conference realignment

[2cansam]

I have been hearing some rumors about the conferences being realigned do to travel. I was wondering what you think about the current conferences being changed to help out with the gas and travel expences? What are some of the ideas that are being thrown around out there?

[parpar]

They have created a travel committee to look at the cost of the travel for the current alignments and what options are available.  I have everything from a conference realignment plan based on geography instead of size to throwing out conference games during the season and just using overall records to determine playoff seeds in divisions ranked by size.

The Siloam Springs question tends to be the big issue.  If they move to 6A size, which is a forgone conlcusion evidently, it puts the AAA in an unenviable situation of one team in the NW corner of the state and all of the current 6A schools in the south and the East.  If they go ahead and allow Russellville to drop to 6A, you would have Siloam, Mt. Home and Russellville bunched, but what other five schools do you match them with?  And where does West memphis go.  The 7A Central would stretch from Van Buren to Bryant to West Memphis?

And then you have the problem of all of the Central and Northwest schools, regardless of size, could easily form very small geographic conferences, but then you would have isolated schools in the south and the east.  As an example, you could have a pretty competitive conference  or two just in Pulaski County, and then Garland and Saline County could combine for a pretty decent conference.

One solution is to form conferences similar to what you have, but place a travel restriction on it.  If two of the schools are more than 60 miles apart, the conference could approve the schools to play a designated non-conference game as a game that would count in the conference standings.  Say, in the 5A Southwest now, Magnolia might not have to come to Robinson and Robinson could designate Oak Grove and Magnolia might designate Prescott as a substitiute game.

[Rulesman]

Has there been any discussion about junking the traditional 8-team conferences to help alleviate the problems you cite with Siloam, West Memphis, etc?

[parpar]

I think that is a distinct possibility.  Just a 75 mile one-way trip costs us over $400 in fuel alone by the time we send 3 teams buses, two band buses, and a cheer/dance bus.  And since drivers are paid by the hour, the farther the trip the more hours they are on the clock.  But where you really see it, since football is only an every other year sport, is basketball, volleyball, baseball, and softball where conferences play a home and home double round robin.  Seven trips per sport, most of which are not on Friday, creates a lot of lost class time as well as expense.  Throw wrestling, golf, tennis, swimming and gymnastics in and it's a real problem. 

[Missco]

Simple solution, go to 6 team conferences. That would help a lot.

[Rulesman]

Simple solution, go to 6 team conferences. That would help a lot.

A one-size-fits-all isn't the answer. That's what you have now with 8-team conferences.

[Missco]

I agree but 6 works better than 8. The real answer is to break them down by regions and you are correct numbers probably would vary between 6 and 8. That is Tn does their conferences now. Regardless, of how you do it some school will always have to travel. Mountain Home for example is far from anywhere. The less teams in a conference the less travel you'll have.

[Rulesman]

I agree but 6 works better than 8. The real answer is to break them down by regions and you are correct numbers probably would vary between 6 and 8. That is Tn does their conferences now. Regardless, of how you do it some school will always have to travel. Mountain Home for example is far from anywhere. The less teams in a conference the less travel you'll have.

Regional setups make sense but there are drawbacks, too. Biggest one is finding enough games to play with other schools near the same size you are. You mention TN. Look at some of their football scores in the Saturday morning paper. 60-something to nothing is as common as 2-8 teams getting out of a Region to make the playoffs. A lot of this comes from the disparity in the sizes of the schools and I don't think that will go over too well for too long in Arkansas.

[Missco]

No plan will ever be perfect. The problem in Arkansas if you go to smaller conference size is finding enough games. That is the reason for the conference size being 8. I don't see the big deal now. Other than maybe making a few exceptions to cut down on a few schools travel. people gripe about travel but then schools choose sometimes to travel along ways for non conference games.

[parpar]

I hope we don't throw the baby out with the bath water.  Current conference setups are pretty competitive over a course of years, not just a snapshot.  Even say Greenwood, so dominate for so long, is having a struggling year that gives the other teams a chance.

I think a little bit of tweaking and some imaginative scheduling would ease the problem.  It will never be solved, and to some extent, it is kind of a highlight for a kid to get to travel at least once during the season - maybe eat a meal at an out of town restaurant, see something they have never seen.

[Earl is my Hero!!]

maybe eat a meal at an out of town restaurant, see something they have never seen.

I agree, I think it's a good learning for our Bentonville kids to go to a restaurant and not be able to find caviar on the menu. They have to learn to adjust or do without.

Seriously, I know they would be much smaller in terms of enrollment, but does it not make sense for Siloam to join the 7A West? They would take a few beatings against the top of the conference, but could be competitive with several teams.

Hey, they couldn't do any worse than Van Buren did year after year after year after year.

[Lions84]

Looking at the outlay of the state this issue affects the Bigger schools the most.  In our current district 6AA we have short trips to play each other and had shorter ones back in the 1980's when Elaine, Cotton Plant, Holly Grove and Altheimer still fielded teams.

It is going to be a hot button issue and not everyone going to be happy.

[Rulesman]

Looking at the outlay of the state this issue affects the Bigger schools the most.  In our current district 6AA we have short trips to play each other and had shorter ones back in the 1980's when Elaine, Cotton Plant, Holly Grove and Altheimer still fielded teams.

It is going to be a hot button issue and not everyone going to be happy.

No matter how it comes out, I predict most everyone will end up unhappy. After all, humans rarely accept radical change with a smile on their face.

[parpar]

There is one guarantee in life besides death and taxes - trying to make everyone happy is guaranteed to fail.

[nmyeyes]

Will they split the 4a up or are they leaving it with 64 teams? why would they not split that up to 32 each and give the smaller scholls a chance?

[Made]

Will they split the 4a up or are they leaving it with 64 teams? why would they not split that up to 32 each and give the smaller scholls a chance?

atm there are only 48 teams in the 4a...

[Jimbo Morphis]

with all the consolidation they should look at current numbers. the average over the last three cycles is not close. look at dollarway's numbers for an example.

[parpar]

Necessarily,the numbers are pretty much going to be 2 years-old.  And it makes sense.  You get the numbers on October 15th if the first year of the new reclassification.  You rank them, then do the conference splits and get a plan adopted in the spring meetiing to take effect in 18 months.  About the only way to speed that up and keep a 10 game schedule is to go to 11 team conferences and eliminate non-conference games.  Then the AAA sets the schedule in the spring for the next fall.

[Warrior Blitz]

<br />I think that is a distinct possibility.  Just a 75 mile one-way trip costs us over $400 in fuel alone by the time we send 3 teams buses, two band buses, and a cheer/dance bus.  And since drivers are paid by the hour, the farther the trip the more hours they are on the clock.  But where you really see it, since football is only an every other year sport, is basketball, volleyball, baseball, and softball where conferences play a home and home double round robin.  Seven trips per sport, most of which are not on Friday, creates a lot of lost class time as well as expense.  Throw wrestling, golf, tennis, swimming and gymnastics in and it's a real problem.  <br />

Parpar, I agree with you in that it is not only a cost issue but also a time issue out of the class room.  We need to keep things in balance.  On cost, we are temporarily catching a break as gas continues to fall, but what if gas goes back up to 4 plus dollars a gallon this time next year and we are driving over 200 miles each way ?  Change is hard, but it will be necessary and it is always better to get ahead of the curve and not be forced into situations that do not serve our kids and communities very well.  We need to get creative.  What about designating 6 to 8 neutral sites so that when these fields/courts/diamonds etc. are available we take advantage of them for the greater good.  You could limit a teams schedule to no more than a certain number of neutral site games per season.   Perhaps a certain distance would require a neutral site. Otherwise we will continue to see 8 to 12 hour round trip drives.  Neutral sites would benefit all sports and create a better chance for communities to go and support their school.         

[Rulesman]

Good luck selling the coaches on the idea of playing at "neutral" sites, particularly in basketball. Can you see school "X" playing their biggest rival, school "Y" once at a neutral site, only to have to play the rematch in school "Y's" home gym? I don't think so.

[Jimbo Morphis]

aren't they talking about a change for the 2009 season?

[Rulesman]

aren't they talking about a change for the 2009 season?

I've heard the same thing.

[Missco]

I have heard the same thing but it doesn't make sense. Some schools already have contracts for games for next seson.

[neafbfan]

I just happened to look at the AAA website the other day and there are waht 300-305 districts. Only 210-220 play football. Take the top 50 make that Class I, 51-100 Class II, 101-150,Class III, 151-210 in football Class IV and the non-football Class V and be done. Divide the classes into conferences as best you can to avoid extreme travel (over 100 miles one way) and make it fit the best you can.No plan will be perfect, but it will be better than driving two hours and playing for 75 minutes then driving two hours back home during the regular season. If it's the playoffs, that's one thing, but the regular season. C'mon!

[Missco]

Their has always been travel and always will. In Missouri they have 4 teams districts. Guess what some of them still travel far away because they have too to get games. There is no easy answers. Look at nettleton they traveled to Bentonville for a non-conference game. Blytheville is isolated and really only have two games that are over 100 miles. I really don't see that being the  big deal.  There are probably better ways than it is now but the simplest way in to put 6a and 7a  back together. Schools like Mountain Home and Batesville are always going to have 3 or 4 games that are over 100 miles regardless of how you do it. With gas going back down you'll see less griping.

[neafbfan]

I just happened to look at the AAA website the other day and there are waht 300-305 districts. Only 210-220 play football. Take the top 50 make that Class I, 51-100 Class II, 101-150,Class III, 151-210 in football Class IV and the non-football Class V and be done. Divide the classes into conferences as best you can to avoid extreme travel (over 100 miles one way) and make it fit the best you can.No plan will be perfect, but it will be better than driving two hours and playing for 75 minutes then driving two hours back home during the regular season. If it's the playoffs, that's one thing, but the regular season. C'mon!

Where have you been seeing 1 hour 15 minute games?

The concept is, as I'm sure you recognized, that some teams spend more time "getting" to the game than actually "playing" the game. Especially if you travel from any of the four corners to the center of the state.

[Rulesman]

I have heard the same thing but it doesn't make sense. Some schools already have contracts for games for next seson.

A radical change such as this would likely allow those contracts to be voided without penalty.

[Missco]

I just read today where Missouri is proposing to add another class for basketball. they would go from 5 to 6 for basketball. the need for something different in Arkansas is needed but I do not understand why they don't wait for the cycle to end.

[Missco]

I bet out of state teams if effected will make schools pay a penalty.

[Rulesman]

I bet out of state teams if effected will make schools pay a penalty.

Missco, I'll bet even more something is written into the standard contract to cover situations such as this. If it was going to be a problem there wouldn't be any discussion about making an off-cycle change.

[Missco]

Not going to get into specifics but Missouri  schools will make schools pony up. I know of two  schools that have had too pay before in situations similar to this.