Cecil Langston

[Longfellow]

Move Harding to 6A? Who has the advantage then? And if you split for playoffs, you have Baptist, CAC, Harding, Subiaco, and Conway Christian playing Shiloh, LR Christian, LR Catholic, and PA. That's not fair for the kids at the smaller schools

[bdubyab60]

One thing is a crying shame. Local paper has no mention of Langston or the Colts today in the paper. Cannot believe they wouldn't send someone to cover this game.

Paperman from Osceola was there..

You know who Im talking about lol. For the 2A game in the paper  thi sis what they had.

Mcrory interceptions lead to state title: Headline.

kaigen rogo intercepted 2 passes and Mccrory one state title. He also had blah blah yards as Mccrory defeated rison. And out.

But wrote a good paragraph on Valley View and CPA basketball game. That was basically an empty gym when we left.

[WCD]

And I sincerely wish y'all had won the WMS game.  I'm not a fan of private schools from larger metro areas playing in the same classification with public schools from smaller communities.

Where should HA play?

Create a private school league OR play in the same district as the public school in which their campus is located.

A compromise would be the Louisiana system.  Public and private schools play each other during the regular season, but the groups split for their respective playoffs and championships.

Harding Academy is the smallest 2A school playing up in the 3A. They are a well disciplined team and for the most have played football together since first grade. We have PeeWee football that runs the HA high school system. When the boys start high school ball they are already familiar with the plays.

I am amazed that the small # of championships HA has won over the past 60 years is so threatening to people in Arkansas. Where were the complaints when they lost a game against Charleston or Rivercrest in the championship games previously? There was never any complaints then.

WCD

[Shorttimer]

And I sincerely wish y'all had won the WMS game.  I'm not a fan of private schools from larger metro areas playing in the same classification with public schools from smaller communities.

Where should HA play?

Create a private school league OR play in the same district as the public school in which their campus is located.

A compromise would be the Louisiana system.  Public and private schools play each other during the regular season, but the groups split for their respective playoffs and championships.

So, Conway Christian could either 1) play as a 7A school or 2) get a 1st round playoff matchup with LR Catholic.  Is that a correct interpretation of your proposal?

[bleudog]

And I sincerely wish y'all had won the WMS game.  I'm not a fan of private schools from larger metro areas playing in the same classification with public schools from smaller communities.

Where should HA play?

Create a private school league OR play in the same district as the public school in which their campus is located.

A compromise would be the Louisiana system.  Public and private schools play each other during the regular season, but the groups split for their respective playoffs and championships.

So, Conway Christian could either 1) play as a 7A school or 2) get a 1st round playoff matchup with LR Catholic.  Is that a correct interpretation of your proposal?

1)  Correct.  Although highly unlikely this would ever be agreed upon, they do draw from the same population base so they have access to the area's better athletes (depending on how aggressive in the area the private school wishes to be).  I would think creating a private school only league would be a more palatable alternative.  Mississippi has one of those and there are some Louisiana (and maybe a few Arkansas) private schools in it.  That would create a travel nightmare though which makes the Louisiana regular/playoff model attractive. 

2)  Incorrect unless they end up in the same private school playoff classification.  Once the playoffs start, all private schools would create their own classifications.  I don't know how many private schools there are in Arkansas, but lets say there are 12.  They could list them by student population and create:  Select 1A with the four smallest schools - Select 2A with the four schools in the middle - Select 3A with the four largest schools.  If there are 10 private schools, then have the five smallest in one class and the five largest in another class.  Each class would come up with their bracket and their own state champion.  Hey, a four team playoff works for the NCAA.

And to the Rivercrest folks, I'm sorry my making the post that I wish you had won has derailed Mr. Langston's thread.   

[ISU7]

And I sincerely wish y'all had won the WMS game.  I'm not a fan of private schools from larger metro areas playing in the same classification with public schools from smaller communities.

Where should HA play?

Create a private school league OR play in the same district as the public school in which their campus is located.

A compromise would be the Louisiana system.  Public and private schools play each other during the regular season, but the groups split for their respective playoffs and championships.

Harding Academy is the smallest 2A school playing up in the 3A. They are a well disciplined team and for the most have played football together since first grade. We have PeeWee football that runs the HA high school system. When the boys start high school ball they are already familiar with the plays.

I am amazed that the small # of championships HA has won over the past 60 years is so threatening to people in Arkansas. Where were the complaints when they lost a game against Charleston or Rivercrest in the championship games previously? There was never any complaints then.

WCD

Agree WCD.

[Paperman]

Once again, a topic about a player was high-jacked into a public vs. private thread! LOL! I think they should be separated for championship play as well. It is just tough in a state with so few private schools.

[bleudog]

And I sincerely wish y'all had won the WMS game.  I'm not a fan of private schools from larger metro areas playing in the same classification with public schools from smaller communities.

Where should HA play?

Create a private school league OR play in the same district as the public school in which their campus is located.

A compromise would be the Louisiana system.  Public and private schools play each other during the regular season, but the groups split for their respective playoffs and championships.

Harding Academy is the smallest 2A school playing up in the 3A. They are a well disciplined team and for the most have played football together since first grade. We have PeeWee football that runs the HA high school system. When the boys start high school ball they are already familiar with the plays.

I am amazed that the small # of championships HA has won over the past 60 years is so threatening to people in Arkansas. Where were the complaints when they lost a game against Charleston or Rivercrest in the championship games previously? There was never any complaints then.

WCD

Agree WCD.

I went to HA for a playoff game once.  In 2005 I saw the visiting team win. I think it was just before the turf got replaced.  Although I don't think losing that game caused HA to rip up the rug. 

Maybe not as much with HA, but Arkansas schools like PA and U$C have taken advantage of being located in places where just by odds the chance of having talent walk in the door (invited or not) is greater.  That advantage isn't as great in Searcy but if you were a coach looking for players, would you rather do so at a school that sits in the middle of 300,000 or 30,000 or 3,000 people, especially if you know everybody on your schedule is at a school that sits in the middle of 3,000 people? 

There are a lot of parochial schools in Louisiana but the split playoff system came about in Louisiana due to schools like John Curtis and Evangel. Where there is potential for advantage, some will take advantage.  Those that do unfortunately taint the whole group.



And for thread continuity purposes, I did go to the Landers Award voting site and clicked on Cecil's name. It appears you can vote more than once so maybe the voting advantage nominees from larger school have can be offset.     http://katv.com/sports/landers-award

[CoolBreeze]

Maybe not as much with HA, but Arkansas schools like PA and U$C have taken advantage of being located in places where just by odds the chance of having talent walk in the door (invited or not) is greater.  That advantage isn't as great in Searcy but if you were a coach looking for players, would you rather do so at a school that sits in the middle of 300,000 or 30,000 or 3,000 people, especially if you know everybody on your schedule is at a school that sits in the middle of 3,000 people? 

There are a lot of parochial schools in Louisiana but the split playoff system came about in Louisiana due to schools like John Curtis and Evangel. Where there is potential for advantage, some will take advantage.  Those that do unfortunately taint the whole group.

[/quote]
Once again those with their minds made up jump to unwarranted conclusions to shore up their questionable arguments:

Assumption 1: Private schools have access to all athletes in the district/metropolitan area in which they are located. This is not the case. Not all athletes within a given area would be interested in attending a private school, particularly if it has a specific religious affiliation. Moreover, not all athletes families are willing or financially able to pay the necessary tuition. No evidence has been provided that athletic scholarships are given by private schools.

Assumption 2: The success of a few private schools in athletic competition is due to the superiority of the athletes that the are able to obtain. In actuality, it is more related to the character-building and coaching they receive at such institutions.

Assumption 3: That private school coaches look for players in the community. Most, if not all, find players who have been in their schools, or related institutions, since grade school. They do not go outside searching for them. For example most of the players who led HA to three championships in 2012-13 had been together since kindergarten.

Assumption 4: That private schools abuse the system. I have viewed numerous threads in this bulletin board which discussed this topic. I have yet to see any actual evidence of such abuse, at any level. Moreover, this is a 3A thread. Even if PA or some of the larger private schools from NE Arkansas could be shown to have done so, that would be no reason to penalize schools playing in 3A any more than they already have been by being forced to play one class above their actual school size. That would make no more sense than applying sanctions to all schools in the Southeast Conference if, say, the hated LSU were found guilty of recruiting violations.

Furthermore, as I suggested on another thread. It make more sense to try to ban Charleston, than HA and ECS. They have more championships than both private schools combined. Maybe they have an unfair advantage. What population are they drawing from?


In reality, my guess would be that Charleston has no better athletes on average than several other schools in 3A. They just do a better job of utilizing what they have, getting the athletes out for football and training/motivating them to excel. That's real coaching.

[HorseFeathers]

Bleu...maybe we can get open enrollment charter schools involved in this new private school league. You know the fact that they have no district boundaries and FREE tuition seems to give them a distinct advantage wouldn't ya say?

[bleudog]

Once again those with their minds made up jump to unwarranted conclusions to shore up their questionable arguments:

Assumption 1: Private schools have access to all athletes in the district/metropolitan area in which they are located. This is not the case. Not all athletes within a given area would be interested in attending a private school, particularly if it has a specific religious affiliation. Moreover, not all athletes families are willing or financially able to pay the necessary tuition. No evidence has been provided that athletic scholarships are given by private schools.

Assumption 2: The success of a few private schools in athletic competition is due to the superiority of the athletes that the are able to obtain. In actuality, it is more related to the character-building and coaching they receive at such institutions.

Assumption 3: That private school coaches look for players in the community. Most, if not all, find players who have been in their schools, or related institutions, since grade school. They do not go outside searching for them. For example most of the players who led HA to three championships in 2012-13 had been together since kindergarten.

Assumption 4: That private schools abuse the system. I have viewed numerous threads in this bulletin board which discussed this topic. I have yet to see any actual evidence of such abuse, at any level. Moreover, this is a 3A thread. Even if PA or some of the larger private schools from NE Arkansas could be shown to have done so, that would be no reason to penalize schools playing in 3A any more than they already have been by being forced to play one class above their actual school size. That would make no more sense than applying sanctions to all schools in the Southeast Conference if, say, the hated LSU were found guilty of recruiting violations.

Furthermore, as I suggested on another thread. It make more sense to try to ban Charleston, than HA and ECS. They have more championships than both private schools combined. Maybe they have an unfair advantage. What population are they drawing from?


In reality, my guess would be that Charleston has no better athletes on average than several other schools in 3A. They just do a better job of utilizing what they have, getting the athletes out for football and training/motivating them to excel. That's real coaching.

Dang, I didn't mean to fire you up.

My only assumption was that if there are on average X exceptional athletes for every 1,000 people in a given area, there will be more exceptional athletes in a larger population group than in a smaller population group.  That's math and one can't argue with math.  But I do agree that some folks might not feel comfortable in a private school demographic.  And "athletic" or not, I've seen Arkansas private school sites with links to financial aid applications.

Now keep calm and go vote for Cecil.

[bleudog]

Bleu...maybe we can get open enrollment charter schools involved in this new private school league. You know the fact that they have no district boundaries and FREE tuition seems to give them a distinct advantage wouldn't ya say?

The "select" playoff classifications in Louisiana include private, parochial (there are a bunch of Catholic schools around I-10) and charter for the reasons you mentioned.  Most charters do have the no boundary structure but have other documents in their charter applications that define their true geographic "district."   Again, how many folks live within a 10-20 mile radius of the campus?

Now go vote for Cecil.

[Coltfan2005]

I don't see any Colt posters whining about private schools. That HA program is classy and when a young man slipped up (as young men do), his coach handled it correctly and with class. Hats off to HA, private or public.

[State champs 2010]

Your 3a offensive player of the year Cecil Langston! Congrats kid!!

[bleudog]

.........Wouldn't surprise me if @_BONEHEAD_tez_ sent Cecil a congratulatory tweet on CL's accomplishment.........

[CoolBreeze]

Once again those with their minds made up jump to unwarranted conclusions to shore up their questionable arguments:

Assumption 1: Private schools have access to all athletes in the district/metropolitan area in which they are located. This is not the case. Not all athletes within a given area would be interested in attending a private school, particularly if it has a specific religious affiliation. Moreover, not all athletes families are willing or financially able to pay the necessary tuition. No evidence has been provided that athletic scholarships are given by private schools.

Assumption 2: The success of a few private schools in athletic competition is due to the superiority of the athletes that the are able to obtain. In actuality, it is more related to the character-building and coaching they receive at such institutions.

Assumption 3: That private school coaches look for players in the community. Most, if not all, find players who have been in their schools, or related institutions, since grade school. They do not go outside searching for them. For example most of the players who led HA to three championships in 2012-13 had been together since kindergarten.

Assumption 4: That private schools abuse the system. I have viewed numerous threads in this bulletin board which discussed this topic. I have yet to see any actual evidence of such abuse, at any level. Moreover, this is a 3A thread. Even if PA or some of the larger private schools from NE Arkansas could be shown to have done so, that would be no reason to penalize schools playing in 3A any more than they already have been by being forced to play one class above their actual school size. That would make no more sense than applying sanctions to all schools in the Southeast Conference if, say, the hated LSU were found guilty of recruiting violations.

Furthermore, as I suggested on another thread. It make more sense to try to ban Charleston, than HA and ECS. They have more championships than both private schools combined. Maybe they have an unfair advantage. What population are they drawing from?


In reality, my guess would be that Charleston has no better athletes on average than several other schools in 3A. They just do a better job of utilizing what they have, getting the athletes out for football and training/motivating them to excel. That's real coaching.

Dang, I didn't mean to fire you up.

My only assumption was that if there are on average X exceptional athletes for every 1,000 people in a given area, there will be more exceptional athletes in a larger population group than in a smaller population group.  That's math and one can't argue with math.  But I do agree that some folks might not feel comfortable in a private school demographic.  And "athletic" or not, I've seen Arkansas private school sites with links to financial aid applications.

Now keep calm and go vote for Cecil.

Already voted for Cecil.

It is, of course logical that the number of athletes in a larger population will exceed those in a smaller population.

However, it does not follow that a private school in that larger population will necessarily have access to more exceptional athletes that a public school in a smaller population. Many other factors figure in. It also does not follow that the team with the most exceptional, or even the best athletes will be the best team.

Both of the above assumptions are logical fallacies which do not account for numerous other variables.

[pioneers]

What schools are looking at Cecil?

[ISU7]

One thing is a crying shame. Local paper has no mention of Langston or the Colts today in the paper. Cannot believe they wouldn't send someone to cover this game.

Paperman from Osceola was there..

You know who Im talking about lol. For the 2A game in the paper  thi sis what they had.

Mcrory interceptions lead to state title: Headline.

kaigen rogo intercepted 2 passes and Mccrory one state title. He also had blah blah yards as Mccrory defeated rison. And out.

But wrote a good paragraph on Valley View and CPA basketball game. That was basically an empty gym when we left.

Gotcha, so weak. but they want us to buy their papers..lol

[ISU7]

Your 3a offensive player of the year Cecil Langston! Congrats kid!!

Congrats Cecil. Outstanding job.

[Maximus Decimus Meridius]

Congrats to Cecil being named the 3A Off. Player of the Year
Congrats to Head Coach Kelly Chandler on being nominated for 3 Coach of the Year and taking the Colts to their 8th State Championship apperance!
Now when off season starts up, hit those weights and get it done to get back there again next year!

[Paperman]

What schools are looking at Cecil?

He has an offer from Henderson State as of Monday! I suspect there might be others to come!

[CoolBreeze]

With both power and speed, I think he'd be a good fit with Harding University's triple option offense.

[ISU7]

With both power and speed, I think he'd be a good fit with Harding University's triple option offense.

+1

[Paperman]

With both power and speed, I think he'd be a good fit with Harding University's triple option offense.

Agreed! I think Cecil would do well in that offense! Just a tough as nails kid! Great vision and field sense!

[bleudog]

With both power and speed, I think he'd be a good fit with Harding University's triple option offense.

Not to slight the Bison, but why not FBS or at least FCS? 

KD has shown what a player from a small high school has the potential to do at the next level.

[State champs 2010]

With both power and speed, I think he'd be a good fit with Harding University's triple option offense.

Not to slight the Bison, but why not FBS or at least FCS? 

KD has shown what a player from a small high school has the potential to do at the next level.

agreed! I believe if somebody gives this kid a chance he will shine WHEREVER he goes!!!

[ReddieKnightTrojan]

If this kid works as hard in the classroom as he does running the ball, the sky's the limit.