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Haskell at Hoxie

Started by rayzorbackfan, November 06, 2017, 09:21:37 am

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rayzorbackfan

Two 3 seeds match up, who advances and who starts basketball.

WorkOrder

Cards move on
Stangs start thump thump

501Arkansas

They better not look over hoxie, hoxie is a darn good football team. Im going with hoxie with this one

CoolBreeze

Potentially one of the most competitive games in round 1. But Hoxie likely wins at home.

ISU7


HHSMustang16

My Mustangs by 21. Coach Sears teams are more physical, smarter, and Haskell will also get out coached.

Moose

HHG by 14.  3 losses on the season.  1 to a 4A school and the other two were to two of the best teams in the state.  The Cardinals have played one of the toughest schedules in 3A other than Glen Rose. 

HHSMustang16

HHG by 14.  3 losses on the season.  1 to a 4A school and the other two were to two of the best teams in the state.  The Cardinals have played one of the toughest schedules in 3A other than Glen Rose.

Haskell better bring a crowd with them because they're playing in an intense environment.

Paperman


Coltfan2005

Quote from: Moose on November 07, 2017, 04:11:10 pm
HHG by 14.  3 losses on the season.  1 to a 4A school and the other two were to two of the best teams in the state.  The Cardinals have played one of the toughest schedules in 3A other than Glen Rose.

It could be said that HHG has only played three quality teams and lost to all.

Moose

Interesting...HHG is going to get out coached, be overwhelmed by the crowd, and haven't played quality opponents.  I will say this, HHG went in to the PIT and beat a Daryl Patton coached 4A school team in the season opener.  Don't know if you guys have ever been to the PIT, or know who Patton is, but Hoxie better be ready to play their best football or they will get beat. 

KOJACK

Quote from: Coltfan2005 on November 07, 2017, 08:04:30 pm
It could be said that HHG has only played three quality teams and lost to all.
I don't think Hoxie has beaten anyone this year either really.

HeadBussa08

Quote from: KOJACK on November 08, 2017, 07:56:23 am
I don't think Hoxie has beaten anyone this year either really.
agreed with 'Jack. Think this outta be one of the better first round games. good luck to HHG

Coltfan2005

Quote from: Moose on November 07, 2017, 11:00:44 pm
Interesting...HHG is going to get out coached, be overwhelmed by the crowd, and haven't played quality opponents.  I will say this, HHG went in to the PIT and beat a Daryl Patton coached 4A school team in the season opener.  Don't know if you guys have ever been to the PIT, or know who Patton is, but Hoxie better be ready to play their best football or they will get beat. 

a 4-6 team. This is what you are measuring HHG by?

Nomad1324

Honestly, this is probably the best match-up of the first round.

Should be a good one in Lawrence County.


Moose

Quote from: Coltfan2005 on November 08, 2017, 10:51:12 am
a 4-6 team. This is what you are measuring HHG by?

Not at all.  If I was measuring HHG, it would be by personal knowledge of the athletes themselves, strength of schedule, and record.  That being said, if others want to measure coaching ability, atmosphere, and opponents then I just wanted to point a few things out to those who might not be real familiar with who and where they have played.  HHG has played a stronger schedule than Hoxie has and they have a better record than Hoxie does.  What are you measuring by Coltfan?

Coltfan2005

I am actually not measuring either team. For me to say one's schedule was more difficult than the other would be opinion, just as yours is. The FACT is, Newport may be better than Prescott, Rivercrest may be better than Glen Rose, none of them have played this year. Or it might be the other way around.

camo5257


Moose

Quote from: Coltfan2005 on November 08, 2017, 12:57:16 pm
I am actually not measuring either team. For me to say one's schedule was more difficult than the other would be opinion, just as yours is. The FACT is, Newport may be better than Prescott, Rivercrest may be better than Glen Rose, none of them have played this year. Or it might be the other way around.

Oh I'm sorry, I thought you were commenting about how someone measured teams.  Strength of schedule is NOT an opinion by the way, it is a mathematical equation and is most certainly a FACT. 

CoolBreeze

Quote from: Moose on November 08, 2017, 02:55:25 pm
Oh I'm sorry, I thought you were commenting about how someone measured teams.  Strength of schedule is NOT an opinion by the way, it is a mathematical equation and is most certainly a FACT.
I beg to differ. There is no way to objectively and accurately measure strength of schedule. Various models attempt to do so, but none can take in all the factors. Most are based on the win-loss records of the teams played, but a 5-5 team from one conference might well be stronger than an 8-2 team from another. There are too many immeasurable intangibles to make it truly scientific. There will always be an element of subjectivity. People evaluating choices for certain NCAA playoff slots call it "the eye test."

Moose

Quote from: CoolBreeze on November 08, 2017, 03:29:45 pm
I beg to differ. There is no way to objectively and accurately measure strength of schedule. Various models attempt to do so, but none can take in all the factors. Most are based on the win-loss records of the teams played, but a 5-5 team from one conference might well be stronger than an 8-2 team from another. There are too many immeasurable intangibles to make it truly scientific. There will always be an element of subjectivity. People evaluating choices for certain NCAA playoff slots call it "the eye test."

Fair enough, but a statistical model is not someone's opinion.

Coltfan2005

Actually, statistical models are all based on someone's idea or opinion of how something should be done. One power ranking might have Hoxie in the top 10 and HHG no where to be found.

Proud Buckaroo

Wrong. When you have mathematical and statistical rankings. It automatically removes opinion and bias....

Coltfan2005

Quote from: Proud Buckaroo on November 08, 2017, 06:24:16 pm
Wrong. When you have mathematical and statistical rankings. It automatically removes opinion and bias....

wrong...the setting up of the formula itself is made by humans, this is not 2+2 but a formula designed to achieve what a human wants and as such will always be flawed by someone's opinion.

Moose

I predicted HHG by 14.  Hey Coltfan, what do you think?

Coltfan2005

I hate to predict by score. I will just say I expect HHG to win. However, I am pulling for Hoxie and would not be shocked if they win at home.

camo5257

November 09, 2017, 01:51:51 am #26 Last Edit: November 09, 2017, 01:58:57 am by camo5257
Quote from: Moose on November 07, 2017, 04:11:10 pm
HHG by 14.  3 losses on the season.  1 to a 4A school and the other two were to two of the best teams in the state.  The Cardinals have played one of the toughest schedules in 3A other than Glen Rose.
Did you forget that hoxie played Rivercrest? Osceola? Newport? Piggott? Not to mention 9-1 3-4A Trumann. Not trying to make a point about hoxie, just saying that i doubt HHG had a tougher schedule than that...

Moose

Quote from: camo5257 on November 09, 2017, 01:51:51 am
Did you forget that hoxie played Rivercrest? Osceola? Newport? Piggott? Not to mention 9-1 3-4A Trumann. Not trying to make a point about hoxie, just saying that i doubt HHG had a tougher schedule than that...

I didn't, but they did.  There are only two teams that played a higher strength of schedule than HHG, in 3A.  Glen Rose & Manila.

camo5257

Quote from: KOJACK on November 08, 2017, 07:56:23 am
I don't think Hoxie has beaten anyone this year either really.
For what it's worth, hoxie beat the (at the time) undefeated Newport Greyhounds who were ranked 4th in the state

Nomad1324

Quote from: camo5257 on November 09, 2017, 08:04:13 am
For what it's worth, hoxie beat the (at the time) undefeated Newport Greyhounds who were ranked 4th in the state

The 5-seed.

They beat the 5-seed. The team that could go out and win against Rivercrest and get blown out by Piggott. Who knows which team showed up to Lawrence County that night?

These are two talented teams and it should be a good game. Other than that, all you can tell by looking at a schedule is how the team did with the teams in front of them, not how they'll do this week.

Oldhound56

I don't know about HHG size, but I can tell you that Hoxie is huge. Their line is the biggest that Newport faced all year and they are much improved.  They move well and when they get on you it is hard to get off blocks.  Should be a good game.

camo5257

Quote from: Nomad1324 on November 09, 2017, 08:16:38 am
The 5-seed.

They beat the 5-seed. The team that could go out and win against Rivercrest and get blown out by Piggott. Who knows which team showed up to Lawrence County that night?

These are two talented teams and it should be a good game. Other than that, all you can tell by looking at a schedule is how the team did with the teams in front of them, not how they'll do this week.
Yes, newport is very iffy. Hoxie shut down the run game that night, and it would have been alot closer if newport would have caught the ball.  This should be a great game, i'm going with hoxie at their home field.

CoolBreeze

Quote from: Coltfan2005 on November 08, 2017, 07:05:45 pm
wrong...the setting up of the formula itself is made by humans, this is not 2+2 but a formula designed to achieve what a human wants and as such will always be flawed by someone's opinion.
+1

Coltfan2005

Quote from: Moose on November 09, 2017, 07:25:35 am
I didn't, but they did.  There are only two teams that played a higher strength of schedule than HHG, in 3A.  Glen Rose & Manila.

Manila's schedule almost mirrors hoxie's. with the exception that Manila played Westside (who lost to trumann) and brookland (who doesn't strengthen anyone's schedule)

CoolBreeze

Quote from: Moose on November 09, 2017, 07:25:35 am
I didn't, but they did.  There are only two teams that played a higher strength of schedule than HHG, in 3A.  Glen Rose & Manila.
Sorry, Moose, but I just don't see Glen Rose as having that tough a schedule. Their non-conference games included wins over Malvern, a 3-7 4A team, and CHG, a 7-3 2A team, as well as a loss to  Bauxite, a 4-6 4A team, which lost the week before to HHG. Moreover, their conference schedule included such powerhouses as Bismarck, Gurdon, and Jessieville. Defeating one top team does not make the schedule the toughest in the state.

camo5257

November 09, 2017, 11:47:47 am #35 Last Edit: November 09, 2017, 11:50:35 am by camo5257
Quote from: Coltfan2005 on November 09, 2017, 11:02:03 am
Manila's schedule almost mirrors hoxie's. with the exception that Manila played Westside (who lost to trumann) and brookland (who doesn't strengthen anyone's schedule)
Hoxie played westside too. They lost by a td. Only difference was Hoxie played 0-10 Cave City

Moose

It's easy guys. Hoxie playing Manila, weakens their schedule.  Manila playing Hoxie strengthens theirs. 

Moose

Quote from: CoolBreeze on November 09, 2017, 11:17:42 am
Sorry, Moose, but I just don't see Glen Rose as having that tough a schedule. Their non-conference games included wins over Malvern, a 3-7 4A team, and CHG, a 7-3 2A team, as well as a loss to  Bauxite, a 4-6 4A team, which lost the week before to HHG. Moreover, their conference schedule included such powerhouses as Bismarck, Gurdon, and Jessieville. Defeating one top team does not make the schedule the toughest in the state.

Argue it with CalPreps Breeze. It's the only statistical model that I know of.  Maybe you should invent one.  And whatever you do, please don't cut CHG short, those 3 losses were to Smackover, Prescott, and Glen Rose.  They went 7-0 after that and won their conference, and my pick to win 2A state. 

Coltfan2005

Doesn't CalPreps have Newport rated above HHG? And isn't Hoxie right behind HHG? Matter of fact, didn't Hoxie play 3 of the teams in Calpreps top 10 3A, beating one of them?

Moose

Quote from: Coltfan2005 on November 09, 2017, 01:54:31 pm
Doesn't CalPreps have Newport rated above HHG? And isn't Hoxie right behind HHG? Matter of fact, didn't Hoxie play 3 of the teams in Calpreps top 10 3A, beating one of them?

I believe that is correct.

Linebacker

Hoxie wins this one. 35-21.

Moose

Great job Cardinals, going to that nasty environment, and going to get out coached.  For a team that hasn't played anybody, that's a great win!

camo5257

Quote from: Moose on November 10, 2017, 09:55:37 pm
Great job Cardinals, going to that nasty environment, and going to get out coached.  For a team that hasn't played anybody, that's a great win!
Good job cardinals!! Way to get handed a free W from the refs. Got Clinton next week, let's see how far they get...

Moose

That's always a great answer. Blame it on the refs.  In the end, we'll see how good the 3A-3 is.

ISU7

Quote from: Moose on November 10, 2017, 09:55:37 pm
Great job Cardinals, going to that nasty environment, and going to get out coached.  For a team that hasn't played anybody, that's a great win!
You sound mad about something....hmmmm

Kobisnumberonefan

camo5257...were you even at the game?   I think Hoxie only had 2 penalties the whole game (3 if you count the offsetting unsportsmanlike calls at the beginning).  It was a joke, but you don't see any cardinal posts whining about referee bias.  IF you honestly believe high school football ref's will ever be the caliber of NFL ref's or even some college, maybe you should pick another sport to follow....maybe curling!

camo5257

November 11, 2017, 12:41:22 pm #46 Last Edit: November 11, 2017, 12:43:56 pm by camo5257
Quote from: Kobisnumberonefan on November 11, 2017, 10:31:27 am
camo5257...were you even at the game?   I think Hoxie only had 2 penalties the whole game (3 if you count the offsetting unsportsmanlike calls at the beginning).  It was a joke, but you don't see any cardinal posts whining about referee bias.  IF you honestly believe high school football ref's will ever be the caliber of NFL ref's or even some college, maybe you should pick another sport to follow....maybe curling!
I didn't say anything about penalties... more the lack of.  Holding our olb's on the edge all night, not called one time. I was at the game, and if you were too, you'd see the call the costed them the game. Hoxie caught a pass inside the 10 yd line with 40 seconds left, hoxie receiver clearly down, for a good two or three seconds, the ref decided to call a fumble and gave the ball to HHG. I don't expect them to get every single call, but to not even get one of them is just pitiful :/

Kobisnumberonefan

Quote from: camo5257 on November 11, 2017, 12:41:22 pm
I didn't say anything about penalties... more the lack of.  Holding our olb's on the edge all night, not called one time. I was at the game, and if you were too, you'd see the call the costed them the game. Hoxie caught a pass inside the 10 yd line with 40 seconds left, hoxie receiver clearly down, for a good two or three seconds, the ref decided to call a fumble and gave the ball to HHG. I don't expect them to get every single call, but to not even get one of them is just pitiful :/
We looked at the film this morning.  It was clearly a fumble..but nonetheless, one play does not win or lose a game.  If referees decide to let the boys play, then so be it.  But don't get especially upset when you feel the ref made a bad call and it turns out it was the right call.

camo5257

Quote from: Kobisnumberonefan on November 11, 2017, 12:53:38 pm
We looked at the film this morning.  It was clearly a fumble..but nonetheless, one play does not win or lose a game.  If referees decide to let the boys play, then so be it.  But don't get especially upset when you feel the ref made a bad call and it turns out it was the right call.
Doesn't even matter, the game is over, but it was simply not the right call.

Moose


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