tennis, basketball, and golf. I actually hope it stays away from football because the academics are front and center and football people will start allowing "stud athletes" into the school to win and allow academic standards to fall to put all emphasis on football. God willing, I'm hoping to raise another RN in the family, an engineer or doctor....not a lifelong letterman jacket wearer hahaha.
If you are paying for it YOU are gonna have to like it? That's pretty sad.
Quote from: KASH dba The Lumberjack on July 22, 2018, 10:24:26 am
Me too. My daughter thought my son and I were saying ForkKnife instead of FortNite.
Try PUBG mobile... You will never play Fortnite again...
I'm not happy with how things are being done. I know several kids who worked extremely hard jobs this summer, and were told if they didn't quit work, and practice they were off the team. That is not right, as most some need to work, aren't gonna play in college so work experience is good for them. I don't mind spring practices, but only giving them 2 weeks break during the summer is absolutely resiculous. Would I have loved to had more time practicing back in the day? Sure I would've, but most are not pro-athletes. We weren't even allowed to practice until August when I played, and that heat was more than enough to wear a player out. If anything they should focus on weight training for the majority of the summer, and stop controlling their everyday lives. A few good players have left our team, or was told they couldn't play this year.
I'm also not happy with the coach's pushing protein shakes on my kid. He's strong, and big enough already. Pushing them to get bigger while not helping to guide them dietary wise is incompetent, and is harming some kids. It's bad enough knowing about CTE, much less their overall health. They're running these kids through a mill just like colleges just to up their coaching record, and not allowing them to be teenagers anymore.
Younger generations have been told too often they were "special" and not because of what they have done but because of what they might be able to do. They took it the wrong way. They are SPECIAL in their minds by right of birth not because they earned it and did it. It the same in athletics, you are not special until you earn it.
Quote from: $aintMaximu$ on September 06, 2018, 01:08:25 pm
Try PUBG mobile... You will never play Fortnite again...
H1Z1 fan myself
I have to start by saying God is great, He's taking great care of my son. I'm not reviving this thread for sympathy. I felt like I needed to warn some parents on here to not take some small ailments for granted. My son was told by his surgeon today that he is well on the path of recovery. He had Chiari decompression surgery 2 weeks ago. That's why I started with God is great. I know my son has been in His hands.
Back in '15, after we lost to Nashville, he came home with what we thought was a stinger. So we treated as such. He got better but had a nagging shoulder pain. Doctors said to rest it and it should get better, but as we all know, football is 365 in Warren so he never really got to rest it. Now before I continue, this is not a slam on the sport. This was a problem he had since birth, and wasn't caused by football. Football did bring it to the surface however.
So we make it through the summer going to 7v7 and working with me, go to Stuttgart and he sprained his shoulder. Again back to the Doctor, MRI's and some therapy and he's back to the grind. He plays the rest of the year until a knee injury took him out in the Robinson game, applying lotions,gels and pads with lidocaine just to do his job under those Friday night lights. He helped the Jacks go undefeated and be champs.
Now football is done and graduation is over, he even gets a year of apprenticeship school under his belt. He's under a house running gas piping during that hot week we had in July. He crawls out and can't get his balance. I'm thinking he's dehydrated and put him in A/C . That was on a Friday a lunch, Tuesday he goes to the Doctor and with the X-rays, MRI's and CT's, they finally found what his problem was. Dr. Wharton, who is the Team Doc is also my son's primary, told him he was lucky he wasn't in a wheelchair for life.
I'm not asking for sympathy like I said. I just want to let other parents on here to know don't ignore small signs. As parents, we try to keep our kids healthy and playing but sometimes it's not up to us. Just be vigilant and don't ignore or make light of what your child is telling you because telling them to play through the pain and to toughen up may be too much when enough is enough.
Quote from: KASH dba The Lumberjack on October 16, 2018, 04:50:49 pm
I have to start by saying God is great, He taking great care of my son. I'm reviving this thread for sympathy. I felt like I needed to warn some parents on here to not take some small ailments for granted. My son was told by his surgeon today that he is well on the path of recovery. He had Chiari decompression surgery 2 weeks ago. That's why I started with God is great. I know my son has been in His hands.
Back in '15, after we lost to Nashville, he came home with what we thought was a stinger. So we treated as such. He got better but had a nagging shoulder pain. Doctors said to rest it and it should get better, but as we all know, football is 365 in Warren so he never really got to rest it. Now before I continue, this is not a slam on the sport. This was a problem he had since birth, and wasn't caused by football. Football did bring it to the surface however.
So we make it through the summer going to 7v7 and working with me, go to Stuttgart and he sprained his shoulder. Again back to the Doctor, MRI's and some therapy and he's back to the grind. He plays the rest of the year until a knee injury took him out in the Robinson game, applying lotions,gels and pads with lidocaine just to do his job under those Friday night lights. He helped the Jacks go undefeated and be champs.
Now football is done and graduation is over, he even gets a year of apprenticeship school under his belt. He's under a house running gas piping during that hot week we had in July. He crawls out and can't get his balance. I'm thinking he's dehydrated and put him in A/C . That was on a Friday a lunch, Tuesday he goes to the Doctor and with the X-rays, MRI's and CT's, they finally found what his problem was. Dr. Wharton, who is the Team Doc is also my son's primary, told him he was lucky he wasn't in a wheelchair for life.
I'm not ask for sympathy like I said. I just want to let other parents on here to know don't ignore small signs. As parents, we try to keep our kids healthy and playing but sometimes it's not up to us. Just be vigilant and don't ignore or make light of what your child is telling you because telling them to play through the pain and to toughen up may be when enough is too much.
God is good.
I've taken care of kids right out of surgery with that diagnosis. Most often, they are found while playing sports. God took care of your son.
Know your kids folks. A simple headache/nagging shoulder pain, can be something simple as needing glasses to needing surgery or experiencing something more grim. Also, take advantage of wellness visits for your kids.
Glad all is well man.
Great to hear you son is recovering, God bless.
Thanks Guys. I'm just hoping his story would help other parents not be as dense as I was. He actually told me this morning that his right foot has began to point straight. We always assumed that he twisted his ankle in the 9th grade and favored his foot to point out. He could make some noise in the deer woods, I would make fun of him and it wasn't anything he could control. Parents be cautious, take nothing for granted. But also know God is great and when it's in His hands, it'll all work out.