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Re: Cabot’s next HC?

Started by AirWarren, November 27, 2018, 02:13:34 pm

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game on

There are a few coaches in this state who make 90+ $$ but not many.  I recall a few years back when the salaries for football coaches was printed in the paper.  I'm sure some of those have gone up but it is true that salary is controlled to some extent by state law and district policy which cannot be changed without approval.  I also am sure that classroom teachers monitor the salary levels of coaches and don't mind questioning raises.  This is not to say some schools don't raise salaries to get the guys they want.  One of the ways to do this is "extra" duties which often are not much duty and a nice pay hike.

bigchief72455

Quote from: Jsmith48 on December 03, 2018, 06:45:47 am
A school can't just "offer" a coach money no matter how deep the pockets are. These are public schools for the most part. They have salary schedules, education levels, stipend schedules, etc. to consider. All of these have to go before the Personel Policy Committee then to the Superintendent and then the Board to change. It can be done but it's not easy or quick.
This is true and a good thing it is this way. If it were not then almost every state title team would come from either the Little rock area or the Fayetteville area.

hogfan10

Quote from: Jsmith48 on December 03, 2018, 08:10:56 am
Not true. Arkansas Code of Ethics, Article 5 says you can't accept outside money as a public school employee. That includes coaches. They can lose their license.

I guess it depends on what is considered "outside money".
Money from Nike, Adidas, etc = outside; money for coaches shows, appearance, etc. = ok?

Oldbadger

Quote from: game on on December 03, 2018, 10:29:37 am
There are a few coaches in this state who make 90+ $$ but not many.  I recall a few years back when the salaries for football coaches was printed in the paper.  I'm sure some of those have gone up but it is true that salary is controlled to some extent by state law and district policy which cannot be changed without approval.  I also am sure that classroom teachers monitor the salary levels of coaches and don't mind questioning raises.  This is not to say some schools don't raise salaries to get the guys they want.  One of the ways to do this is "extra" duties which often are not much duty and a nice pay hike.
All salaries are supposed to be public. Most can be accessed on the internet at the school's website.


game on

Salaries in Arkansas look like they have climbed at the large schools.

#1thetruth

Quote from: gerber707 on December 02, 2018, 08:11:52 pm
Come on truth you know 75k is more than you will ever make. By the way I think your revelation will be anticlimactic. I hope you surprise me but I doubt it. Do you remember the coyote chasing the roadrunner and the roadrunner ran around the corner on the bluff but the coyote didn't quit make the corner and ran over the edge and just before he fell large donkey ears appeared above his head? Before you ask that's how I envision you......................

$75k is not a lot of money.....

SUGARTOWN


Jimbo Morphis

Quote from: Jsmith48 on December 03, 2018, 08:10:56 am
Not true. Arkansas Code of Ethics, Article 5 says you can’t accept outside money as a public school employee. That includes coaches. They can lose their license.
Young and innocent or old and naive??

Jsmith48

I'm neither.  I'm an educator with 21 years of experience who, along with the coaches, goes through ethics training every year.  Coaches get a base salary just like every other teacher.  Then they get their stipends based on the sport/s they coach.  Some coaches even get extended contracts from 10 to 12 months depending on the district.  All these things raise their salaries into the $60 to $90,000 range.  All of that is above board and great.  In my opinion coaches and band directors and the other teachers who sponsor groups don't get paid for the time they put in.  What I'm talking about is money given to a coach/teacher from outside the district.  They can do it all day long and never get caught and that's fine too but ask the players at Earle if they are still mad about last year.  Ethics are important.  Go to the ADE website and read it for yourself.  People on here get up in arms about recruiting players and refs that favor the home team all the time.  Why is that bad but circumventing state law to pay your coach under the table is okay?

JacketFan

Quote from: Jsmith48 on December 03, 2018, 04:07:24 pm
I'm neither.  I'm an educator with 21 years of experience who, along with the coaches, goes through ethics training every year.  Coaches get a base salary just like every other teacher.  Then they get their stipends based on the sport/s they coach.  Some coaches even get extended contracts from 10 to 12 months depending on the district.  All these things raise their salaries into the $60 to $90,000 range.  All of that is above board and great.  In my opinion coaches and band directors and the other teachers who sponsor groups don't get paid for the time they put in.  What I'm talking about is money given to a coach/teacher from outside the district.  They can do it all day long and never get caught and that's fine too but ask the players at Earle if they are still mad about last year.  Ethics are important.  Go to the ADE website and read it for yourself.  People on here get up in arms about recruiting players and refs that favor the home team all the time.  Why is that bad but circumventing state law to pay your coach under the table is okay?
Never said it was okay, but I know it happens, don't really care that it happens.  Does anyone have any good info on the Cabot coaching search, or has this thread turned into the Dept of Education course on Ethics.

Jimbo Morphis

Quote from: Jsmith48 on December 03, 2018, 04:07:24 pm
I'm neither.  I'm an educator with 21 years of experience who, along with the coaches, goes through ethics training every year.  Coaches get a base salary just like every other teacher.  Then they get their stipends based on the sport/s they coach.  Some coaches even get extended contracts from 10 to 12 months depending on the district.  All these things raise their salaries into the $60 to $90,000 range.  All of that is above board and great.  In my opinion coaches and band directors and the other teachers who sponsor groups don't get paid for the time they put in.  What I'm talking about is money given to a coach/teacher from outside the district.  They can do it all day long and never get caught and that's fine too but ask the players at Earle if they are still mad about last year.  Ethics are important.  Go to the ADE website and read it for yourself.  People on here get up in arms about recruiting players and refs that favor the home team all the time.  Why is that bad but circumventing state law to pay your coach under the table is okay?
People don't pay to watch your class or want to fire you when a few kids fail. Coaches deserve all they get plus more. Just my opinion.

hogfan10

Quote from: Oldman on December 03, 2018, 05:35:19 pm
People don't pay to watch your class or want to fire you when a few kids fail. Coaches deserve all they get plus more. Just my opinion.
Maybe, but coaches don't deal with near the crap in-classroom teachers do. If anyone is underpaid, it's most likely the in-classroom teachers. And, I'm not claiming coaches are overpaid, but that in-classroom teachers are way underpaid.

Jsmith48

Quote from: Oldman on December 03, 2018, 05:35:19 pm
People don't pay to watch your class or want to fire you when a few kids fail. Coaches deserve all they get plus more. Just my opinion.
And that's exactly what I said in my post. Except people do blame the teachers when their kids fail. It doesn't matter if the kid doesn't do the work or won't behave just like if the kid gives poor effort or misses a block or runs the wrong route.

Jimbo Morphis

Quote from: hogfan10 on December 03, 2018, 06:26:43 pm
Maybe, but coaches don't deal with near the crap in-classroom teachers do. If anyone is underpaid, it's most likely the in-classroom teachers. And, I'm not claiming coaches are overpaid, but that in-classroom teachers are way underpaid.
I agree teachers are terribly underpaid.

game on

Remember that most coaches are classroom teachers first and have half a day or a full day of classroom duties.  Usually if they don't have classroom duties it is the HC that doesn't teach classes.  I don't know how many of those cases there are but that is the situation that most often upsets other teachers or school parents when they do complain about what coaches make. 

hogfan10

Quote from: game on on December 03, 2018, 07:17:30 pm
Remember that most coaches are classroom teachers first and have half a day or a full day of classroom duties.  Usually if they don't have classroom duties it is the HC that doesn't teach classes.  I don't know how many of those cases there are but that is the situation that most often upsets other teachers or school parents when they do complain about what coaches make.
True, a lot of coaches have classroom duties. And, quiet often it's PE, shop, etc. When I was in school we had a coach who taught biology and one that taught JR high history, but the rest taught PE.
The demands put on coaches and teachers,by parents, is often times unrealistic. They're expected to get Johnny and Jane athletic scholarships or make them Harvard ready. A little work at home would go a long way, at least academically.

cabotpantherman

The hiring will be done before Christmas.

#1thetruth

Quote from: gerber707 on December 03, 2018, 01:11:18 pm


75k is not a lot of money.... that's about 4400k take home a month. Just saying.

nomorewhining

$4,400,000 a month take home is a lot

AirWarren

Quote from: nomorewhining on December 04, 2018, 12:28:09 pm
$4,400,000 a month take home is a lot

Not to a retired 45 year old who helped lock down Treylon Burks at cornerback during the 2017 title game. Lol.

game on

Quote from: hogfan10 on December 03, 2018, 07:43:57 pm
True, a lot of coaches have classroom duties. And, quiet often it's PE, shop, etc. When I was in school we had a coach who taught biology and one that taught JR high history, but the rest taught PE.
The demands put on coaches and teachers,by parents, is often times unrealistic. They're expected to get Johnny and Jane athletic scholarships or make them Harvard ready. A little work at home would go a long way, at least academically.
Quote from: #1thetruth on December 03, 2018, 09:57:11 pm
75k is not a lot of money.... that's about 4400k take home a month. Just saying.

Sure lots of coaches are PE teachers but I think more are classroom teachers in core classes.  Finding that many PE jobs is pretty hard to do.   A lot of arkansas families would like to be living on $75,000 when you consider the median household income in Arkansas is about $55,000.

RabAlumni

Quote from: game on on December 04, 2018, 01:57:48 pm
Sure lots of coaches are PE teachers but I think more are classroom teachers in core classes.  Finding that many PE jobs is pretty hard to do.   A lot of arkansas families would like to be living on $75,000 when you consider the median household income in Arkansas is about $55,000.



That's for "Family" as well... Individual is closer to $28,000.

Reddie20

Quote from: hogfan10 on December 03, 2018, 07:43:57 pm
True, a lot of coaches have classroom duties. And, quiet often it's PE, shop, etc. When I was in school we had a coach who taught biology and one that taught JR high history, but the rest taught PE.
The demands put on coaches and teachers,by parents, is often times unrealistic. They're expected to get Johnny and Jane athletic scholarships or make them Harvard ready. A little work at home would go a long way, at least academically.
I agree with most of the things that are being talked about here.  I just wanted to let people know some things.  I teach/coach, I teach one PE class, five 7th grade math classes and coach HS football/baseball.  My schedule is crazy between lesson plans, grading papers, practice plans, film study, practice and family time.  Teachers/Coaches do a lot of work before school, after school/practice, on the weekends.  Just giving a little insight to the argument here.  PE jobs are hard to find these days, most schools want their coaches to teach a core subject or at least be able to.  If you are not a head coach just be prepared to teach all day at some schools even some of our head coaches have full schedules of classes. 

AirWarren

Quote from: Reddie20 on December 06, 2018, 11:17:37 am
I agree with most of the things that are being talked about here.  I just wanted to let people know some things.  I teach/coach, I teach one PE class, five 7th grade math classes and coach HS football/baseball.  My schedule is crazy between lesson plans, grading papers, practice plans, film study, practice and family time.  Teachers/Coaches do a lot of work before school, after school/practice, on the weekends.  Just giving a little insight to the argument here.  PE jobs are hard to find these days, most schools want their coaches to teach a core subject or at least be able to.  If you are not a head coach just be prepared to teach all day at some schools even some of our head coaches have full schedules of classes. 

Just curious though...you did go to college and get a degree based in education, correct?

Maynard G Krebs

Quote from: AirWarren on December 06, 2018, 01:37:28 pm
Just curious though...you did go to college and get a degree based in education, correct?

As a Mulerider alum, I'll point out he is a Reddie; therefore, he did not go to college😀😀😀😀😀..just kidding, the Mrs. is a Reddie alum

Reddie20

Quote from: AirWarren on December 06, 2018, 01:37:28 pm
Just curious though...you did go to college and get a degree based in education, correct?
To answer your question....yes I did. I majored in Physical Education/Health with a Master's in Sports Administration.  I wasn't trying to start a teacher/coach war and complain about having to teach.  In my opinion, head coaches should not have to teach more than half a day especially if their judged off of wins and losses.  If a school, school board and community could care less about the sports program and just keep someone who is doing a mediocre job then that works for that school.  All coaches have to pay their dues until they get that job that will give them a nice schedule.  At my previous school, I coached football/baseball while having three math classes and three other classes without prep.  During football season we watched film every night after practice until 8-9pm, Saturday from 8-12 and sundays from 1-10.  Baseball season, we had game 3-4 times a week and late nights.  I'm not complaining, I love my job! I just want more people to understand from a coach's side of the job.  Teachers are not very different except some get to go home right after school and others have lots of things going on outside of school.  That is why a lot of school parking lots have cars in them on the weekends or late nights during the week.

AirWarren

December 06, 2018, 02:45:09 pm #77 Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 02:48:21 pm by AirWarren
Quote from: Reddie20 on December 06, 2018, 02:26:07 pm
To answer your question....yes I did. I majored in Physical Education/Health with a Master's in Sports Administration.  I wasn't trying to start a teacher/coach war and complain about having to teach.  In my opinion, head coaches should not have to teach more than half a day especially if their judged off of wins and losses.  If a school, school board and community could care less about the sports program and just keep someone who is doing a mediocre job then that works for that school.  All coaches have to pay their dues until they get that job that will give them a nice schedule.  At my previous school, I coached football/baseball while having three math classes and three other classes without prep.  During football season we watched film every night after practice until 8-9pm, Saturday from 8-12 and sundays from 1-10.  Baseball season, we had game 3-4 times a week and late nights.  I'm not complaining, I love my job! I just want more people to understand from a coach's side of the job.  Teachers are not very different except some get to go home right after school and others have lots of things going on outside of school.  That is why a lot of school parking lots have cars in them on the weekends or late nights during the week.

In my profession, I started out shift work, working nights.....every other weekend....holiday's(missed my daughter's first Christmas eve) and most of Christmas day, missed Christmas day, thanksgiving, all of them, I've worked every minor holiday, and I have missed important school events. I did that lifestyle for 6 years. Now, it has blessed me with a great salary but let me tell you, I have made some sacrifices because it comes with the territory.

Fast forward 4 years. I am a regularly 8-4ish worker now. I am home every night. I am off every holiday. I have a flexible schedule that allows me to make events, etc. And no weekends. It is great, but I did my time. I was in the "trenches" with the shift workers where it didn't care if there was ice and snow on the ground...your butt better bet there. Luckily, I am blessed to be where I am and have some time to devote to a couple of side gigs. My wife and I are both the same profession and we are truly blessed in many ways thanks to the career path we chose.

Coaching is the same way. You don't walk out of college with the best schedule. The best job. The best perks. And the best pay. You have to earn your stripes. Very seldom do head coaches land at their home school right away and become AD/coach and not have to step foot in the classroom. But when you're time comes, it will feel great and you will appreciate it. Unfortunately, not a lot of people in education or my profession walk out of college making 120k$ a year. It takes time but it can be done. You're doing it the right way and your hard work will pay off.

Now, I know a little bit about teaching. My mom is a retired educator. I knew her pay. I knew her schedule. I knew the investment and I knew the time put in to lead students through school. I also knew that she was home with us during thanksgiving, Christmas, spring break, and summer. And it was a huge blessing for my parents to be able to have one person home during summer which is a huge perk for all educators. My wife's mom worked weekend option...home all week but worked Saturday and Sunday night so she could be with my wife and SIL all week. BUT like anything else, you get what sign up for. I knew what I was signing up for when I got my degree. Just like a surgeon knows what they are signing up for....a lifestyle that doesn't include being home a lot and lots of devotion.

Everyone has a "side" of their job. We are the working class that turns society's wheels. Everyone has headaches.

AirWarren

Quote from: Maynard G Krebs on December 06, 2018, 02:24:39 pm
As a Mulerider alum, I’ll point out he is a Reddie; therefore, he did not go to college😀😀😀😀😀..just kidding, the Mrs. is a Reddie alum

Weevils don't give two flips about a mulerider or a reddie...... :D

hogfan10

Quote from: Reddie20 on December 06, 2018, 02:26:07 pm
To answer your question....yes I did. I majored in Physical Education/Health with a Master's in Sports Administration.  I wasn't trying to start a teacher/coach war and complain about having to teach.  In my opinion, head coaches should not have to teach more than half a day especially if their judged off of wins and losses.  If a school, school board and community could care less about the sports program and just keep someone who is doing a mediocre job then that works for that school.  All coaches have to pay their dues until they get that job that will give them a nice schedule.  At my previous school, I coached football/baseball while having three math classes and three other classes without prep.  During football season we watched film every night after practice until 8-9pm, Saturday from 8-12 and sundays from 1-10.  Baseball season, we had game 3-4 times a week and late nights.  I'm not complaining, I love my job! I just want more people to understand from a coach's side of the job.  Teachers are not very different except some get to go home right after school and others have lots of things going on outside of school.  That is why a lot of school parking lots have cars in them on the weekends or late nights during the week.
In know way is this to dispute your actual experience/s, but I'd suspect that coaches w/the class load you're speaking of are new to the career or possibly the school. As you say seniority/superiority & and school environment play a large role in the non coaching assignments. Some coaches as new hires might be required to have specific certifications in order to be hired, due to pe positions already filled by returning coaches. I'm assuming that the pay for assistants is better if they are math, English, etc certified and teach those classes.
I'm not a teacher, so I'm not speaking from direct experience, and it's very possible that I'm wrong.

#1thetruth

Quote from: AirWarren on December 04, 2018, 01:05:01 pm
Not to a retired 45 year old who helped lock down Treylon Burks at cornerback during the 2017 title game. Lol.

I'm sure it is for some folks. if you like living paycheck to paycheck. IMO


AirWarren

December 06, 2018, 06:08:50 pm #81 Last Edit: December 06, 2018, 06:11:56 pm by AirWarren
Quote from: #1thetruth on December 06, 2018, 05:00:25 pm
I'm sure it is for some folks. if you like living paycheck to paycheck. IMO



If someone is living pay check to pay check on 75$ to 100k$ in this broke state, they need to file for bankruptcy, evaluate their spending habits, and have a professional seriously help them overhaul their debt to income ratio.

gerber707

Quote from: AirWarren on December 04, 2018, 01:05:01 pm
Not to a retired 45 year old who helped lock down Treylon Burks at cornerback during the 2017 title game. Lol.
Heck he can't even lock down his bicycle at night. Now he has to catch the bus every morning.

gerber707

Quote from: #1thetruth on December 06, 2018, 05:00:25 pm
I'm sure it is for some folks. if you like living paycheck to paycheck. IMO
How many hours a week do you have to put in a week to make that a year for minimum wage truth? Asking for a friend.

Pat Swilling

Why is everyone so worried what this job pays.  If a school is winning and filling up the bleachers then the $ goes back to the district.  Successful programs bring in $, school pride, success.  The HFC's at these large schools have a ton of stress on them to produce winning teams.  Pay them well.

#1thetruth

December 07, 2018, 10:21:10 pm #85 Last Edit: December 07, 2018, 10:27:29 pm by #1thetruth
Quote from: gerber707 on December 06, 2018, 08:00:39 pm
How many hours a week do you have to put in a week to make that a year for minimum wage truth? Asking for a friend.

See that's the problem!!! im pretty sure that's a low tier salary job, supervisor, team lead, section manager.  I'm not knocking it, if it's good for you, what does it matter what I think...... IMO that's the mentality of a right to work state worker. Keep waiting for the trickle and MAGA.... LM_O
Still, 75K is not a lot of money.
Gerber...... I left some nuggets above for you and Sugar Britches..... I hope you find them. ....I'll be waiting ...
Go Badgers

cabotpantherman

According to the pay schedule 65 more people on the Cabot school district payroll makes more than Bo. Heck our band director makes 105,000.

AirWarren

Quote from: cabotpantherman on December 08, 2018, 06:54:46 pm
According to the pay schedule 65 more people on the Cabot school district payroll makes more than Bo. Heck our band director makes 105,000.

Sigh..


Rabhog

Quote from: AirWarren on December 08, 2018, 07:27:25 pm
Sigh..


Now Air we have the money maybe settled who is the next coach at Cabot (name of thread)

gerber707

Quote from: #1thetruth on December 02, 2018, 04:39:39 pm
I THUNK it and I called it.......
You warren folks are savvy...... I think y'all maybe on to me...
The big reveal is coming!!!!
? I'm guessing there is no revelation?

game on


#1thetruth

December 17, 2018, 03:14:05 pm #91 Last Edit: December 17, 2018, 06:29:27 pm by #1thetruth
Quote from: game on on December 12, 2018, 07:39:39 pm
Its Wednesday, any word?

J.R. Eldridge or Reed

SUGARTOWN

Scott Reed has been hired at Cabot.

Digger#23


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